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Old 25-11-2013, 23:15   #16
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Boat: 1978 Yorktown 35
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Sorry for the seemingly stupid questions, I'm still trying to get used to the language.

I know Bungee cords, lol. I use them regularly to attach stuff to my motorcycle. But thank you for the advice, I'll get a hold of some more for the boat. I don't need extra costs if I can prevent them.
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Old 26-11-2013, 08:03   #17
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Re: A new adventure

From the pictures the inboard track position doesn't concern me, apparently the last owner did that to point up higher going to wind. I would however like to see a longer track there for two reasons, coming back further to allow sheet angle adjustment for larger headsails which it seems you have and more forward to allow proper sheeting angles for the storm jib you say you have. The track on it is pretty standard stuff, if you talk to whomever you buy the genoa cars from I'm sure they can supply you with the right track to extend it, you might even want to send them pictures so they can advise on the length you need to get the most flexibility in trimming. With luck they can supply track with the same bolt centers so you can use the existing holes to bolt through and only have to drill a few additional holes through the deck.
Another concern is the lack of sealant under that track, I didn't see any signs of any sealant under the existing track, that's not good, it means the holes through the deck are leaking into the deck itself and into the interior, water in the deck is bad and can cause a lot of damage to the integrity of the deck structure, at the least you need to pull up the track and seal it, whether you decide to replace it or not.
The mainsheet traveler car and track seem to be in decent shape but the blocks are definitely toast and are damaging the mainsheet, there easily replaced, again, talk to whomever your purchasing the hardware from on their recommendation on the proper purchase mainsheet for the size of your sail to minimize the effort required to trim it. When you see how much decent line that size costs new you'll realize how cheap the replacement blocks are in the long run.
Seeing the state of the running rigging makes me a bit suspicious of the state of other systems on the boat, it looks abused and not well maintained, you may want to go through the boat to make sure there aren't any safety issues elsewhere. Inspect the through hulls and any hose connections to them, if the hoses look aged replace them, the rest of the stuff can be fixed over time as money allows, that gets much more costly if the boat sinks before you get the chance.
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Old 26-11-2013, 08:22   #18
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Re: A new adventure

There's also a really good marine consignment shop in your area, now if I could just remember the name.....Damn, and I've been there before, I'll have to Google it. If your low for bucks consignment stores can be a huge resource. It's near Newport Beach. Used to have a lot of really good stuff when there were more boat builders were in SoCal, not sure how the selection is these days since many have moved to cheaper locales.
Minney's Yacht Surplus in Newport beach is one, Good Old Boat magazine also has a listing of good Marine Consignment stores nationwide, many of which I've patronized over the years. Give them a try, you might be surprised at what you find. Just be careful when inspecting used rigging parts, you don't want to buy something that is close to the end of it's effective stress life.
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Old 26-11-2013, 08:58   #19
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Re: A new adventure

Congratulations on your new boat. "Sailing for Dummies" is a very good book. This might help, too: The West Advisor: West Advisor Articles
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Old 26-11-2013, 11:35   #20
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I am not overly worried about the condition of the rest of the boat, I had a surveyor inspected it and the only real problem it has is a rusted shut thru hull. I believe it was for the sink, and I am going to fix that when I haul it out to paint the bottom. The po is a boat mechanic but not a sailor, he motored around mostly so I'm not overly surprised that some of the rigging hasn't been inspected in some time. I do know that the standing rigging is in good shape tho.

As for the sealant, do I just go find a sealant at a marine store or is there something more specific I am looking for? When I go down there again I'll walk the whole boat and check for any other holes that need to be sealed.

As for the track, is it essential to extend it right off the bat or can I leave that for a later project? From best I can tell the rest of the rigging is in decent shape. Any idea on what I am looking for when it comes to the blocks? How do I know if one is too small or too big for what my boat requires? I have seen information on blocks talking about sail area and safe working load, I'm not sure what the sail area of my boat is nor what type of load would be exerted. How can I figure this out?
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Old 26-11-2013, 14:33   #21
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Re: A new adventure

Go to Sailboatdata.com to find spec on your YORKTOWN 35. Fore triangle is about 250 sq feet. Happy sailing

