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Old 02-12-2019, 08:25   #46
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

As a comment only, all of this discussion seems to be applying to only two island groups in French Polynesian: the Tuamotus and the Society island groups. As we all know, the classic route to the South Pacific was first arrival (Premier Touche) in The Marquesas and then the Societies. Tuomotus became popular with the advent of GPS. Clearly, the classic route can no longer bear the traffic. If I where to plan another circumnavigation, I'd hit the Marquesas and then head down to the Gambiers and on the the Australs before hitting the Cooks, and Samoas and or Tonga. I'd skip the Societies, it has become a mob scene.
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:46   #47
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

This sounds very similar to the nashing of teeth over the Bahamians raising there entry fees, Americans crying we have rights, well we donít have rights, not a one. We only have choices, to go and pay, or not go. It really is that simple. We sailors put a large burden on these small communities, and what we pay for services and goods doesnít cover the costs related to our being there. ( they donít want our trash, they donít want us dumping our poo in their water, they donít want us catching their fish). When their was a little trickle of sailors showing up it was of no consequence, now it is far easier to get to the Bahamas or FP, and far to many of us are showing up uninvited. We are reaping what we have sown as a community. Itís time for us to look in the mirror.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:21   #48
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

I am convinced FP makes a profit with the cruisers! Everybody has something to repair, needs parts, reprovisions, hauls out, eats out. I'd guess the minimum spent is €800/person/month, most .will spend consider ably more. M any businesses live only from w.hat they make on th.e cruisers. 4day haulout including antifouling: >€1.000 (40' boat).
As to overfishing: the locals are doing it by th.emselves, no need for us to help.
As to pooing into the lagoon: while this is not ok let's keep it in perspective: the surf continuously throws a large amount of w ater over the barrier reef into th.e lagoons, there is outgoing current in all passes in th
E Society Islands. The poop of even many boats is minut.e compared to the amount of water th at com.es ove.r the reef & is flushed out through the pass. Th
E runoff of the plentiful rain here .will carry all the oil the crappy cars drip onto roads & parking lots (25% of the cars here in Tahiti should go into the press immediately, they are beyond repairability, another 10% certainly are not “roadworthy“ - this apparently is tolerated by the authorities) & all the rubber rubbed onto the tarmac together with lots of litter (looking at the roadsides...) & copious topsoil from the areas where the hillsides have been bared.
Much as it is fashionable for the “West“ to cry “mea culpa“, this is not something that we “reap“, this is the result of shady politicians' maneuvring & inciting resentments.
But as with so many topics: the greater the distance & the smaller the actual knowledge of a topic - the greater the conviction.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:32   #49
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

a yes & regarding “uninvited“:
Quite recently the duration of stay for EU citizens was extendet to “indefinitely“ & for the boats to 3 years before importaion, & the fee reduced to 7% of the boat's value - now if tha is not “inviting“...
but as anoth.er poster .wrote: never let facts get in the w.ay of a strong conviction!
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:41   #50
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

I signed up for the association. I want it to be viable when I get there in a year or two.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:50   #51
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

@Cherod:
Sure no know.ledge of french or local languages is nec.ess ary to know facts of nuclear tests or colonialism, but how the locals feel & think a bout it, how they link (or don't) cruisers with these “dark“ chapters of their past- this will n.ece.ssitate language skills none of us has. So therefore I repeate:
I know NEXT TO NOTHING of what makes the islander.s “tick“ - & it looks like neither do you.
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Old 02-12-2019, 11:06   #52
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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Originally Posted by Cherod View Post
Perhaps you have much to learn regarding the spread of nuclear pollution , there has been much published on the issue , if only ones politics would allow them to read it

Whatís politics got to do with nuclear pollution? Iím questioning your linkage of something far far away and not associated with the nearby French testing being an issue for locals against cruisers. Maybe it is, maybe it isnít, but neither you nor I live there and I certainly donít know anything of the politics there.

Then you bring in the colonial legacy. Sheesh. Following your passionate and strident defence of the LV crew elsewhere, also with no personal knowledge of them, Iím starting to think that you like appropriating woke argumentation and bringing it to CF. Sigh.
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Old 02-12-2019, 14:27   #53
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

Yes, it’s always someone else’s fault that first worlders have been so put upon.
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Old 02-12-2019, 14:36   #54
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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Whatís politics got to do with nuclear pollution? Iím questioning your linkage of something far far away and not associated with the nearby French testing being an issue for locals against cruisers. Maybe it is, maybe it isnít, but neither you nor I live there and I certainly donít know anything of the politics there.

