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Old 18-06-2016, 13:33   #31
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

[QUOTE=RedHerring;2147127]
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Originally Posted by mdiederi View Post
Total number of sailboats sold in the U.S. from 2000 to 2014
• Number of sailboats sold in the U.S. 2000-2014 | Statistic

Fiberglass hulls live forever.
Thanks. Great chart. The rebound is probably reflecting the economy and the retiring Baby Boomers now buying something to play with in retirement. Why should a young person buy a sailboat anyways when they can go sailing in 3-d reality at home? Plus the changing face of America means that most Americans in thirty years will be Latinos, Chinese, or Middle Eastern. Not big boating cultures. Sailing for them is mostly associated with the lower classes.
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Old 18-06-2016, 13:49   #32
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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I wish the general population were better informed about the why's and wherefores/there for's of economics so that we could maintain our privileged sailing environment.
On this we agree Actually, I think the general populace understand all too well what trickle-down Regan/Thatcher economic policies have done for them. And they are not thanking you.

But to get back on track, I agree with adlib2, I will not mourn fewer numbers. And to add to the unofficial analysis, at 49/53 I'd say we're on the younger side of boaters (mostly sailors) who inhabit our current marina/club. But no one else here is a full-time cruiser. They are mostly day sailors that might get out for weekends and perhaps couple of weeks.

So since this is a cruising forum, I wonder again if cruising as we currently know it will diminish. Or perhaps the economics/environment will drive things the other way. Perhaps millennials will move into cruising as a low-cost/low-environmental impact way of life.
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Old 18-06-2016, 14:11   #33
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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Originally Posted by Mike OReilly View Post

So since this is a cruising forum, I wonder again if cruising as we currently know it will diminish. Or perhaps the economics/environment will drive things the other way. Perhaps millennials will move into cruising as a low-cost/low-environmental impact way of life.
Yes. Entirely possible. Maybe even probable. With less opportunity to grow careers I see many young people considering if the American dream is even wanted. More of a social / cultural shift that might lead the way to a new economy and life style. We already see it on a small scale. A whole economy has been created around sharing under used assets like homes and cars. Think air b&b, uber etc. This isnt rental as we know it, though there aee similarities.

This tells me that the newer generations are open to the idea of restructuring their dreams and finding new ways to get it done. Mix that drive with a healthy dose of environmental awareness and who knows where millenials will go?

As the parent of an 18 year old I can tell you, if they stick to land, it won't be out of fear of being disconnected. My son and his friends are much less wired than I am. They don't text, blog or use smart phones. This might be simple rebellion to their overly wired parents, but I think its more because all of that is just so normal and common place they take it for granted
Those of us who did not grow up with the internet are still glued to the novelty of it all..
Just think of it, my son has never been in a world without computers everywhere. Until he took an art class in high school he had never seen a film camera. This stuff is so much not a "big deal" he can ignore it the way my gen does TV.

Current policies and those from the recent past have certainly not served millenials well. But in response I think millenials, and the next generations will be ready to implement some new ideas.
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Old 18-06-2016, 15:04   #34
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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On this we agree Actually, I think the general populace understand all too well what trickle-down Regan/Thatcher economic policies have done for them. And they are not thanking you.

But to get back on track, I agree with adlib2, I will not mourn fewer numbers. And to add to the unofficial analysis, at 49/53 I'd say we're on the younger side of boaters (mostly sailors) who inhabit our current marina/club. But no one else here is a full-time cruiser. They are mostly day sailors that might get out for weekends and perhaps couple of weeks.

So since this is a cruising forum, I wonder again if cruising as we currently know it will diminish. Or perhaps the economics/environment will drive things the other way. Perhaps millennials will move into cruising as a low-cost/low-environmental impact way of life.
Low-cost? Marina rates have sky rocketed and mooring fields are being reduced if not eliminated. Equipment costs, etc have gone up consistently, beating the inflation rate. It is an expensive sport getting even more so, and more regulated. This is a world wide phenomena. Millennials are poor and getting poorer in the first world simply because of global competition and job automation. The idea of sailing as a middle class past time is fast fading away. So, yes for the rich ones, it will stay strong. For the rest, forget about it.

BTW, not sure the concept of "millennials" is even a meaningful concept. In the US, increasingly, the young are struggling immigrants trying to get ahead, raise a family, and adjust to a new life. Time for sailing? Doubt it.
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Old 18-06-2016, 15:20   #35
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

I'd say MOST people from any generation aren't interested in sailing. It's a minority interest.
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Old 18-06-2016, 15:23   #36
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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Originally Posted by Sea Dreaming View Post
Yes. Entirely possible. Maybe even probable. With less opportunity to grow careers I see many young people considering if the American dream is even wanted. More of a social / cultural shift that might lead the way to a new economy and life style. We already see it on a small scale. A whole economy has been created around sharing under used assets like homes and cars. Think air b&b, uber etc. This isnt rental as we know it, though there aee similarities.

This tells me that the newer generations are open to the idea of restructuring their dreams and finding new ways to get it done. Mix that drive with a healthy dose of environmental awareness and who knows where millenials will go?

As the parent of an 18 year old I can tell you, if they stick to land, it won't be out of fear of being disconnected. My son and his friends are much less wired than I am. They don't text, blog or use smart phones. This might be simple rebellion to their overly wired parents, but I think its more because all of that is just so normal and common place they take it for granted
Those of us who did not grow up with the internet are still glued to the novelty of it all..
Just think of it, my son has never been in a world without computers everywhere. Until he took an art class in high school he had never seen a film camera. This stuff is so much not a "big deal" he can ignore it the way my gen does TV.

