Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 06-01-2016, 12:20   #91
Registered User
 
Snore's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: www.USCGMaster.com
Boat: Tartan 33
Posts: 1,881
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

💩

Love a good fight!!


Sent from my iPhone- please forgive autocorrect errors.
__________________

__________________
"Whenever...it requires a strong moral principle to prevent me from deliberately stepping into the street, and methodically knocking people's hats off- then, I account it high time to get to sea..." Ismael ---- NEW website! www.USCGMaster.com
Snore is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2016, 21:17   #92
Cruiser
 
waltdrechsler's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Port Gardner Bay
Boat: Moody 47
Posts: 38
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

We just looked at a number of boats and had the one we decided on surveyed. Price was never brought up by the surveyor, broker or myself. I will admit I'm that weird guy who trusts you until you give me a reason not to. In my case I wanted an unbiased value of the boat. The buyer is the customer of the surveyer and you alone determine who sees the report and thus the results. Had the boat come out below my offered price, I would use that as a negotiating tool and / or reason to back out of the deal.

We lucked out. Our broker worked very hard on our behalf and allowed us the freedom to look at a lot of boats, reviewed each one with us and never tried to move us one way or the other. We felt special until I saw him working with other clients of his. He treated all of us with the same special care.
__________________

__________________
Walt Drechsler
S/V Pellucidar ~_/)
waltdrechsler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2016, 21:42   #93
Marine Service Provider
 
SV THIRD DAY's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: La Paz, Mexico
Boat: 1978 Hudson Force 50 Ketch
Posts: 3,653
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
It is just possible that the broker reports false prices to Soldboats (I think that is the name) organization, and does not want the surveyor to rat him out. Soldboats is the group that publish actual selling prices to subscribing brokerages, and there have been reports that many of the values are inflated above reality. Dunno why, perhaps trying to inflate selling prices for later transactions.

Sheer speculation, all the above.

Jim

Bingo Jim
That's routinely done to hold up and hype up the price of used boats.
After I sold a boat using a Broker, it was funny to see the inside "broker only numbers" and the broker listed it as selling for the asking price, when we had in fact bought her for $10K LESS than the reported price...

If you think the games are limited to the boys/girls on wall street...nope.
If there is a system...it will be played...its human nature.
__________________
Rich Boren Goodbye Morro Bay...Hello La Paz, Mexico and the owner of:
Cruise RO Water High Output Water
Technautic CoolBlue Refrigeration
SV THIRD DAY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2016, 00:21   #94
er9
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2014
Boat: 1980 Mariner36
Posts: 199
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
Am I the only one who is DYING TO KNOW what boat we're talking about here???

Not telling until next week after I make decision after survey report. :P
__________________
er9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2016, 05:20   #95
Moderator
 
HappyMdRSailor's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: North Mississippi
Boat: 48 Wauquiez Pilot Saloon-C22 Chrysler Sunpiper- 19 Potter-Preparing to cruise w/my girl
Posts: 5,980
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by er9 View Post
Not telling until next week after I make decision after survey report. :P
Thanks for the information... At least I have some material now for my new thread...

"Is it ethical for for a CF member to withhold information about boat details for which he has posed an ethical question?"

Plus we need to know:
Mono or Multi...
Front end tackle...
Firearms storage capacity...


__________________
In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair...

Mai Tai's fix everything...
HappyMdRSailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2016, 20:24   #96
er9
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2014
Boat: 1980 Mariner36
Posts: 199
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
Thanks for the information... At least I have some material now for my new thread...

"Is it ethical for for a CF member to withhold information about boat details for which he has posed an ethical question?"

Plus we need to know:
Mono or Multi...
Front end tackle...
Firearms storage capacity...


mono hull

front end tackle mainly for catching blue fin tuna or the occasional mackeral :P

anti aircraft capacity, dual 50 cal bow guns, and you know a couple of surface to air missles. the usual on an equatorial bluewater cruiser...
__________________
er9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2016, 21:02   #97
Registered User
 
GoingWalkabout's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: USA & Argentina
Boat: In the market for a Lagoon 56 (seems like the perfect fit)
Posts: 1,477
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
Thanks for the information... At least I have some material now for my new thread...

"Is it ethical for for a CF member to withhold information about boat details for which he has posed an ethical question?"

Plus we need to know:
Mono or Multi...
Front end tackle...
Firearms storage capacity...


You forgot the most important. What carbon footprint does it have during manufacture. And I can't believe you left out the type of anchor
__________________
GoingWalkabout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2016, 21:36   #98
Registered User
 
OutOfControl's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Fernandina Beach, FL
Boat: Key West 2020 CC
Posts: 213
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?



Walkabout, sorry but I got tired of twisting my head 90 degrees to ogle your picture.
Here is the URL if you want to try and reset your profile pic;

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-MyaowhDmBr...ar161038_2.gif
__________________
OutOfControl
OutOfControl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 06:32   #99
Moderator
 
HappyMdRSailor's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: North Mississippi
Boat: 48 Wauquiez Pilot Saloon-C22 Chrysler Sunpiper- 19 Potter-Preparing to cruise w/my girl
Posts: 5,980
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by er9 View Post
mono hull

front end tackle mainly for catching blue fin tuna or the occasional mackeral :P

anti aircraft capacity, dual 50 cal bow guns, and you know a couple of surface to air missles. the usual on an equatorial bluewater cruiser...
Excellent !

This will take the edge off the anticipation...

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoingWalkabout View Post
You forgot the most important. What carbon footprint does it have during manufacture. And I can't believe you left out the type of anchor
Right!?!?
And how about propulsion efficiency???

I meant anchor gear when I said front end tackle... er9 likes to hook fish instead of the bottom... I'm down with that...
__________________
In the harsh marine environment, something is always in need of repair...