Then you bring in the colonial legacy. Sheesh. Following your passionate and strident defence of the LV crew elsewhere, also with no personal knowledge of them, Iím starting to think that you like appropriating woke argumentation and bringing it to CF. Sigh.
your lack of understanding abounds ,,, we can all read, well i presume so , there is lots to be read on indiginous resentment to past colonial issues, nuclear polution is only one of them ,,,, re Vagy , again your ignorance astounds,,have you actually read any of my posts i dont etc etc the crew, i support their vogage , their mission , if you still missunderstand that then i suggest that you read Nikkis post today , she goes into great detail which even the slow to learn should understand
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Old 02-12-2019, 14:43   #55
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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Originally Posted by fxykty View Post
Whatís politics got to do with nuclear pollution? Iím questioning your linkage of something far far away and not associated with the nearby French testing being an issue for locals against cruisers. Maybe it is, maybe it isnít, but neither you nor I live there and I certainly donít know anything of the politics there.

Then you bring in the colonial legacy. Sheesh. Following your passionate and strident defence of the LV crew elsewhere, also with no personal knowledge of them, Iím starting to think that you like appropriating woke argumentation and bringing it to CF. Sigh.

he has been spouting similar rubbish on ybw.com under the same username
they ignore him generally,so i guess CF must be fertile ground
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Old 02-12-2019, 19:27   #56
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

Late here but I want to clarify something. Cruisers rare get to really know the local people and there true beliefs. I know this because after cruising for 5 years I stayed 2 years in Tonga and married a local. I became one of them and then and only then did I get the unfiltered voice.

There are people in all the islands who hate the way tourism has changed the island even if they are also making a living in it. They long for the old days and old ways but don't want to go it alone.

So just because you do not see it or hear it does not mean it doesn't exist. It does.

They also hate the rich ex-pat who move to the island too but he doesn't know it. You see, before us travelers arrived, nobody was poor, but now they all see how poor they are. That does not make them feel good.

So come, enjoy the beautiful places, spend some money, be polite but don't stay, leave.
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Old 02-12-2019, 19:55   #57
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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Late here but I want to clarify something. Cruisers rare get to really know the local people and there true beliefs. I know this because after cruising for 5 years I stayed 2 years in Tonga and married a local. I became one of them and then and only then did I get the unfiltered voice.

There are people in all the islands who hate the way tourism has changed the island even if they are also making a living in it. They long for the old days and old ways but don't want to go it alone.

So just because you do not see it or hear it does not mean it doesn't exist. It does.

They also hate the rich ex-pat who move to the island too but he doesn't know it. You see, before us travelers arrived, nobody was poor, but now they all see how poor they are. That does not make them feel good.

So come, enjoy the beautiful places, spend some money, be polite but don't stay, leave.
Thanks, I do believe that respectful and accepting the local's customs and not being the ugly (insert country of origin) is all part of leaving a clean wake for those that come after us. Many truly believe that money and its trappings are the only important thing in life but they fail to see or understand that many that are, in their world poor, are in fact far richer in so many ways than them.
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Old 03-12-2019, 01:38   #58
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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Originally Posted by FranklinGray View Post
Late here but I want to clarify something. Cruisers rare get to really know the local people and there true beliefs. I know this because after cruising for 5 years I stayed 2 years in Tonga and married a local. I became one of them and then and only then did I get the unfiltered voice.

There are people in all the islands who hate the way tourism has changed the island even if they are also making a living in it. They long for the old days and old ways but don't want to go it alone.

So just because you do not see it or hear it does not mean it doesn't exist. It does.

They also hate the rich ex-pat who move to the island too but he doesn't know it. You see, before us travelers arrived, nobody was poor, but now they all see how poor they are. That does not make them feel good.

So come, enjoy the beautiful places, spend some money, be polite but don't stay, leave.
FG , very good post , that is in fact the way it is on many ( most ? ) areas where rich foreigners , often with colonial past connections , are changing the whole environment which they claim to love so much , are they just stupid or donít give a damn ,
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Old 03-12-2019, 01:43   #59
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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he has been spouting similar rubbish on ybw.com under the same username
they ignore him generally,so i guess CF must be fertile ground
Some one suggested to me the other day that you must lead a very sad lonely life , otherwise why would you behave the way you do , jealousy ? Whatever ?
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Old 03-12-2019, 01:49   #60
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Re: French Polynesia Cruiser Problems

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a yes & regarding ďuninvitedď:
Quite recently the duration of stay for EU citizens was extendet to ďindefinitelyď & for the boats to 3 years before importaion, & the fee reduced to 7% of the boat's value - now if tha is not ďinvitingď...
but as anoth.er poster .wrote: never let facts get in the w.ay of a strong conviction!
???? Let us suppose that the average boat value is 100000 , that means they say , give us 7000 and we will let you stay , is that what you are saying ?? Is that inviting ??
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