Current policies and those from the recent past have certainly not served millenials well. But in response I think millenials, and the next generations will be ready to implement some new ideas.
I have to agree with you here.I have mates who are in their early twenties who really do not give a damn about connectivity these days. Unlike this forum many forums that I belonged to have died a slow death and are only populated by 40+ somethings.
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Old 18-06-2016, 15:49   #37
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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I'd say MOST people from any generation aren't interested in sailing. It's a minority interest.
Not for the ruling classes. Sailing has been right up there with hunting and golf. Sadly the ruling classes are getting smaller and composed of folks who have little leisure time. Olden days pre 1970 most professionals along the eastern seaboard would take the entire summer off to rusticate, corporate boards would essentially put their companies on auto pilot while they vacated to their summer homes. All that has mostly gone with the changing times.
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Old 18-06-2016, 15:57   #38
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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(...)

the fact that most millennials don't seem to be interested in sailing

(...)
The fact that most millennials don't seem to be interested in any physical nor intellectual activity.

Taking another selfie is not a sport. And posting nonsense on fb is not an intellectual activity.

For the nth time in human history we are learning that easy availability of food and entertainment makes us weak and dumb.

I think the next generation will spend most of their time in VR: having sex, drugs and violence.

b.
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Old 18-06-2016, 16:14   #39
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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Low-cost? Marina rates have sky rocketed and mooring fields are being reduced if not eliminated. Equipment costs, etc have gone up consistently, beating the inflation rate. It is an expensive sport getting even more so, and more regulated. This is a world wide phenomena. Millennials are poor and getting poorer in the first world simply because of global competition and job automation. The idea of sailing as a middle class past time is fast fading away. So, yes for the rich ones, it will stay strong. For the rest, forget about it.
Yes, agreed. Although there are easy ways to make living and cruising on a sailboat a lot less expensive than land life. You don't have to be in a marina all the time, nor on someone else's mooring. Equipment is expensive, but again, you don't have to have all the latest doodads.

We gave up our land house over a year ago and have lived on boat and motorcycle since then. We're saving lots of money by not maintaining even our modest little former home.

Boating life is not the cheapest way to live, but it can be pretty inexpensive if you're willing to make a few simple choices.
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Old 18-06-2016, 16:23   #40
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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The fact that most millennials don't seem to be interested in any physical nor intellectual activity.

Taking another selfie is not a sport. And posting nonsense on fb is not an intellectual activity.

For the nth time in human history we are learning that easy availability of food and entertainment makes us weak and dumb.

I think the next generation will spend most of their time in VR: having sex, drugs and violence.

b.
Congrats Barn, with this post you're definitely in the running for Grumpy Old Man of the Year award .
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Old 18-06-2016, 16:33   #41
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

My son is a millennial, just turned 30. He loves sailing and just bought his first boat, a Blue jay. He also sails with us on our Cape Dory 36 every chance. He is also a huge geek and has to have his cell at all times.
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Old 18-06-2016, 16:58   #42
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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... the changing face of America means that most Americans in thirty years will be Latinos, Chinese, or Middle Eastern.
Well, we have some Hispanic and Chinese members at our club. They are catching on fast...

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Low-cost? Marina rates have sky rocketed and mooring fields are being reduced if not eliminated. Equipment costs, etc have gone up consistently, beating the inflation rate. It is an expensive sport getting even more so...
While I can't deny the obvious, I will say that we're in North America's fourth largest city, and our cost of sailing per year (owning a small used boat, insurance, club membership with a slip, maintenance, most incidentals) is roughly equivalent to the annual cost of smoking. Here at least, one can sail in some fashion at a reasonable cost.

(And thank heavens there are so many used boats )
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Old 18-06-2016, 17:13   #43
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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Yes, agreed. Although there are easy ways to make living and cruising on a sailboat a lot less expensive than land life. You don't have to be in a marina all the time, nor on someone else's mooring. Equipment is expensive, but again, you don't have to have all the latest doodads.

We gave up our land house over a year ago and have lived on boat and motorcycle since then. We're saving lots of money by not maintaining even our modest little former home.

Boating life is not the cheapest way to live, but it can be pretty inexpensive if you're willing to make a few simple choices.
Indeed. What "costs"? An average house here is 350,000 usd. Not including insurance, taxes, maintenance, utilities etc. Or emergency repairs like the 40,000 we paid out of pocket when our house flooded. Living on a boat IS cheaper. Especially if one eschews the marina.
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Old 18-06-2016, 17:16   #44
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

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Not for the ruling classes.
Like I said, a minority interest.
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Old 18-06-2016, 18:07   #45
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Re: Will the next generation still go sailing?

Interesting question and it raises several points. Here in Australia membership of many sporting clubs particularly those that require dedication and TIME are in decline. With regard sailing, time is a big factor. Racing requires commitment and at least a full weekend day set aside. Of course cruising requires another order of commitment and time. My observation is most people these days are not prepared to put that much time into anything. There are probably many reasons for this but being "time poor" is maybe the biggest factor. Most families require 2 working adults and by the time they have worked a whole week running the kids around like chauffeurs to various activities they are pretty much exhausted. Younger people tend to go at "App" speed and are so used to pressing a button for instant gratification the concept of 6 knots and hours to go somewhere maybe isn't that attractive.

Funny thing is I would have thought the lure of cruising for younger people couldn't be more attractive than it is right now. Many young people here do not have permanent or full time jobs. The cost of housing is basically out of reach due to the stupidly high prices and a cruising boat has never been more affordable. Escape is the answer! For one or two years hard saving a person nowadays can buy a basic used sailboat that is capable of blue water cruising! Thirty years ago it required many many years of hard slog to buy or build yourself a boat. It is almost too easy now!
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