I am assuming you have a Yorktown 35 not a Yortown 35... if so you might want to change your boat type in your avatar area..
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Old 26-11-2013, 19:44   #22
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Lol, I'll fix that typo. The specs on sailboatdata are wrong on some of the stats so I'm not sure how accurate they are on the sails. In my meet and greet post I pointed out some of the differences and most Yorktowns are different from others even if only slightly
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Old 26-11-2013, 21:03   #23
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Re: A new adventure

OK, last things first - loop for the bottom corner of the genoa next to the stanchion? I think you mean at the bow, which would be called the tack point. Not sure what you mean by a loop - a padeye maybe? If so, a simple shackle would normally be used to secure the sail there.
The worn-out sheaves for the mainsheet probably need to be replaced entirely (welcome to boat ownership). Unfortunately you didn't include a picture of the rigging on the boom, but you should probably replace what's there as well. Instead of the side-by-side blocks you have now, it's usually better to have what are called fiddle blocks, which are 2 blocks mounted in-line and have less of a tendency to twist under tension. Since the end of the mainsheet is attached to the block you have pictured, you would need what's called a fiddle block with a becket, or attachment point.
As far as the genoa tracks, without the sail hoisted and the clew (back corner of the sail) visible in the picture, it's impossible to say if the tracks are in the right position. If you can use the tracks, Garhauer should be able to supply car-mounted blocks for not too much $$. If you can afford a little extra, the line adjustible cars mentioned above are a nice upgrade, and Garhauer makes a very nice set of those also.
I heartily agree with the advice about getting the weathercloths off the bow. You can't imagine how much force a wave coming on deck has.
And one more thing - you said you had some sailing experience, but your vocabulary doesn't seem to reflect it. Not trying to sound elitist here, but certain boat parts have specific names just to avoid confusion when talking about them. Sometimes it's hard for us (or me, anyway) to figure out exactly what you're talking about. I'm sure somewhere on the web there are pictures of boats with labels for the different parts. Just a little suggestion.
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Old 26-11-2013, 21:38   #24
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Re: A new adventure

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyinace1 View Post
I also realized there doesn't seem to be a way to tie down the bottom of the genoa (the bottom corner next to the stantion), but I'm pretty sure that there is supposed to be since there is a loop at there.
i don't wish to appear to be a know-it-all or a naysayer, but having read the above sentence in your post i'm thinking that you really don't have a clue.

i suggest that you start by enrolling in a sunfish sailing class and picking up a couple of basic books on sailing, rigging, cruising, and other related subjects. there really is a whole lot of stuff to learn and it's always best to begin at the beginning...
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Old 26-11-2013, 22:29   #25
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Re: A new adventure

Answer to one of your questions regarding bedding on the track. The track itself does not need bedding, only the bolts that hold it in place and if the job was done well it is not necessary for you to see excess bedding coming from the bottom of the track. If your concerned open up the headliner and inspect the bolts to see if there has been any water leaking, if not then leave it for another time and concentrate on the bigger jobs.
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Old 26-11-2013, 23:22   #26
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Re: A new adventure

So far in this thread I've read a collection of consistently bad advice to a new sailor. You people are absolutely bonkers who are worrying him about bedding and canvas and changing tracks. You are worthless armchair nit-pickers, looking for something to criticize in one small photo when you haven't even inspected the boat or seen if there are any signs of water intrusion. Such a problem may not exist, and if it did the OPs surveyor probably would have mentioned it and given advice.

The OP needs to focus on just understanding the boat and how to use what he has. Not only that, the "experienced" person at his dock who told him the track is in the wrong position couldn't possibly know that unless the sail was hoisted and unfurled, with sheets led to the cars so he could see how the sail set. Obviously that hasn't happened yet.

So this is about assembly and operation we're not at the stage of remediation or customization.


