Cruising Indonesia

[travler37]

I wonder why you would want to spend you dollars on a country that has a problem with others........religious one.
Wear a swim/short that has USMC on it and see how you like your reception............Or wear a flag on your t-shirt.
Spent 2 weeks there and left for the land of smiles.
Mark

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by travler37

I wonder why you would want to spend you dollars on a country that has a problem with others........religious one.
Wear a swim/short that has USMC on it and see how you like your reception............Or wear a flag on your t-shirt.
Spent 2 weeks there and left for the land of smiles.
Mark

That could easily also apply to other countries

Never been to Indonesia (sounded a bit too much like hard work ) and I was kinda busy in the LOS, albeit my experiance is that although the locals may be smiling a lot (especially if you are giving them money ) - it doesn't always mean much and that a fair few would also cut your throat for either a few dollars. or to make a point (to you and to other locals). I really miss that woman - "natural causes" at 37 (38 in Thai age counting) was the last thing anyone would have bet on......

Thailand had (has?) a higher murder rate than the US (I doubt if that includes the Govt death squads - as sponsored by the land of Coca Cola ). Ever wondered why former PM Thaksin was never even investgated internationally for "stuff" after he was ousted in a Coup? (the money run out - and was choosing to spend on the Peasants a bit to much for the Elite)....knows too much..........but my learning on all that came from the company I kept .

My advice for anyone visiting for the first time (plane or boat) is to stay in the "protected" Touristy areas (they are low (violent) crime) - it's a public / private partneship thing .....until you understand a bit more of the risks involved of going off piste.

Albeit most visiting Thailand go through several cycles of "I know what I am doing", interspaced by events of "Oh ****" .......until you reach enlightenment, of accepting that you are never really going to understand the place in the same way as "home" (but then again, plenty don't actually understand WTF is going on at "home" either ).......but you will nonetheless meet a lot of Westerner "experts" - my advice on that is the same as for the locals - take everything at face value, but don't beleive a word of it, until verified (preferably by events).

But they do smile a lot .........which looks good in photos.

[travler37]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

That could easily also apply to other countries

Never been to Indonesia (sounded a bit too much like hard work ) and I was kinda busy in the LOS, albeit my experiance is that although the locals may be smiling a lot (especially if you are giving them money ) - it doesn't always mean much and that a fair few would also cut your throat for either a few dollars. or to make a point (to you and to other locals). I really miss that woman - "natural causes" at 37 (38 in Thai age counting) was the last thing anyone would have bet on......

Thailand had (has?) a higher murder rate than the US (I doubt if that includes the Govt death squads - as sponsored by the land of Coca Cola ). Ever wondered why former PM Thaksin was never even investgated internationally for "stuff" after he was ousted in a Coup? (the money run out - and was choosing to spend on the Peasants a bit to much for the Elite)....knows too much..........but my learning on all that came from the company I kept .

My advice for anyone visiting for the first time (plane or boat) is to stay in the "protected" Touristy areas (they are low (violent) crime) - it's a public / private partneship thing .....until you understand a bit more of the risks involved of going off piste.

Albeit most visiting Thailand go through several cycles of "I know what I am doing", interspaced by events of "Oh ****" .......until you reach enlightenment, of accepting that you are never really going to understand the place in the same way as "home" (but then again, plenty don't actually WTF is going at "home" either ).......but you will nonetheless meet a lot of Westerner "experts" - my advice on that is the same as for the locals - take everything at face value, but don't beleive a word of it, until verified (preferably events).

But they do smile a lot

Says again at least they dont hate you for a religion........
and i actually like there way of dealing with tourist crime...you get different cops than the regular ones........
Picked up a ball in Pipi to get fuel and singers.then escape.Dutch couple on the ball next to us were on a bareboat.They had ben broken into and lost there passports and electronics......they sailed into ko roc 2 days later..having drinks with them and watching the sunset a Thai navy patrol boat came alongside and returned there passports and property.Dutch woman asked my girl to interpet...what happened to the person that stole there stuff........answer was FISH FOOD.
[will probably be deleated for that}
I realy like there legal system!
Mark

