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Old 23-06-2015, 09:37   #46
med
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by noelex 77 View Post
Yes, good point, but in some parts of the world you don't have to drag far to be in over 200 feet of water.

Your windlass, or you, then has to lift the best part of 400lb.
If you are planning to visit areas like this, make sure your windlass is capable, or with no windlass consider how you would rig up a system to lift this weight. Unless you are stronger than I am .

Fortunately, sailboats have powerful sheet/halyard winches and these can usually be utilised.
I am not worried too much if I end up dragging in over 200 feet of water.
It is the bottom which is under 7 feet from the surface I am worried about!!!
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Old 23-06-2015, 10:16   #47
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by noelex 77 View Post
Yes, good point, but in some parts of the world you don't have to drag far to be in over 200 feet of water.

Your windlass, or you, then has to lift the best part of 400lb.
If you are planning to visit areas like this, make sure your windlass is capable, or with no windlass consider how you would rig up a system to lift this weight. Unless you are stronger than I am .

Fortunately, sailboats have powerful sheet/halyard winches and these can usually be utilised.
First - if you have only 200 feet of rode you shouldn't anchor in more than 40 feet (lunch hook) or 30 feet (overnight). In those depths dragging a well set anchor is rare. Though with rough enough conditions it is easily possible with less than 10:1 scope = ~20'. And in those conditions even with an anchor windlass you'll need to motor toward the anchor.

Second - If you're hauling up 400# of anchor and rode it'll be necessary to actually exert much less force, the difference between the 400# and the weight of water displaced by those 400#.

I frequently anchored in 20' to 30' when I had no windlass, hauled up an all chain rode by hand, and sailed off the anchor. My procedure
was to haul in the slack, go below and start cooking breakfast, go back to the bow and haul up the new slack, go below and eat breakfast, go to the bow and haul up the little remaining slack, raise the main, the wind gave enough pull to break the anchor free and then the boat was sailing and the anchor was "flying" thru the water and cleaning the mud off. And I was now in deeper water. I headed into the wind and pulled up the 20' to 30' of clean chain and anchor.

A little patience and it worked all the time.
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Old 23-06-2015, 11:41   #48
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

Quote:
Originally Posted by noelex 77 View Post
Yes, good point, but in some parts of the world you don't have to drag far to be in over 200 feet of water.

Your windlass, or you, then has to lift the best part of 400lb.
If you are planning to visit areas like this, make sure your windlass is capable, or with no windlass consider how you would rig up a system to lift this weight. Unless you are stronger than I am .

Fortunately, sailboats have powerful sheet/halyard winches and these can usually be utilised.
It is just good planning to make sure all your systems are working before you let go of the seabed. Engine, tick. Nav systems, tick. Windlass, tick. Crew ready, tick. No loose ropes in the water, tick. Dinghy secure, tick. Crew know your plan A ... and plan B. Tick.
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Old 23-06-2015, 11:55   #49
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

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Originally Posted by secrabtree View Post

Second - If you're hauling up 400# of anchor and rode it'll be necessary to actually exert much less force, the difference between the 400# and the weight of water displaced by those 400#.
There is less weight in water as you point out, but the force required is actually a bit higher than the dead weight in air would suggest. The friction, and change in direction over the bow roller is a significant factor. A big bow roller helps. For this sort of situation you need a chain stopper and that means a 90° change. The friction will be higher than the reduction in force due to the buoyancy.

I am not sure the detail matters as anything remotely like this force (400 lbs) is well beyond the limits of what is possible for the average cruiser especially over any length of time on a pitching foredeck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by secrabtree View Post
My procedure was to haul in the slack, go below and start cooking breakfast, go back to the bow and haul up the new slack, go below and eat breakfast, go to the bow and haul up the little remaining slack, raise the main, the wind gave enough pull to break the anchor free and then the boat was sailing and the anchor was "flying" thru the water and cleaning the mud off. And I was now in deeper water. I headed into the wind and pulled up the 20' to 30' of clean chain and anchor.
I think this is good technique.
The force when breaking out the anchor is always the greatest, if you exhaust yourself doing this the next stage of pulling up up the anchor and chain from the bottom is tough.

If you cleat the rode at close to 1:1 and let the wind force break out the anchor it is much easier.

However, modern anchors set so well that it needs a long time and a reasonable wind force to break out the anchor even at 1:1. In light wind and little swell the anchor just sits on bottom laughing .
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Old 20-08-2016, 09:40   #50
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

Mighty nyeresting. Makes me wonder if I should put a start, leisure or dual purpose battery near the windlass we are buying (approx 100 Amps)?

The battery will be wired as a separate battery bank.

From what I know the windlass will take most of its power draw from the battery. All if engine is not running. Most of it if engine is running.

Will have a not so thick wire from engine to windlass battery and intelligent charging components etc. Fat enough wire from windlass battery to windlass.

I realise it's best practice to run engine while using the windlass.

Considering this windlass, as it's cheaper than Lewmar etc:
Bada ankarspel 1200W till båtar på 40-65 fot | MarineOnline.se

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Old 20-08-2016, 18:07   #51
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

I would add my vote to the non-nanny, KISS decision to always have your windlass available, independent of main engine circuit.

Small alterations when beach tied, or tensioning long heavy lines with the vertical capstan, when setting up inside a hurricane hole, does not need the distraction of the engine running.
I like to hear the force on the lines and windlass, when fine tuning.
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Old 21-08-2016, 05:45   #52
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Re: Windlass. Powered through engine or service batteries?

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Originally Posted by secrabtree View Post
First - if you have only 200 feet of rode you shouldn't anchor in more than 40 feet (lunch hook) or 30 feet (overnight). In those depths dragging a well set anchor is rare.. .
You don't need as much scope in deep water. 6.5:1 for anchoring overnight in deep water is nice, but not required. 4:1 is quite OK in a decent bottom, although 40 feet is not quite deep water. In 30 meters of water (100 feet), 100 meters of chain (330 feet) is quite enough.

These are not theoretical questions for those of us who anchor in tidal waters with range at springs approaching 50 feet in some places.


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