A Yacht Broker Rant! What would you do?

[Yachts66]

Ok, my surreal boat buying experience just took a new twist and I'd like to solicit opinions from this group.

There is a boat in the Caribbean that looks very good on paper and in pictures. My now dubious broker has been in contact with the owner’s broker and they are telling what a "deal" this boat is. Ok, looks good, pics are great, the boat appears sweet, and I’m seriously interested. Towards the end of our discussions I'm told that there is another interested buyer, this one from Europe. He's going to go see it (don't know when) but he is interested and after all this is a first come first served affair, right? So I better boogey down there and grab it while I can.

Ok, maybe they have another guy, maybe they don't, so I book my non-refundable flight and make my non-refundable hotel reservations and am to depart tomorrow evening. Whoopee do.

This morning I get an email informing me they have an offer on the boat from the guy in Europe! Wait a minute; he hasn't been there yet, right? Well no, wrong. He was there a few weeks ago, before I even booked my flight and he has now submitted an offer, but it was low and they rejected it. He's now considering raising his offer, but hasn't and they are suggesting I put an offer in well above his to "secure my place in line."

WOW am I PO'd. Should I be? It feels like these jerks are using me to jam the other guy to get him to raise his offer. I don't like being used. From emails they copied me; the other buyer has never owned a boat before and knows near nothing about them. He needs to bring the boat to Europe, and hasn't figured out how to do that. This is a 50' boat, not the kind I would want to learn on, but then that's me.

My inclination is to cancel the trip, take the financial hit for the hotel and flight and keep looking. What would you do? I'm all ears and you have my thanks in advance for your comments.

Why oh why does this process have to be so damn frustrating? Damn sleazy yacht brokers. What a pain in the ass this is.

Regards,

TJ

[Vasco]

You've paid for the trip. Take a few days off. Look at the boat. It does sound as if you're being jerked around a bit. If you like the boat proceed as you would have done if you were the only bidder. Salespeople love to tell you that you'd better act quickly or the deal'll be lost! While you're there visit the other brokers in the area. You might be able to make a contact with someone who might be able to check out boats down there for you. A personal visit sure beats e-mails.

[Euro Cruiser]

TJ:

Well, first off - you go. There's little add'l expense involved at this point, you'll have a chance to walk the docks, perhaps chat with other brokers, and perhaps do a bit of networking with cruisers down "there" (wish you had said where this is) who might know about other available boats, some perhaps only being offered privately. What's the downside?

Should you be PO'd? Maybe...tho' perhaps not, and in any event it will probably prove hard to nail down who has failed to do what. Was the owner's broker not sufficiently detailed in comms to your broker? Was your broker lax? Probably a bit of both. Should you be upset at a broker who uses one party's interest in a boat to lever another interested party? Come on...

Is there anything abnormal in the sequence of events? If I'm reading this right, you now understand that interested party #1 flew out and viewed the boat but didn't make an offer, THEN you made your inquiry and decided to book a flight, THEN party #1 makes an offer, and now your broker (who is losing out on being involved in the sale) is urging you to make a counter offer. Sounds like normal business to me, where everyone is busy looking out for themselves (including you).

The boat is fully available since the first offer was rejected. Were I you, I'd go take a look. If interested, make an offer with the normal contingencies and get it locked down by making your offer valid for only a short time period (48 hrs, let's say). If the other buyer isn't serious enough, he'll become a footnote in the transaction It looks to me like all your options remain available, and you're only PO'd because you discovered there's other interest in the boat and no one took the initiative to mention it via your broker to you. That's just the marketplace...

(Simple rule of thumb: Assume nothing positive about an unknown broker, and then be pleasantly surprised when you learn otherwise. Assume they are ignorant of the boat and must be step-marched thru the process of getting the info you need. Assume they are lazy and need to have it reinforced that they get their commission by actually working for it. Assume the broker knows very little about boating and boats, and that only you will know what the right Q's are, and only you know how to evaluate the A's - which means they don't get to do analysis in lieu of getting facts, but rather they have to actually go get and report the facts to you. All these guidelines would seem to apply when shopping in the Caribbean...).

Good luck and let us know how things work out once you begin kicking the tires...

Jack

[capt lar]

yep - i agree with all the above. if you buy the boat, you need marina and the rest of it. this trip needed to happen anyway. i would also find the best broker down there and eliminate the middle guy. purchase in the islands typically required deposit in the hands of selling broker, so i am skeptical about the first offer being fully legit. you need someone there to watch your interest.
as to offers - it's subject to survey so not really worth much - an offer on an unseen boat is a waste of everyone's time and they should not even suggest it. inspection, acceptance, survey all need to happen before any buyer is at risk. if you say which island, some on this site will probably know people there. dare i ask if you have purchased other boats and anything near 50 feet ?