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by travler37

Says again at least they dont hate you for a religion........
and i actually like there way of dealing with tourist crime...you get different cops than the regular ones........
Picked up a ball in Pipi to get fuel and singers.then escape.Dutch couple on the ball next to us were on a bareboat.They had ben broken into and lost there passports and electronics......they sailed into ko roc 2 days later..having drinks with them and watching the sunset a Thai navy patrol boat came alongside and returned there passports and property.Dutch woman asked my girl to interpet...what happened to the person that stole there stuff........answer was FISH FOOD.
[will probably be deleated for that}
I realy like there legal system!
Mark

Lol! that sounds about right for the LOS

Reminds me of the one time my father came out to Thailand (my wifes' funeral).....was chatting to a good mate (Westerner) and his Thai Wife (both in there 30's and long married - came from "Good" Family - alledgedly )...........and only as a passing comment she mentioned that her cousin had killed around a dozen people - the reason? he was good at it , and people came to him because of that. and good money maybe a hundred dollars. He was a Farmer.

First time I have seen my father with mouth hanging open in shock .

Conversation kinda stopped .

Not simply because of the casual admission (to a complete stranger and in a Restaurant) but because the rest of us didn't even blink and simply carried on with an (unrelated) conversation (I forget exactly what) .

Unfortunately I just don't have the energy (or patience) anymore to deal with the LOS........but may go back as a "newbie".

[undercutter]

Originally Posted by travler37

I wonder why you would want to spend you dollars on a country that has a problem with others........religious one.
Wear a swim/short that has USMC on it and see how you like your reception............Or wear a flag on your t-shirt.
Spent 2 weeks there and left for the land of smiles.
Mark

Did not plan to go this way but the miss's is still not comfortable with the offshore stuff even though it would only be 2-3 days from Sarawak to Singapore. Want to make sure that she stays on board so to speak.

Once we plotted the route and started to look at the area we decided that there was many interesting places to see on the way. Once we ran into the bureacratic red tape to gain access to the area we almost quit but in the end it was pretty easy to get the CAIT and the visa to enter Indonesia. Besides, how many opportunities will we get to explore this area.

Always got on well with the locals in Borneo, either Sabah, Brunei or Sarawak and I can't beleive that there is that much difference in West Kalimantan. All these places are the same i think. If you are an easy mark then the chances are .... As far as the USMC goes,we only wear tee shirts with a Canadian flag.

Still looking to get any information of the area south to the Java Sea and then North through the Lingga Isles to Batam.

[tropicalescape]

Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey

Lol! that sounds about right for the LOS

Reminds me of the one time my father came out to Thailand (my wifes' funeral).....was chatting to a good mate (Westerner) and his Thai Wife (both in there 30's and long married - came from "Good" Family - alledgedly )...........and only as a passing comment she mentioned that her cousin had killed around a dozen people - the reason? he was good at it , and people came to him because of that. and good money maybe a hundred dollars. He was a Farmer.

First time I have seen my father with mouth hanging open in shock .

Conversation kinda stopped .

Not simply because of the casual admission (to a complete stranger and in a Restaurant) but because the rest of us didn't even blink and simply carried on with an (unrelated) conversation (I forget exactly what) .

Unfortunately I just don't have the energy (or patience) anymore to deal with the LOS........but may go back as a "newbie".

That is something that i found out about the Indos. also ,they dont seem to lie alot..I caught one that had stole from me and asked if he did and he said "yes" and I said ok..ok,like what do you have to say for yourself...he had nothing to say except "it is our custom to take all we can from "western infidels"..ok..something about we take all there natural resources and make deals with powerful familys that dont share the wealth..(Sukarno,Suharto,and in Thialand Toxin whats his name)

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by travler37

I wonder why you would want to spend you dollars on a country that has a problem with others........religious one.

Religious intolerance?
Like in America?

With mosque attacks in California, Wisconsin and Tennessee and the heated controversy over the Islamic Center near Ground Zero in New York,
Islamophobia is now running rampant in the United States. "America has a significant Muslim problem, and I think that what we've seen now really shows what's the tip of the iceberg," John Esposito, author of The Future of Islam, recently told ABC News. Thus, anyone with ties to Islam or who simply has brown skin is now under threat in this hostile climate.

Religious Intolerance Against Muslims in America Is Counterproductive

Religious Intolerance in the U.S. | The Diane Rehm Show from WAMU and NPR

Concern Is Voiced Over Religious Intolerance - NYTimes.com

Plus the numerous other Intolerances America has and has had in its chequered past.

