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Old 25-09-2013, 15:41   #61
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

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Two words "Ben" and "Ainsley". Crazy how little dinghies and Frankenboats both bend to the same genius. A little glory to the UK here, too.
That was the turning point in the race. But, Oracle was also just faster, but why? I guess Russell Coutes is going to fill us in later.

IMO this was a very successful Americas Cup. Now hopefully they can tweak it so more teams compete.
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Old 25-09-2013, 15:44   #62
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

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That was the turning point in the race. But, Oracle was also just faster, but why? I guess Russell Coutes is going to fill us in later.
Agree but then they lost two more after the change so the turning point was later. Boatspeed, boatspeed, boatspeed.



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Old 25-09-2013, 15:50   #63
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Two words "Ben" and "Ainsley". Crazy how little dinghies and Frankenboats both bend to the same genius. A little glory to the UK here, too.
Absolutely Ainsley seems to have made the difference. The man is a tower of willpower.

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Old 25-09-2013, 17:56   #64
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

Okay, now that this is over, what about the future? Combining NASCAR with Destruction Derby, adding a taste of ice hockey, and finishing with a cutlass and pike boarding party to win actual booty? Think of the marketing possibilities!
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Old 25-09-2013, 18:46   #65
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

for "goboatingnow"
please explain the tactical maneuvers that made the american boat win in your opinion.
I would really like to understand where you are coming from.
these races other than the starts have NOT been won by having a "tactical genius" as you perceive.
What I witnessed was pure one design close racing tactics.
I think all the tacticians in this regatta were equally world class including JK but my little grasshopper it was pure BOATSPEED that won the cup!
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Old 25-09-2013, 18:58   #66
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Correct, boatspeed won the regatta. I really hope to learn what adjustments Oracle made. After 2 races I said TNZ has this won, because faster boats always win regatta series, especially with world class talent. For Oracle to run off 8 races in a row it was pure boatspeed. I can't remember any Americas Cup where an initially slower boat got faster mid-regatta.
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Old 25-09-2013, 19:34   #67
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

Oracle always did their best to stay on foils while tacking/gybing.
Who cares if they went a bit further?
NZ did tight turns, losing boat speed whch meant they had to climb back up on foils which took TIME,
therefore losing DISTANCE TO THE MARK.

It's as simple as that.

Splitting at the down wind mark cost them as well because they made another rather square corner.
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Old 25-09-2013, 19:42   #68
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

After watching the reruns carefully, and listening to the crew, I think staying on the hydrofoils won it. Oracle was best on keeping the hulls up in the air, and therefore won the race with speed. That is how she go faster IMHO.
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Old 25-09-2013, 19:46   #69
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

Did Oracle ever say what changes they made to the boat last night? They were going to say before the start but decided against it.
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Old 25-09-2013, 20:59   #70
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

With all the data logged in the series there must be some numbers for average, median, peak speeds, and distances run, etc., for each boat.
Are they available (yet)?

I'd sure like to know more about how the controls for the (foils, wing, etc.) work (cursed to be a technophile). Like operating systems, subsystems, bussing/comms, servos, power, telemetry, etc. (not too much proprietary info, eh?).
Let alone materials, how the ef are those skinny foils, rudders and attachments tough enough?

There's got to be a lot of good stuff in there.
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Old 25-09-2013, 22:26   #71
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

According to some of the reports, Oracle fitted automatic foil trimming device, called Little Herbie, comes from Boeing, Ellison also flew boat builders in from NZ to build lower drag more high performance foils, which automatic trimming device allowed them to use, this is why they suddenly were more stable when foiling and faster due to less drag, whilst Kiwis were still having to manually adjust foils, sure Ainslie helped but auto trimming device gave boat speed
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Old 26-09-2013, 05:52   #72
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

There was so much talk about the work the Oracle team was doing after the races. But they didn't say how much was to the boat and how much was the crew.

I don't think Ainslie was the key. When Kostecki was on board, they weren't foiling as much and they were making slow tacks and gybes. You can't blame that totally on the tactician. But the fact the average age on Oracle was ten years younger than NZ could have had a lot to do with the turn of events. They were sailing very physically demanding boats. Human grinders in the place of hydraulic pumps demanding. And these guys were racing almost every day and practicing when they weren't racing. A 40 year old guy will fade a lot faster than a 30 year old when there's no time to recover. But that's just one factor.

Yesterday I saw NZ making slow tacks while earlier they were out-tacking Oracle consistently. It was a total 180 from what it was when NZ was creaming them on the upwind leg. That leg was where most races were won. What happened to NZ on the leg they had sailed almost flawlessly earlier on?

They said NZ was sailing 30% faster upwind in the AC than they were in the LV. And Oracle was still passing them. Where did they get that speed?

In most of the races Oracle won on their win streak, Spithill was very aggressive at the start and hooked Barker several times. Why did it take so long for Barker to block that move?

In yesterday's race, NZ got the jump on Oracle and pinned them in masterfully on the 2nd leg. They knew from previous races when they let Oracle split at the 2nd gate, Oracle had taken the lead. Why didn't they cover them, move for move, and stop them from getting the split? And if they couldn't, why didn't they tack ahead of them on the first cross?

In the first half of the series, Barker made all the right moves. In the second half, I didn't see as much of that. What happened? Mental fatigue?

I could be wrong on all accounts. I was sitting safely on my couch. And I don't have a lot of experience racing AC72s. So maybe I'm clueless. But that total reversal of domination has to have an explanation. Maybe the Oracle gurus will tell us one day just why that happened.
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Old 26-09-2013, 06:15   #73
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

Well said and well asked, Julie!
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Old 26-09-2013, 06:39   #74
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

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In yesterday's race, NZ got the jump on Oracle and pinned them in masterfully on the 2nd leg. They knew from previous races when they let Oracle split at the 2nd gate, Oracle had taken the lead. Why didn't they cover them, move for move, and stop them from getting the split? And if they couldn't, why didn't they tack ahead of them on the first cross?

In the first half of the series, Barker made all the right moves. In the second half, I didn't see as much of that. What happened? Mental fatigue?

I could be wrong on all accounts. I was sitting safely on my couch. And I don't have a lot of experience racing AC72s. So maybe I'm clueless. But that total reversal of domination has to have an explanation. Maybe the Oracle gurus will tell us one day just why that happened.
Simply put Oracle would have taken whichever gate ETNZ didn't take on that leg. ETNZ would have gotten really slow had they taken the gate Oracle took and allowed Oracle to slingshot around the gate ETNZ actually took.

In the second half or the series, Oracle's boat speed became a factor. When you know the other boat has boat speed on you, you have to do things a bit differently which can get you into trouble really quick. Dean Barker of ETNZ recognize the change in Oracles boat speed early on.

The two things that made the difference in the second half of the series were Oracle's boat speed, and the fact that the crew was getting up to racing form. They didn't get to race the LV Cup like ETNZ did. ETNZ came into the finals Race Ready.
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Old 26-09-2013, 08:10   #75
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Re: Will Oracle Remain Alive or Will It End Today?

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Okay, now that this is over, what about the future? Combining NASCAR with Destruction Derby, adding a taste of ice hockey, and finishing with a cutlass and pike boarding party to win actual booty? Think of the marketing possibilities!
That is probably the only thing that could make it even more exciting than it was! I like it!

Mark
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