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Old 31-08-2012, 19:05   #61
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I see no reason for any citizen of the USA to hide their ensign anywhere. Those that do , do so because they usually have listened to nonsense from home and have hyped up fear as a result. It's rarely because that's a real issue. Citizens of the USA can take their fear too seriously at times.

Secondly, such citizens often take contrary views of the USA as " bashing" it. Well as a big powerful nation , sorry, suck it up. If you were tiddly nobody would bother one way or another.

wear the ensign, stop thinking too much about it, we're not all out to get you. You know. ( believe me, your not alone in this issue, you should see the reactions in some med countries sailing in with a German flag !!)

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Old 31-08-2012, 19:53   #62
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

First, I am very proud to be an American even though I am ashamed of many of decisions political leaders have made, especially in regards to foreign policy. But I still love my country and fly our ensign proudly . . .

. . . except that earlier this year we spent five months in Whangarei, New Zealand, where most of the boats in the Town Basin Marina were foreign-flagged. Not one boat flew its ensign. Most flew a NZ courtesy flag. We've been in Fiji now since late April and no one in the Port Denarau Marina flies their ensigns here, either.

When we're asked, we say we're from California. To which many Fijians say, "Ah, America!"
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Old 31-08-2012, 20:06   #63
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

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you should see the reactions in some med countries sailing in with a German flag !!)
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Old 31-08-2012, 20:37   #64
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

I just think back to the Bondi Race Riots (was that 2005?) and the clowns wearing the Aussie Flag like some sort of cape. Being former military that sort of disrespect galls me. The other lot impressed me even less, but that's by the by. The thing is, flags are a symbol of an ideal, and there are lots of different ideals out there for each flag. Identity might be a similar concept. As an Aussie (naturalised), I've looked a little closer at what it actually means to be Australian...what is uniquely Aussie? Difficult to answer, and when I look at the origins of this young country and its original values, I am in a quandary, about each step in its history. Good bits and bad, but I find the post-modern nationalism is a sickening synthetic straw-man, trading on past reputation whilst making a mockery of it. That's why I'm hesitant about flying the flag, because I absolutely don't want to identify with what it has become, and very carefully with what it was.

As to hoisting the German flag...ok, I'm half German by birth and happen to live here at the moment, but there's far less in its history that appeals to me, going a loooong way back. The people here have been thoroughly screwed for generations, and conditioned to enjoy it and even demand it. I'm not anti-German, some very fine people I know here; just extremely wary of anyone beating the drum and spouting ideals, especially now that it is effectively merely the largest province in a revived roman/soviet empire. Just waiting for Joe Nero to show up....

The best of the USA was its free people...but they were only free while they protected their Constitution. Now that it has been either circumvented or twisted out of shape or simply ignored, the die is cast. All the previous entities (Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece, Rome, Britain etc...) crumbled and fell, and only blind freddy can honestly miss the signs of the latest doomed giant. I think it is a travesty, and I can sympathise with those that wonder and mourn for the country they knew and want it back. When they flay the flag, they fly the same one the founders did. I feel pity for those that think it's still hangin' in there, because they're going to have a nasty wake up some time. The ones that think it's going from strength to strength, ever upwards and forever victorious....those I fear and abhor, because they've stolen an inheritance and perverted a good thing and turned things all about. I'll honour the flag that landed on Normandy, but not the one that flew over Libya. Not because Normandy was an inherently pure and honest undertaking, but because of the honest folk that fought there in good faith, in that put up job. Nowadays, there are no more excuses, and no honour at all in the legions on the frontier, because the rot is plain to see, and to be deceived requires a willingness to be deceived. So if I ever get back afloat and in a position to render passing honours, I'll choose the Aussie flag for certain reasons, and honour what is or was honourable in the symbol on the other boat. And if I had a cannon I'd render a different kind of respect to the false flag constructs that have donned, and turned, dead men's coats. No taxation without representation? Hmmmm.
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Old 31-08-2012, 22:27   #65
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

I personally proudly fly the US ensign. Along with the USCG Auxillary ensign as I'm a currently serving member and the US Marine Corps ensign as I served six wonderful years in the Corps and view all three flags as a symbol of freedom. When I'm underway or in a foriegn port, I will ocasionally lower the USMC ensign as not all see it that way. However, I've found, particularly when dealing with port officials, that once they saw that I'm a member of the US Coast Guard, they extended a large measure of professional courtesy and I quickly cleared customs. It also comes in handy when a cutter is thinking about stopping and boarding you. They tend to not bother once they realize that you're part of the "team."
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Old 31-08-2012, 22:58   #66
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I think some previous long ( winded) posts miss the point, various nations flags are subverted by many groups for their own purpose. It has been so forever.

