65' MacGregor Sailboat

[First Mate]

Originally Posted by CharlieCobra

I don't know if that's Joss, renamed Sceptre, renamed Longfellow or not. If she has a sugar scoop and a fin keel with bulb, it's Joss, who held the Newport to Ensenada record for over 30 years until a 100' Maxi broke it in '09 (I think). I haven't been down to see this one....

I think the pics on the ad indicate the keel you describe. If my memory serves me, it has a sugar scoop stern.

[CharlieCobra]

If so, she's the only one with that keel mod that I know of, hence her ability to go to windward like a freight train...

[First Mate]

Originally Posted by CharlieCobra

If so, she's the only one with that keel mod that I know of, hence her ability to go to windward like a freight train...

1984 65' Macgregor Cutter Out of the water photo

here is a pic of her out of the water and on the hard.

she has a bulb on her keel but has no sugar scoop

so why is she still for sale?

[CharlieCobra]

Ok, that's not Joss. Joss had a four foot suger scoop and a newer keel design featuring a foil and bulb arrangement. The early "racing" M65's go for much less than the pilothouse versions. European's apparently LOVE the pilothouse Mac's. When ya do a search, almost all are in the Med and 200K or better. Pretty good value considering they were 130-165K new....

[sailorjazz]

There seems to be alot of skepticism about this boat, especially the earlier versions without the pilothouse. I looked seriously at Scepter/Joss in 2007, determined how much it would take to refit and made an offer that was refused. Sometimes when you lose you win and Boy was I lucky not to get that tired and used early 80's boat after later finding a much better condition pilothouse model, which I also believe are much better construction with the extra 10,000 lbs of fiberglass. Still the later models are very light displacement and A tall mast is not needed on the easily driven hulls, and with governing clearance in most waterways at 75 feet a tall stick will keep you on the wrong side of many fixed bridges or powerlines. The short mast at 68 feet off the water is plenty and I have broached twice with that as a testiment to plenty of sail plan. I got an asymeterical spinnaker which takes 4 crew to fly. The 130 Genoa on the furler is easier to use, but still is a bear to get in when the wind picks up, sailing off the wind makes for easier retrieval.

Several objective articles have been written>

MacGregor 65 Review: Fast Racing Sled « Jordan Yacht Brokerage

Review Of The MacGregor 65 Sailboat

I looked at alot of boats before puchasing an early 1990 pilothouse version that has the engine in the middle slightly off center to starboard. This makes for loud motoring in the main cabin but better overall center of gravity and excellent access to the engine from almost all sides, as well as the extra room in the aft cabin for installation of a watermaker and alot of extra house batteries, as well as home for the desiel generator. I sailed this boat all over the Pacific NW and from Seattle to Hawaii, all over Hawaii and back and trust my life to this sailboat. Confirming it is a bit tender to windward in that one should not carry too much sail and reef early, I have broached the boat twice with the mast almost parallel to the water, but thats as far as she goes and the yacht just skids on its side and then rounds up into the wind, fairly idiot proof. Of course in variable/rough conditions one should keep the windows and hatch closed just in case of taking on green water. It actually goes faster to windward with less sail in higher wind conditions anyway and due to the narrow beam it will heal 25-30*. We found in days of windward beating from Hawaii that although it would pinch to 30 degrees off the wind, the main factor is the pounding into waves, slowing the boat and/or falling off the other sides off waves and banging etc. falling off to a more comfortable 45* course made for better entry into waves and far less pounding and increased boat speed. The wind direction would vary anyway so what windward ground we gave up on one day we would more than make up in distance over ground. This is more an offshore sailing tactic then particular to this boat, although the fine bow and hull entry really does reduce windward pounding and the length helps with hobby horsing. Much better than the Beneteau 43 I had previously. I had a good heavy duty offshore staysail made which is the main workhorse on this boat, one can sail 360* on just the staysail if necessary which is also self tacking on the traveler fore the mast.
My previous boat was a 43' Beneteau Oceanis whihc was too beamy for open ocean conditions, higher freeboard and center of gravity and hobby horsed, although comfortable and roomy in the cabin and nice wordwork. The only other boat I considered was a Hunter 54, but I think the 65 Macgregor is a way better sailboat in the 200k price range.

