45-50 ft. Bluewater with a bright interior?

[Dogscout]

I agree with the OP. I spent a lot of years managing design engineers that built things the way they always were built, and it drove me nuts that so many ignore new technologies. I have sailed my whole life on many different older boats but now I too am shopping for a boat and while I do not have the budget for a new 45 footer, I am looking at 5 - 10 year olds. A bluewater boat does not have to be dark, cramped, and smell like wee. GRP enclosed steel frames, epoxy outer layers, large lexan portlights and modern engineered surface materials other than wood are great things. Embrace technology. or you can sit in the dark oblivious to evolution.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by EricSmith

Just a couple of thoughts.
>The Jeanneau 490 you were considered is, in fact, a Category A offshore cruiser.
>Displacement at this stage of boat evolution is not the measure of an offshore boat's suitability for it's purpose. If that were the case, airplanes would still be made of spruce and plywood.
>I haven't seen as a part of your discussion what percent of your time will be spent making passages and what percent in port or at anchor? Weighing the factors of brightness and ease of getting around--the boats, the beds and everything else takes on more meaning when you give fair weight to the time you will be stationary rather than on passage. Painting the boat white, doesn't get it done. Light colors, sure, but windows in the coach roof and hull that give viewing out also must weigh into the decision.
>Personally, as all the press is saying, Jeanneau is really on to something here. There has never been a boat with some of these innovative ideas--such east to get around with inclined side decks that lead directly into upright entry into the cockpit, etc. All of this is capped with exceptional room and stability (thanks to the modern use of hard chines that create both more volume inside, and stability in higher wind ranges, and twin rudders which makes steering at all angles of heel a fingertip control issue.

The video offers a detailed walk through, not just romantic clips.

The term Bluewater is the problem here. Many still think full keel , twin masts , 2 inch thick hull with blisters built in etc etc. The reality is modern boats are safely crossing oceans everyday, fin keels, spade rudders, inmast furling and catamarans , im yet to see evidence that suggests they arent blue water.

It will be interesting to see whats considered bluewater in 20-30 years.

[Wings888]

Might be too small for the kids but the Outbound 46 is a great offshore boat with lots of light below.

[Normanskier]

Hi, I share your thought on boat interiors. Do a google search for Herreschoff Interiors for boats. combines wood and white paint/plastic laminate.

Good luck.

Norman

[visionatsea]

Take a look at the Taswell 49 and larger. They are exceptional cruising boats. They were built by Ta shing, who also builds Nordhaven. While the Taswell line is no longer being produced, used ones are generally on the market. They are Water boats">blue water boats that are fast, overengineered, luxurious and reliable.

[Ivanvet]

Have a look at the Beneteau 473. This boat was not on our radar because we wanted something newer, and when we came across one we fell in love to the point of putting an offer, and owning one within a week

The interior is one of the best things. My wife really didn't want a 'cave' type interior, and even with having plenty of wood inside, it feels light. We have the 2-cabin version with a huge 'pantry' room, but there is also a 3-cabin version. Sooo much storage.

This video is from the first trip, a week ago, from Provincetown to Boston. It's a real pleasure to sail...

[Perfect Ride]

There are a few good blue water cats that might help with the family "requirements". Having spent my whole life on mono-hulls, I went to the dark side four years ago for another live aboard "global romp" and 40,000 miles later still very pleased with the choice. We spend at least 75% of our year at anchor and the cat benefits are many.
Just a thought.

[rchildress]

Buy a blue water boat and make it bright inside with paint. This is much easier than buying a bright pretty boat and making it a capable offshore cruiser! Your family will enjoy being dry and comfortable more than being in a pretty boat when push comes to shove!!!

[Van Der Beek]

Originally Posted by daletournier

The term Bluewater is the problem here. Many still think full keel , twin masts , 2 inch thick hull with blisters built in etc etc. The reality is modern boats are safely crossing oceans everyday, fin keels, spade rudders, inmast furling and catamarans , im yet to see evidence that suggests they arent blue water.

It will be interesting to see whats considered bluewater in 20-30 years.

You could cross in a bathtub or a canoe, weather permitting, but doesn't mean they are suitable for the task at hand.

Full keel and heavy displacement for example is still valid, it offers safety and comfort As for new technology it isn’t automatically a good thing either. Not to forget it’s often used as a crutch, as well as adding complexity and cost.

[Flygirlnh]

If we were going to do blue water cruising, which we are not, we would buy an Amel. We have two friends with Amel Super Maramu, oldest around 15 years old right now. We have been so impressed with the safety features. Less impressed with the required amenities like the washing machine, but for blue water, it’s set to go. Big fuel and water tanks, giant engine and charging system, sealed bulkheads, lots of storage. The down side to me is the All electric piece.. makes you dependent on that syste. However, the cockpit of big, centered and deep and the giant engine compartment is under the sole of cockpit. We have sailed on these for many weeks now and are impressed.