So Flyinace, here's the real deal:
  1. Try to contact the prior owner if possible, and ask all your questions.
  2. If not possible to speak to the prior owner, ask a local sail loft if they'll help you mount your sails and assess their condition. Sail lofts are operated by racers and even the sales staff will be very knowledgeable. They'll charge you a few hundred dollars (or maybe do it free to establish a relationship and new future customer) and you'll get information that's worth paying for. Not like this free online advice that's worthless.
  3. Do NOT relocate your tracks before you've sailed the boat with the sails you bought and know it well. Don't worry about bedding unless your deck is leaking. Take one step at a time.
  4. The sailmaker might recommend a local rigger, if you need that type of help. You mentioned you like to do things yourself to save money, so tell the sailmaker that and ask his advice about what to shop for. Ask him for positioning advice, and mark the deck if he suggests changes. Then read do-it-yourself advice about how to install those things.
Welcome to this forum and congrats about your new boat.
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Old 27-11-2013, 01:06   #27
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Re: A new adventure

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandy stone View Post
"loop for the bottom corner of the genoa next to the stanchion? I think you mean at the bow, which would be called the tack point. Not sure what you mean by a loop - a padeye maybe? If so, a simple shackle would normally be used to secure the sail there."
That's exactly what I was talking about So a shackle through the padeye and connects to what?

"The worn-out sheaves for the mainsheet probably need to be replaced entirely...Instead of the side-by-side blocks you have now, it's usually better to have what are called fiddle blocks, which are 2 blocks mounted in-line and have less of a tendency to twist under tension. Since the end of the mainsheet is attached to the block you have pictured, you would need what's called a fiddle block with a becket"
Thank you for the tidbit about the fiddle block, I will certainly ask about those when I talk to Garhauer. As for the rest of the rigging it seems to be in decent condition and that's good enough for me right now. I'll upgrade later when I can.
Quote:
Originally Posted by onestepcsy37 View Post
i don't wish to appear to be a know-it-all or a naysayer, but having read the above sentence in your post i'm thinking that you really don't have a clue.
Read it again and you'll see I do have a clue, I realized something was missing and had a good idea what, just not how to fix the problem. I also don't remember much of the vocab since I haven't used what I did know in 5 or 6 years but I'm learning. Don't judge but do feel free to offer some advice
Quote:
Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
Answer to one of your questions regarding bedding on the track. The track itself does not need bedding, only the bolts that hold it in place and if the job was done well it is not necessary for you to see excess bedding coming from the bottom of the track. If your concerned open up the headliner and inspect the bolts to see if there has been any water leaking, if not then leave it for another time and concentrate on the bigger jobs.
No leaks, so I'll assume all is well for the time being. Thank you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SailFastTri View Post
So far in this thread I've read a collection of consistently bad advice to a new sailor. You people are absolutely bonkers who are worrying him about bedding and canvas and changing tracks. You are worthless armchair nit-pickers, looking for something to criticize in one small photo when you haven't even inspected the boat or seen if there are any signs of water intrusion. Such a problem may not exist, and if it did the OPs surveyor probably would have mentioned it and given advice.

The OP needs to focus on just understanding the boat and how to use what he has. Not only that, the "experienced" person at his dock who told him the track is in the wrong position couldn't possibly know that unless the sail was hoisted and unfurled, with sheets led to the cars so he could see how the sail set. Obviously that hasn't happened yet.
Actually the experienced sailor did see the genny up and was pulling it back by the sheet to show my approximately where it should go. I raised both the genoa and the storm jib to get an idea of what I had, that is also when I realized the blocks were missing and not just stored somewhere on the boat.

So this is about assembly and operation we're not at the stage of remediation or customization.
Spot on


So Flyinace, here's the real deal:
  1. Try to contact the prior owner if possible, and ask all your questions. He wasn't much of a sailor and I've had problems when it comes to dealing with him, sorry but pass
  2. If not possible to speak to the prior owner, ask a local sail loft if they'll help you mount your sails and assess their condition. Sail lofts are operated by racers and even the sales staff will be very knowledgeable. They'll charge you a few hundred dollars (or maybe do it free to establish a relationship and new future customer) and you'll get information that's worth paying for. Not like this free online advice that's worthless. I'll see if I can find someone around but I like to get information from multiple different sources, so I'll be back
  3. Do NOT relocate your tracks before you've sailed the boat with the sails you bought and know it well. Don't worry about bedding unless your deck is leaking. Take one step at a time. Ok
  4. The sailmaker might recommend a local rigger, if you need that type of help. You mentioned you like to do things yourself to save money, so tell the sailmaker that and ask his advice about what to shop for. Ask him for positioning advice, and mark the deck if he suggests changes. Then read do-it-yourself advice about how to install those things. Any suggestions on good DIY advice/books/articles etc?
Welcome to this forum and congrats about your new boat.
Thanx
For those of you questioning my experience, or lack thereof based on my vocab, remember that just like anything, being able to speak about something and being able to do it are 2 different things. I haven't done anything with sailboats in about 6 years nor have I had anyone to talk about boats with so stuff fades. Do not take that as me exagerating my experience, during high school I owned an 80's 15' West Wight Potter. My friend and I bought it for $400 from an elderly man who hadn't touched it in 20 years and we cleaned it up and sailed it. I also took a multi day sailing class that had us on boats up to 25 ft. I was one of the better sailors in the class, along with another kid. Mind you, all this experience was in the Port of Long Beach and San Diego Bay meaning I have never been on a sailboat in open water. My Yorkie is way bigger than anything I have piloted before, including my friend's fishing boats, of which the largest was 26 ft.