[s/v Sunsets]

SailorJazz-- you and I are on the same page. She's a nice ride. While I've only had one long off-shore sailing passage on my Sunsets, I experienced much of what you talk about. And we made it from Virginia to the Virgin Islands in just 7 days averaging 10 knots. Not too shabby. We'll see if she and Mother Nature can make that happen again on the return trip next week. Stay tuned!!

[sailorjazz]

My next major trip is Seattle to Marqueses in summer 2011, let me know if interested in crewing and visa/versa. We both know the boat well

[s/v Sunsets]

Well, we're in the swimming pool business, so summer excursions aren't usually part of the plan. But if you're still looking for someone in the winter.... We should keep in touch. Send me a PM with your email and I'll do the same.

[rtbates]

Thoughts? It's a MacGregor, and that isn't good...

[Seahunter]

A great boat for virtual sailors and it looks great while tied up to it's expensive 80' end-tie slip.

[CharlieCobra]

I'm always amazed at comments on boats because of their name by folks who've likely never been closer to one than dockside....

The earlier Macs were decent boats, light but decent. They were built for a niche market and Roger sold a lot of them. The boats eveybody associates with the Macgregor name are the 26M/X series boats, which are hybrids targeted for a specific market.

[Amgine]

Originally Posted by CharlieCobra

I'm always amazed at comments on boats because of their name by folks who've likely never been closer to one than dockside....

<humph> What would you rather? no one used their earned wisdom when asked for input?

I've never sailed a Mac, though I dreamt about the 65' for many years. It's a decent boat for its designed application; never said otherwise. An early model was probably not primarily designed for cruising, else they wouldn't have 'beefed up' the design in later editions. Clearly CFers who comment that fitting backing plates seemed undersized were not casual dock strollers: they searched out those plates and examined them, compared them to their personal standards, and gave their opinion.

If I hadn't followed this thread since its inception I wouldn't have known about the beefier pilothouse editions, which have been fueling more than a few fantasies since discovering them. Thank goodness people jumped in to point out the various options where others were mistaken or less-informed!

[CharlieCobra]

The pilothouse boats are interesting. Kind off a Pirini Navi look. That's where the infamous M26 got it's look from.

[s/v Sunsets]

FYI: Just finished our 1200+ mile passage from BVIs to Virginia in just over 7 days. Boat seemed to handle well, even in 50kt winds during a storm. Wouldn't want to test any boat repeatedly in those conditions, but we weren't as worried when the second storm came through. She took good care of us.

[PAR]

Of the "opinions" here about the Mac 65, how many have sailed one? I've sailed a few and now own an early one. There's no oil canning, the tabs are all in place, the rudder tube does need to be replaced, but after a quarter of a century, some things have to be expected. The ports and a lot of the accommodation fittings were lower quality, but most still function. She's held up well considering the first decade of her life was a hard one.

She goes to windward well, if wet and rough when pushed hard. She does need to be "managed" upwind as she's a bit tender compared to other designs, but with this in mind, she not going to be beaten by anything of her age of comparable length except strict racers. Down wind she's fun, but again she needs managing, though not nearly the issue as upwind.

Considering what she is, I purchased her looking to make major changes and revisions, mostly because I stole her from a desperately ill owner and can afford the make huge swings at this old girl.

I'm on the east coast of Florida, near Daytona. Anyone with a 55' to 70' whatever, that wants an up hill or off wind butt whipping I'll be glad to show them how wrong they are about the Mac 65. Bring a bottle of something to graciously lose with.

Yep, this boat has some issues, but any large 25 year old yacht, that's seen the life this one has, particularly the last several inactive years will.