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Old 13-11-2012, 20:39   #91
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Re: Advice

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Originally Posted by belizesailor View Post
This is something to keep in mind as you plan for your dream: Most cruisers do not cruise full time (really...nobody told you that yet?). For example, in the Caribbean most cruisers just cruise when it is not hurricane season (wise choice). So they are typically only on the boat about Dec-June and sometimes less. Then they spend the rest of the year doing something else -- like working (so they can afford to go cruising next season) or traveling. But usually, they spend it AWAY FROM THE F'ING BOAT!
.
Well, that may be true in your neck of the woods, mate, but here in the South Pacific it is not. Unlike the Caribe (where you apparently are based) we have "off season" cruising grounds galore, and many of us do indeed cruise full time.

For instance, it is a very common practice for folks cruising the SPac islands (Societies, Tonga, Fiji, VAnuatu, New Cal, Solomons, etc) to simply head south at the beginning of the cyclone season and then cruise New Zealand, Southern Oz (especially Tasmania), etc. Others duck across the equator and explore the North Pacific Islands.

For those who require a work stop for fiscal reasons, heading to Oz or NZEd offers some chance of employment, although doing so legally requires a work visa which is not always easy to acquire.

Cheers,

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Old 14-11-2012, 09:06   #92
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Re: Advice

Lysander,
Good for you! We're starting a bit later, about 37 years.
I have a very lightly used copy of Twenty Small Boats... for $10+ shipping.
I should have known. The retirement condo w/ sails is very comfortable even when grandkids come to visit!

PM me if you are interested
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Old 14-11-2012, 11:38   #93
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Re: Advice

As far as books go try these, listed in no particular order:

1) John Vigor's -
'The Seaworthy Offshore Sailboat'
2) Don Casey's -
'This Old Boat'
'Complete Illustrated Sailboat Maintenance Manual' (has section on how to pre-survey so you can eliminate obvious &semi-obvious duds before paying a surveyor)
3) Lin & Larry Pardey -
'Self Sufficient Sailor'
'Capable Cruiser'
'Cost Conscous Cruiser'.
4) Annie Hill's -
'Voyaging on a Small income'
5) Beth Leonard's -
'Voyager's Handbook', 2nd Ed.
6) Nigel Calder’s -
'Cruising Handbook'
‘Boatowner's Mechanical and Electrical Manual’
7) Lee Woas' -
'Self-Steering Without a Windvane'
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Old 14-11-2012, 11:44   #94
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Re: Advice

Regarding the difference between liveaboard and cruising:

Liveaboard means that you live on a boat - typically tied to a dock in a marina, but possibly on the hook.

Cruising means that you are traveling on a boat. Cruising implies liveaboard, but not the other way around.

If you only desire to liveaboard, motorboats ("trawlers") or houseboats are larger, cheaper, and more comfortable than a small sailboat. Liveaboards typically have jobs on land. The chief benefit appears to be that you get a coastal lifestyle without the costs of coastal housing.

Cruising is more complex, and expensive, and requires substantial financial resources because it implies the ability to move from place to place. You can do that on a trawler, but it takes fuel to do so, so a trawler might be a superior choice if you plan to move in a limited range, and if you want to stay in a single location for extended periods.

If you plan to be on the move constantly, you need a sailboat because it doesn't require fuel - most of the time. But sailboats are very expensive. The sailing rig is structurally complex and requires the highest quality components available to withstand constant use.

I think your dream and your vision are on track, but that you are presently in a state of delusion about the costs. DON'T LET THAT BOTHER YOU. It happens to plenty of people, including me. What land-dwellers don't get about boats is that they deteriorate very rapidly - much faster than a house on shore - and that the cost of keeping a sailboat in serviceable condition keeps the cost of cruising quite high, even if you are otherwise most living off the land.

You can't trade fish and coconuts for sailboat parts
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Old 14-11-2012, 11:52   #95
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Re: Advice

with that budget, your time cruising will be limited. Still, if you keep your boat simple and do it "the old way" without a lot of today's modern cruising aids, you might get a couple years cruising in and will have learned alot about if you want to do it again. You need a good old boat that is solid and you can get cheap. That's a difficult task sometimes. Try to focus on a boat with a fiberglass enclosed keel as opposed to a bolt on keel, with a good running diesel.
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Old 14-11-2012, 12:31   #96
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Re: Advice

Everyone,

Thank you for your advice. I have not been able to reply to all of you, but I am trying to absorb everything that you have written. My wife and I will definitely be taking all of this to heart, and we still have plenty of time to prepare. Our lease won't be done until 6 months from now, which means we have a lot of time to read, practice, and think things over before we decide on the next place to move in order to make this a reality.