Mai Tai's fix everything...
HappyMdRSailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 07:41   #100
Registered User
 
IntoMyHealth's Avatar

Join Date: May 2012
Location: Connecticut
Boat: Beneteau 473
Posts: 141
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

The reality is that boat is exactly worth what the buyer has agreed to pay and the seller has . He should look to the surveyor to justify that fact. If the surveyor can't, and it's lower, a renegotiation is in order. Certainly a long conversation. If he brings it in higher, awesome. Still, have along conversation. You need to trust your surveyor. Not so much your broker. Tell the surveyor the price.


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
IntoMyHealth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 10:08   #101
Registered User
 
GoingWalkabout's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: USA & Argentina
Boat: In the market for a Lagoon 56 (seems like the perfect fit)
Posts: 1,477
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by OutOfControl View Post


Walkabout, sorry but I got tired of twisting my head 90 degrees to ogle your picture.
Here is the URL if you want to try and reset your profile pic;

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-MyaowhDmBr...ar161038_2.gif
Thanks.
__________________
GoingWalkabout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 11:07   #102
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 11
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

TO: going walkabout...
Attempting to compare the boat industry to either cars or the housing industry is an apples and oranges problem. They are very different industries. No one has to have a boat, everyone needs a house and a car. There are literally millions of houses and cars out there for a data base. Houses don't get up and move to another state or country...while they are listed for sale. The reason there is no gigantic government hand in the pot of boat sales is because the yachting industry embraced the survey function a long time ago. Problems are exposed and dealt with prior to the sale whether the Seller likes it or not.
You can go to the county courthouse or DMV and get records of car and home sales. No such report exists for the boating industry. You are also assuming that all boat sales are reported on Yachtworld's Sold Boats data base. That is not correct. Only boats that have been placed on YachtWorld by a Broker, who is, by the way, paying for that privilege, will show up on Sold Boats. It is very understandable that the information, an in-house product, is kept in-house for the use of our Brokers and their Clients. I would posit that an attempt to collect the data from individuals , especially in the case of direct Seller to Buyer transactions would be as successful as herding cats and, in the end, not profitable. Selling prices are determined by the Buyer and seller, no matter what any report says. I automatically assume that if I were to recommend any price to a Buyer, he would discount it by 10-25% with his first offer. Once in awhile, I might actually know what the Seller's bottom line is.... would it be ethical for me to just give that number to the buyer ? Of course not... will I encourage whatever offer he makes ? yes, the object is to get a discussion going between buyer and seller to arrive at a number they can both live with. As someone pointed out earlier, the broker wants to see a "Closing" he's not going to live or die on any one deal. Getting boats sold is the goal... that's what brings more customers to your brand... the state of the market is something Brokers watch and deal with...I don't personally believe I am that strong that I can control the entire boating market with my occasional sale. Hey, "It's the Economy stupid ! " coupled with supply and demand.... if you want an Acme 45 MY and there is only 1 on the market, better sharpen your negotiating skills, but if you want a Pleabargain 47 and there are 65 of them on the market over a 5 year and $100,000 point spread, there is a good chance you might score against the one Owner who is up against the wall needing to sell now... I'd worry less about the "comps" and focus on the boat I want and which Seller has the best compromise between price, condition and personal motivation to sell.
__________________
Willy MC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 12:56   #103
Registered User
 
GoingWalkabout's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: USA & Argentina
Boat: In the market for a Lagoon 56 (seems like the perfect fit)
Posts: 1,477
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Thanks WillyMC. I've r a Ken on board all of your comments and I have a clearer understanding. That is not to say that some people don't wrongly think it's in their interests to manipulate sold figures. But that being the case a well educated buyer armed with basic facts such as you have pointed out can do well. What is disruptive to the efficiency of the market is inflated figures. It causes sellers to have unrealistic expectations and can keep buyers away because of lack of faith in the industry pricing.

It is clear that brokers don't have an easy time of it. Sellers usually take a loss. And buyers are often spooked by the way things are done.

I have no intention of setting up in competition of yachtworld.com or soldboats. I would suggest that sold boats though should perhaps rethink it's model.

Kind regards,
Chaya
__________________
GoingWalkabout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 13:16   #104
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 43
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

So, after reading most of the thread, is there a place one can directly look up reported sales prices of boats or not? I am still not clear.

I understand brokers on Yachtworld report to Yachtworld in some way but do I need a broker to sign on and show those reports to me?
__________________
boatbrain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2016, 14:03   #105
Registered User
 
Cadence's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: SC
Boat: None,build the one shown of glass, had many from 6' to 48'.
Posts: 6,059
Re: Why would broker ask me not to disclose price paid to surveyor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatbrain View Post
So, after reading most of the thread, is there a place one can directly look up reported sales prices of boats or not? I am still not clear.

I understand brokers on Yachtworld report to Yachtworld in some way but do I need a broker to sign on and show those reports to me?
Probably similar to MLS on houses in the US. It is designed to protect their profession/ livelihood.

It would be nice to be able to see comps..
__________________

__________________
Cadence is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
price, survey, surveyor

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What You Paid vs the Advertised Price kiwa Dollars & Cents 51 11-01-2016 10:04
To broker, or not to broker, that is the question... letsgetsailing3 Dollars & Cents 40 29-01-2014 10:21
Should a Broker Disclose A Hurricane Damaged Boat? zeta Monohull Sailboats 45 15-05-2012 10:38
If it's Better to Buy Through a Broker-to-Broker Arrangement, I Need a Broker YesIsail Multihull Sailboats 4 14-11-2011 10:00
VAT Tax Paid / Not Paid harmonytek Dollars & Cents 2 13-07-2009 16:31



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 14:44.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.