We are coastal cruisers and love our Beneteau Oceanis 40cc for comfort and cruisbaility. But I would hesitate to cross the pong with it, even though many have done it. We would need extra fuel storage, and storage in general is in short supply. We use the forward cabin for extra sails etc. the beds are not designed with Lee cloths etc.

Another boat we have been impressed with is the Boreal 47. An aluminum boat designed for northern blue water, it has a swing keel and friends of our raised their two boys on it for 3 years. It’s comfy, large, safe, and they hedged their bets by not having refrigeration, staying north, running a 24/7 oil stove , and doing all the charts off of 2 iPads and INavX . Very economical. The boys are amazing. What a learning experience for them. They key is Dad was a lifelong sailor from Maine. When they had to tie the boat down in Patagonia in 60know winds, they had knowledge and experience to deal with it.

[ljohnstone]

Try a Tayana 48 DS (Deck Salon) The wood work is moderate in color but the deck salon means that there is all sorts of light in the salon.

[Captainronald]

I lived on my sailboat which was 40'LOD 46'LOA for over two years before buying a house and sailed in the Vancouver Island BC area. Buying a boat is a very complicated process because of costs, design, use, crew size, climate, and so on the list goes on and on. One of the issues is hull design. A design for offshore boats needs to be different from boats just used in inland waters and coastal areas. With all these issues and options focusing on interior colour is one option but personally I would concentrate on the hull design first. Then the rigging and engine. The cost would be a big issue for me. A fellow sailboat owner suggested to me that when I bought my boat not to make any changes to it for a couple of months. It seemed like a strange idea at first but I did that and after a couple of months I decided not to make the changes I had initially decided to make. So is there an easy answer here? Nope. Just think it over and go the way that makes you happy. Some people love living on a boat and some don't. When I invited friends onboard some seemed very happy and others seemed nervous. Best wishes for a good decision and lots of fun! ron

[Ericson38]

Originally Posted by daletournier

The term Bluewater is the problem here. Many still think full keel , twin masts , 2 inch thick hull with blisters built in etc etc. The reality is modern boats are safely crossing oceans everyday, fin keels, spade rudders, inmast furling and catamarans , im yet to see evidence that suggests they arent blue water.

It will be interesting to see whats considered bluewater in 20-30 years.

Full keel (Lord Nelson, Baba, Westsail, Hans Christian), twin masts (ketch ?), 2 inch thick hull (everywhere or leading edges, stem head fitting, around rudder and strut and around keel stump ?), built in blisters (), etc etc () = Blue Water (many have this concept you think ?).

The Blue Water term is not really a problem. Degrees of wind and wave state at the extremes has always been a problem for any small boat operator in transit, blue or muddy.


Light displacement, low weight high aspect keels, deep and narrow spade rudders, combined with hard chines and wide beams at the stern to carry sail off the wind make for fast boats, but they can be very uncomfortable at times, with snap rolls from beam seas and seas aft of the beam, and wave pounding while beating. There is always a trade off in these physical attributes.

Its kind of like spade rudders versus skeg mounted. I had 3 boats with spades, and used to be able to stall them on a broad reach in winds over 25 (with matching seas) any time I wanted. Used to do it all the time. Then let go the main sheet, and the flow would immediately re-attach around the rudder. I can't do it easily I'm sure with a skeg mounted rudder (It would be work to arrange it) but then the steering is less sensitive overall (directional changes), and in lighter winds not as exciting a boat to sail. A spade rudder of equal plan form to a skeg mounted one (rudder and skeg combined plan form area) will exert more turning force around the keel 1/4 chord line for a 10 degree change than a skeg mounted one will, but the spade can be made to stall and loose flow much easier too. Its all just parameters and their trade offs in what you most highly regard in general boat characteristics.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by Van Der Beek

You could cross in a bathtub or a canoe, weather permitting, but doesn't mean they are suitable for the task at hand.

Full keel and heavy displacement for example is still valid, it offers safety and comfort As for new technology it isn’t automatically a good thing either. Not to forget it’s often used as a crutch, as well as adding complexity and cost.

The bathtub canoe analogy comes up regularly, it's completely irrelevant. No one is suggesting a bath tub is a blue water boat.

I'm currently sitting on the west coast of Madagascar. There's now three catamarans, several beneteaus, my catalina and a variety of other boats. They all crossed the Indian ocean safely, they all experienced rough conditions at times during their crossing and they're are all here.

No cat flipped and no bolt on keels fell off, were the all just lucky? BTW not one full keel boat here that I know of. For the record I have no problem with old full keel boats, there's many I like BUT the reality is there are now many modern designs sailing the oceans if the world.

[leftbrainstuff]

If its too dark you can always paint it white.

Our Liberty 458 is plenty bright down below and it has a dark teak interior. We've been in the Pacific North West for 2 years and winters are mostly overcast and grey.

It's aomething we were concerned about when buying. You will know immediately when going below.