My experience with setting up rigging is minimal at best and repair work on board is about the same but from power boats, not sailboats. I am trying to learn the language and have been looking at diagrams and doing a ton of research, not just posting here. When I don't know what something is called I describe it as best as I can. Mind you in this day and age of smart phones, I'm not always on a computer where I can quickly flip to a diagram, but when you guys give a name to an object I keep it in mind for next time.

If you want to evaluate or bag on my experience just do me a favor and keep it to yourself, I know what I'm capable of and what I'm not. I'm aware I have a lot to learn and there is still a lot I don't even know that I don't know. On the other hand, you only know what I have told you and have never seen me in action or even know much about me.

Thank you



ps. I'll certainly have more questions for ya'll, probably by tomorrow since I'm gonna give Garhauer a call
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Old 27-11-2013, 07:58   #28
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Re: A new adventure

Don't worry about the lingo, it'll come to you as you spend more time working on your boat. Unfortunately over the years I've learned the names of things I never wanted to, as long as your able to explain what your asking about to the people your working with I wouldn't stress it too much.
If you talk to a supplier about the what your trying to do they should be able to advise you on what size cars you need, they do it all the time and are pretty familiar with the appropriate sizing for the application.
Were there many models of this boat made? If not they would at least know which questions to ask to help you determine the size needed. I've found most suppliers to be genuinely interested in giving good info to help me in my decisions this way, they want you to be satisfied with their product and come back. The information I've been given in some of the stores was not as good, try calling the hardware manufacturers tech support line first, most have knowledgeable people interested in stearing you in the right direction.
Hey, if you want to toss around nautical terms there's books for that. Can you say floatsam and jetsam? Oiy.
Take a picture of the bow area near the forestay and post it, I'm sure there are enough experienced people here who could figure out what you have and help out. Does it have a roller furling?
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Old 27-11-2013, 08:27   #29
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Re: A new adventure

If you call Garhuaer you'll get good support, it's still a small enough family owned company that you'll probably get a family member on the phone, nothing will get you better support than talking to someone who has a direct stake in the company and it's products. Bid enough to make good gear but small enough to have good customer support.
I used to belong to a large yacht club, many people in blue blazers and boat shoes, they tossed around lot's of nautical terms, then I found out half of them never owned a boat, go figure. Now I belong to a small local yacht club where everyone has a boat, they don't care what you call it, they'll help you out anyway, because they all love to sail.
Let's see, what was the qualification for joining, oh yeah, you needed to be vetted by two members in good standing, or two members who could stand....
When working in the boatyard many of the members were happy to help and offer advice, that's how I first was introduced to the club, I do the same myself, it helps those getting into the sport/ pastime to get the knowledge and confidence they need, it also means they may actually continue to sail long after.
Hope your experience here is the same. No matter how long you've been on the water (over 40 years for me) you never stop learning, that's the best part, it still stays interesting after many years.
Now if I could just get that genset problem figured out........
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Old 27-11-2013, 15:03   #30
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Re: A new adventure

The genoa should have a grommet hole at the front bottom corner you can attach a shackle to, or in sailor-speak a tack cringle. Like I said, not trying to be elitist, but trying to promote good communication. Sometimes nautical terms, specifically applied to sailing gear, afford a level of precision unavailable in regular language. I don't care if you say 'galley' or 'kitchen', or 'head' or 'toilet', but I think 'tack cringle' is better than 'grommet hole in the front bottom corner of the sail'.
By the way, OP, you said you had the sail hoisted when your dock visitor was showing you about where the sheet lead should fall? How did that work if the sail wasn't attached at the bow?
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