[GordMay]

I’d get rid of “your” broker - sounds, to me, like he may have been anxious to claim a ‘finder’s fee” (such as in ‘MLS’ situation).
The other broker works for the other guy, so no big surprise there.

[Pblais]

Don't spend money untill you are satified. You never put down any money and you never made a formal offer. They can do what they like, but I wouldn't worry or believe any of it. No ned to rush either. Go and see what there is to it. You were I hope prepared to walk away in the first place - you still might.

It would be great if it worked, but not if it won't. Just don't let other people mess with your head. I would survey this one close too. Gord is right if the broker isn't helping you then you don't need him for anything now do you.

[Boracay]

As one who has driven 1000's of km to look at a boat that was a rotten, overpriced piece of s*** .
I enjoyed the trip, and the lesson in boat buying was priceless.
Keep your head well screwd on.

[Yachts66]

Thanks everyone for all your input it was greatly appreciated! I've decided to go, unfortunately my wife can't go with me so in the worst case it won't be much of a vacation, but the money is already spent. I'll continue to hope for the best and prepare for the worst.

As a clarification, there are two brokers involved, one representing me and one representing the owner. My pique stemmed from the owner's broker not informing me there was an offer three weeks ago, prior to me making reservations. It seemed to me (and still does) that as a courtesy to me he should have informed me there was a pending offer close to the time he got it and not the day before I was to leave. That just seems chicken to me. Then again, having just survived some major brain surgery perhaps I'm just not thinking right, I can never tell.

The idea presented about getting an agreement prior to the trip is a valid one, but in this case the money is leaving the Country and that makes me super cautious, because if there is a problem I'm a foreigner in a foreign Court trying to get justice from a local. In some places that's not a problem, but in some places it is and the chunk of change involved was not small so I didn't opt to go that route.

We've really had a string of bad experiences lately, mostly centered around brokers misrepresenting boats for Lord knows what reason, but we've wasted a lot of time and money due to this and it's made me rather put off on yacht brokers in general. Then again, like I said maybe my brain just isn't right yet. Who knows? LOL

Oh, it's on St. Maarten and yes I've owned other boats of similar size. My last one was a 43' which I owned for 5 years and lived-a-board for 2. Put a lot of miles under her keel too!

Regards and thanks again for all your input, you are a great group.

TJ

[Euro Cruiser]

We'll be standing by, TJ...

[Vasco]

Yachts66'

Is it listed with Weathe Eye?

[Yachts66]

Yes it is, should I be even more worried now?

TJ

[BC Mike]

Full and adequate disclosure is the words to live by in this day and age, especially in the financial business.
When you are selling in this situation, having more than one party looking at a boat can be problematic.
Do you owe it to anyone to tell them what someone else is doing.
Sometimes no matter what the broker does he will get in trouble from one of the parties.
As the broker you do not know who is going to buy what.
Your safest bet however is to inform as best you can, and try and not make it appear as if you are trying to get a bidding war thing happening.
It would be easier on the broker if each of you were looking at the boat at different times ( like a month apart ) and that one person had either bought or passed on the boat.
Michael

[Vasco]

Yachts66,

No, it's just that the owner of Weather Eye belongs to the same club as I do, here in Toronto. I haven't heard anything about him that you should worry about.

[s/v 'Faith']

Why oh why does this process have to be so damn frustrating? Damn sleazy yacht brokers. What a pain in the ass this is.

Regards,

TJ

You answered your own question. ' Damn sleazy yacht brokers.'

Why do you have one repersenting you? Granted they are going to split the comission, but maybe you can find a boat not represented and avoid this worthless expense all together.

Good luck, enjoy the trip.

[capt lar]

Now, now 'Faith' - While it is true that just about anyone can sell boats, remember there is, within that group, a highly professional crowd of first class people. I found such a person and hired him as a buyer's broker when I was shopping. The guy did a great job and, not to my surprise, the other professionals he recommended to assist in other areas were also first class. Things went smoothly.
I would not attempt to purchase a yacht outside of this country without the help of a first class broker. They know how it works where they are, and they have the contacts to fix problems and avoid delays.
As to the jerk around - I am sure TJ will ask what the deal is and the broker will understand that if he wants to have the opportunity to do business with a qualified buyer, there will not be any more communication problems. That's one reason why the trip makes sense.

Capt. Lar