I will definitely be staying in touch to let you know how things go. Also, this won't be the last time that I will need your advice

Again, this is all greatly appreciated.
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Old 14-11-2012, 12:59   #97
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Re: Advice

You are obviously genuine, and being young still have the conviction that you can do it your way. Which quite possibly you can, & live close to the edge (financially) and emerse yourself in your dream immediately.
The older folk here, most ain't in that space & wish they were. We just don't have the
fortitude to put up with the inconviences & lack of options this kind of an adventure entails. Including being wet & seasick for days on end.
More funds = more comfort, not to mention more safety, more options to
minimise "wet & seasick" for days on end & more chance to make the adventure one which may last forever..

My suggestion is this: Look for a coastal town/city that has work for you both with strong yachting community. Advertise your situation & your dream
that you would like learn all there is to know about sailboats & maintenance
& that you would be prepared to help with the labour on someones boat in return. An older couple that still want to keep sailing, but are having trouble with labour in maintaining their boat may jump at the offer to pass on their skills for your help. Obviously you are gonna have to "vet" the the candidate, just as they will you.
Actively seek out a mentor that has years of experience. Sailboat people are gregarious and very helpful in the main, I have found.

Also clock in at a yacht club with a strong Weds can racing program with lots of people your age. The curve is steep, (ours take ANYBODY-except maybe the hydraphobic)
but you get there fast! Then there is blue water.
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Old 15-11-2012, 03:37   #98
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Re: Advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by lateral View Post
You are obviously genuine, and being young still have the conviction that you can do it your way. Which quite possibly you can, & live close to the edge (financially) and emerse yourself in your dream immediately.
The older folk here, most ain't in that space & wish they were. We just don't have the
fortitude to put up with the inconviences & lack of options this kind of an adventure entails. Including being wet & seasick for days on end.
More funds = more comfort, not to mention more safety, more options to
minimise "wet & seasick" for days on end & more chance to make the adventure one which may last forever..

My suggestion is this: Look for a coastal town/city that has work for you both with strong yachting community. Advertise your situation & your dream
that you would like learn all there is to know about sailboats & maintenance
& that you would be prepared to help with the labour on someones boat in return. An older couple that still want to keep sailing, but are having trouble with labour in maintaining their boat may jump at the offer to pass on their skills for your help. Obviously you are gonna have to "vet" the the candidate, just as they will you.
Actively seek out a mentor that has years of experience. Sailboat people are gregarious and very helpful in the main, I have found.

Also clock in at a yacht club with a strong Weds can racing program with lots of people your age. The curve is steep, (ours take ANYBODY-except maybe the hydraphobic)
but you get there fast! Then there is blue water.
I think this is very good advice.
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Old 29-11-2012, 04:21   #99
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Re: Advice

Gudday Lysander and welcome to the forum.
As I write this I am bracing myself for the massive amounts of crap I am probably going to get from the other sailors on here but this is from my personal experience. It might sound a bit ridiculous at first blush but hear me out. If you don't know anything about sailing and you're not going to be able to start sailing lessons just yet, there's two things you can do to start educating yourself.

1) Watch videos about sailing. There are hundreds of them and although they cannot replace real life experience, they can at least teach you the terminology. Understanding what your sailing teacher is saying to you will help you a LOT when you have your first lessons.

2) Play sailing games. I actually cringed a little when I typed that because I am expecting death threats and hate mail but I stand by it. Some of these games and simulators are pretty good for teaching you about the THEORY of how wind works on your boat. If you don't know anything, then any information you can absorb will be beneficial to helping you achieve your goals.
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Old 29-11-2012, 08:02   #100
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Re: Advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by SayGudday View Post
Gudday Lysander and welcome to the forum.
As I write this I am bracing myself for the massive amounts of crap I am probably going to get from the other sailors on here but this is from my personal experience. It might sound a bit ridiculous at first blush but hear me out. If you don't know anything about sailing and you're not going to be able to start sailing lessons just yet, there's two things you can do to start educating yourself.

1) Watch videos about sailing. There are hundreds of them and although they cannot replace real life experience, they can at least teach you the terminology. Understanding what your sailing teacher is saying to you will help you a LOT when you have your first lessons.