I wear my ensign , firstly because regulations say I should, secondly I declare the registration of the vessel as is required. Note that you wear the boats ensign not yours.

I do not embody my ensign with all kinds of political claptrap. It is a flag of registration. No more no less.

It always saddens me to see Americans not display theirs. Usually it's based on groundless fears , often purely in their own mind.

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Old 01-09-2012, 00:04   #67
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Follow the leader. If they hide their support, I figure they must know something I don't. When it is all clear again, they will show us.
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Old 01-09-2012, 00:06   #68
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

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Countries have their own regulations. I believe the US custom is to fly the flag from dawn to dusk no matter whether you are underway or in port. In Canada, the ensign is to be flown 8 AM to dusk when in port, and at all times when underway or when entering or leaving a port (an exception being that it is permissible not fly the ensign when out of sight of land or other vessels).
Actually, the US Custom is to fly the ensign from 8am to Dusk and during the hours of darkness when entering a port. Once in Port, it is lowered at sunset. It also can be lowered during weather.

For everything you ever wanted to know about US Flag etiquette on vessels, from where and when to fly it to size and type, here is a link to the US Power Squadron...

One thing I have learned while cruising is that lowering the flag at night and heavy weather... it extends it lifetime!
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Old 01-09-2012, 01:00   #69
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

We registered our boat in Isle of Man just to avoid having to fly the Stars and Stripes on our circumnavigation. We've had many experiences in our travels (non-sailing) where people don't like the US for whatever reason, and we're tired of trying to defend the things our country does, why we have 700 military bases around the world, why we elect such stupid presidents, why we keep bombing oil producing countries, etc. etc. its just less controversial and less embarrassing with the British ensign and was worth the little bit of extra effort to register in isle of man.
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Old 01-09-2012, 01:22   #70
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

I hid a sausage once,does that count?
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Old 01-09-2012, 01:31   #71
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I hid a sausage once,does that count?
Only once?
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Old 01-09-2012, 01:41   #72
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

Word got around...
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Old 01-09-2012, 02:37   #73
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

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When I encounter the more virulent forms, I ask them if they think the wrong side won WW2 and the Cold War, and the crap temporarily stops flowing.
At the risk of getting a bit too political - we have obviously never met . I am not anti-American on principal, I think it's a great idea in theory - but just like Communism can never work as claimed. and am very glad I don' t live there .....but nonetheless it's existence does benefit me, as the existence of the Soviets and the Cold war did, so yes I regret it's passing. Those living under them probably don't though .

Who won WWII? The Amerians did for sure. But not sure anyone else did. Including the "Allies" - indeed a good argument that the British Empire lost WWII.......to the US. Personally I would have cut a deal with that nice Mr Hitler and kept the empire (and accepted all the Jews etc) - if we could live with Joe Stalin then we could live with anyone. The French? f#ck 'em , albeit in practice swinging to the right enough to keep the Germans happy for 20 years would not have been a problem for them. or the Americans .........odds are that in a few years we would all have been happily marching on Moscow together . and the Americans would now be saying how they alone saved the world from speaking Russian .

I now await my bum to be smacked by Herr Moderator .


I wonder if it is possible to get a boat registered under Hinduism - depending on the symbol chosen on the flag would liven up the discussions in an anchorage!
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Old 01-09-2012, 02:51   #74
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

Last time my ensign got blown off, it was a hell of a party.
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Old 01-09-2012, 08:45   #75
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Re: Would You Ever Hide Your Ensign?

Consider yerself smacked Herr Goat ; -)

Look, great topic, interesting responses, hard to avoid any politics in regard to the topic, BUT...

Please keep any political commentary to the topic at hand, flying national ensigns, or not.

Any future posts that stray into the general international political arena will be deleted. And any responses that get cranky will also be deleted,

Thanks.
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