Wear a swim/short that has USMC on it and see how you like your reception

I wonder why?

Or wear a flag on your t-shirt.

I doubt I would have a problem wearing an Australian flag on my shirt, or any other nations apart from America.
Do you wonder why?

At the end of the day, Indonesia is 90% Muslim, so it makes sense to respect their religious belief's and their culture while in their land. Why is this such a problem?

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by tropicalescape

and in Thialand Toxin whats his name)

Thaksin Shinawatra?
He was until 2006, now it is Yingluck Shinawatra

[Sabbatical II]

Even though Indonesia is our closest neighbour, I have no intention of sailing there. I don't expect to live long enough to visit all the nice places on the planet so why would I want to brave all the unlit fishing boats and other obstacles at night only to find I have to bribe all the officials for the privilge of visiting their country when I get there? If it's your thing, then good luck to you.

[tropicalescape]

Originally Posted by cat man do

Religious intolerance?
Like in America?


Plus the numerous other Intolerances America has and has had in its chequered past.



I wonder why?

I doubt I would have a problem wearing an Australian flag on my shirt, or any other nations apart from America.
Do you wonder why?

At the end of the day, Indonesia is 90% Muslim, so it makes sense to respect their religious belief's and their culture while in their land. Why is this such a problem?

Its not a problem ..but I respect every culture that I come in contact with and they disrespect me because i come from America..and it does not have to be The USA ,you could be from Mexico and they still seem to hate you ..It would be stupid to go to some of these places and assume the attitude of ,well I didnt do anything to you it was my Government that you have a problem with..yeah right..and I dont mean to sound ugly but I think they hate Ozs most of all..I was at the Sari Club before it was blown up and was told many times not to go there or to Peanuts or to the Crazy Horse because "something was going to happen..I look like a lot of those folks and if I dont talk I am usually mistaken for a local in foreign lands...even at home they think Im from some other country..Respect them for sure ,trust that they respect you and you have made your first mistake..DVC

[speakeasy]

I doubt I would have a problem wearing an Australian flag on my shirt, or any other nations apart from America.
Do you wonder why?

Actually, I found no anti-american sentiment in Bali or Lombok having spent a total of maybe 6 months there a dozen years back over 4 visits. I am an ex-marine but wouldn't rub foreigners face in the fact. sheesh. The Indonesians I got to know all had more resentment against the Japanese than anyone but the local Chinese, for Japan's slave labor ill-treatment there during WWII.

[tropicalescape]

Originally Posted by speakeasy

Actually, I found no anti-american sentiment in Bali or Lombok having spent a total of maybe 6 months there a dozen years back over 4 visits. I am an ex-marine but wouldn't rub foreigners face in the fact. sheesh. The Indonesians I got to know all had more resentment against the Japanese than anyone but the local Chinese, for Japan's slave labor ill-treatment there during WWII.

Its one thing to your face and another to your back...Bailnese are the best people I have ever met,going to Bali and saying one went to Indoneisa is like going to Hawaii and saying i went to the USA...Its their masters most people have issues with,like the Hindus,the east Timorens,the people in New Guinea on the Indonesian side etc....

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by Eleebana

Even though Indonesia is our closest neighbour, I have no intention of sailing there. I don't expect to live long enough to visit all the nice places on the planet so why would I want to brave all the unlit fishing boats and other obstacles at night only to find I have to bribe all the officials for the privilge of visiting their country when I get there? If it's your thing, then good luck to you.

Unfortunately you have to sail through their waters to get to most of them.

[undercutter]

Is there an old saying that there are no bad religions, just bad men?

Anyone one who uses religion for political purposes is not someone I would follow. Unfortunately it is a convenient tool.

Does anyone have any first hand knowledge of the waters on the west coast of Kalimantan, Bilitung, Bangka and the East coast of Sumatera. Has anyone sailed the straits between Bangka and Sumatera??

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by undercutter

Is there an old saying that there are no bad religions, just bad men?

Anyone one who uses religion for political purposes is not someone I would follow. Unfortunately it is a convenient tool.

One of the most famous examples of religious violence in the Middle Ages is of course the Crusades - attempts by European Christians to impose their vision of religion upon Jews, Orthodox Christians, heretics, Muslims, and just about anyone else who happened to get in the way.

Christianity and Violence: Crusades