2) Play sailing games. I actually cringed a little when I typed that because I am expecting death threats and hate mail but I stand by it. Some of these games and simulators are pretty good for teaching you about the THEORY of how wind works on your boat. If you don't know anything, then any information you can absorb will be beneficial to helping you achieve your goals.
Absolutely nothing wrong with the suggestions.
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Old 29-11-2012, 10:36   #101
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Thumbs up Re: Advice

Lysander, go for it. Many of the other posters are right about your limited skillset as it pertains to sailboats. mechanical, electrical, rigging, plumbing, sewing, etc... All are needed. My advice to you is buy a smaller boat 22-28 foot that is in need of repair but has all of the parts to include sails. One should be easy to find for less than $1000. Buy a book like Don Casey's Sailboat Maintenance and fix it your self. Doing it yourself will leverage your quick learning abilty. I've done it twice. First boat was a 22 that need some cosmetic work and I learned to sail her and sew. Second boat is a 26' that was a total resortoration. Stripped to the bare hull and rebuilt from new materials. The 26' cost me $750 and then another $8,000 in materials, tools, and supplies. Was it worth it? Absolutely! There is not much that I can't fix on a boat and she is tougher then the dayshe was laid down 39 years ago.
Once you've fixed the boat, sail it in protected waters. The you can sell it. You wont make a profit. But it's about the learning.


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Old 01-12-2012, 20:07   #102
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Re: Advice

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Thanks for the response!

1. We both have bachelors degrees, but of course that doesn't really help us to take care of a boat.

We are both very eager learners. We were very good students in college. I was an Honors student, I minored in Spanish (I speak Swedish fluently), but beyond that I am horribly white collar. This is something which I desperately wish to change.

2. In the last 12 months, we have been working as Petroleum Landmen. We have both hated the job though, however we have been able to earn a lot of money. We are very frugal, and are able to put away an average of 600-800 a week, depending on the level of work we have. But we are leaving that job for now. So in the short term, we will not have that type of income (But we will not be needing to touch our savings).

3. In terms of roughing it, I don't think either of us are expecting a lot of luxuries. We have no desire for such things.

We both have an extremely strong work ethic, but we want to live a life that allows us to have more time than money. There are many things in this life which I have realized are more valuable to me, like staying healthy, painting, learning music, reading, writing, etc.

In my current (soon former) capacity, I have not been able to devote any time to these things, since all of it is consumed by sitting in a poorly lit office churning out reports.
Get a job fixing boats :-)
It's worked for me. I now know more about bilges than I ever wanted to. Also just discovered today that I'm allergic to bottom paint.

A strong work ethic is good, but knowing how to approach a problem helps a lot too, if nothing else, it makes it easier to talk to the people who might doing some of the work.

For example, I put a new set of new windows in a Catalina 27. Total parts costs were under 700$.

The plexi for the windows cost less than 200$
The window job cost about 2000$.

EDIT: Not to say I got paid that much(I wish) but shop rate, plus dock fees etc all add up.
Getting paid to learn is a very good way to go. Especially if you haven't got a background of working with your hands.
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Old 08-12-2012, 12:09   #103
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Re: Advice

HI Lysander,

Lots of info on here. I read most of the responses, but didn't get to them all, so I am not sure if this has been suggested.

It seems like you are pretty intent on sailing. We are interested in sailing, but want to get some experience before buying a boat and taking off. The good thing is we live in Fort Lauderdale where it is a pretty big deal around here. My thoughts are this. Move to the Miami / Fort Lauderdale area. Get some jobs and start hanging around the bars on the water (I could give you some suggestions if you need). We started meeting people that like to go out and like the company. I have already visited some brokers and have seen a lot of boats. Then when you get your boat taken care of and get some experience -take off.

Plus you can't beat the weather.

Let me know if you need some advice on moving here if you ever decided to do so.

Ciao
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Old 08-12-2012, 18:24   #104
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Re: Advice

No one mentioned this thread yet.

Cruising on $500 per Month . . .

If you can ignore some of it there is some good info on being frugal. It does not seem easy, though you are young.

Quote:

Lateral said: You are obviously genuine, and being young still have the conviction that you can do it your way. Which quite possibly you can, & live close to the edge (financially) and emerse yourself in your dream immediately.
The older folk here, most ain't in that space & wish they were. We just don't have the
fortitude to put up with the inconviences & lack of options this kind of an adventure entails. Including being wet & seasick for days on end.
More funds = more comfort, not to mention more safety, more options to
minimise "wet & seasick" for days on end & more chance to make the adventure one which may last forever..

I fit the "older folk" here because I did not have the guts to "just leave" (which entails an awful lot really) when I was "young".
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Old 09-12-2012, 22:45   #105
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Re: Advice

I'm sure this has been quoted maybe even in this thread.

Sterling Hayden
To be truly challenging, a voyage, like a life, must rest on a firm foundation of financial unrest. Otherwise, you are doomed to a routine traverse, the kind known to yachtsmen who play with their boats at sea... "cruising" it is called. Voyaging belongs to seamen, and to the wanderers of the world who cannot, or will not, fit in. If you are contemplating a voyage and you have the means, abandon the venture until your fortunes change. Only then will you know what the sea is all about.
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