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Old 14-08-2010, 14:01   #1
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Why I Don't Like Fin Keels

Anyone following this monkeywrench?

Warriors Wish Loses Her Keel

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Old 14-08-2010, 14:16   #2
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Quote:
Why I don't like fin keels
I don't get the point of the post?
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Old 14-08-2010, 14:20   #3
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Does this happen a lot with fin keels? Are they especially vulnerable?
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Old 14-08-2010, 15:25   #4
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Okay?

I am thinking that they must have hit something in the water to have a catastrophic separation of this magnitude... I am no expert but to have the entire fin keel just drop off into the ocean unannounced seems a little hard to believe...

Does anyone know of telltale signs that this type of event is looming or what to look for when surveying the bilge on a regular basis?

I check my bolts often looking for any indicators of loosening, corrosion or damage. Basically every time I am emptying the bilge...
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Old 14-08-2010, 15:33   #5
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Feral Cat, yeah...I'm not so sure it was a keel bolt issue since they seem to have no perceived leaks? Maybe it was indeed a collision? Certainly gives food for thought though. Very very strange. One of my concerns looking at fin/bulb designs in the market right now, but I still seem to be uncontrollably attracted to the speed and the looks of the living quarters!
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Old 14-08-2010, 16:03   #6
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This is certainly not the first boat built for racing that has lost its keel. Certainly not the first discussed on this site. It is relatively common, it seems, in the racing world to lose the keel. I have no idea what the statistics are but it happens much more often than it should, IMHO.

Oh, and there have been discussions of "cruising" boats that have lost the keel as well. And rudders on fin keel boats get lost on a regular basis.
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Old 14-08-2010, 16:09   #7
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Good thing these boats float on water and not fly in the air!
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Old 14-08-2010, 16:19   #8
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Fin Keels and balanced rudders have disadvantages and advantages. In sum, they are not great for off shore cruising. I had a C&C for ten years; it tended to be skitish and very sensitive to wind puffs and wave action. Howver it provided more lift to windward. For off shore sailing, I prefer a broader keel and a skeg hung rudder that provide a steadier ride.
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Old 14-08-2010, 16:25   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
One of my concerns looking at fin/bulb designs in the market right now, but I still seem to be uncontrollably attracted to the speed and the looks of the living quarters!
Bears no relation to the boat you or I will ever own. It's a racing boat pushed hard in Ocean racing. Just like car or bikes, if you not right on the edge you won't win.

Back in the real world, yes it might happen if you hit a coral reef, but no saying that a long keel or a cat would survive any better. If its an unaceptable risk, you can't go sailing. Would you agree that more yachts founder in coastal waters than in the middle of an ocean? because,

a. more yachts sail there and,

b. there is more things to hit.

If you agree with this then is it also not true that there must be more fin keel boats sailing in coastal waters than oceans, so why don't we read on here catastropic fails every week because across the world there must be hundreds of thousands of fin keeled yachts making coastal passages each week.

Stop worrying and go buy a boat

Btw me? I have two keels just in case

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Old 14-08-2010, 16:44   #10
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The details in any disaster like this one get far more complex than what kind of keel it is or what brand it was. It would be nice if the rules for boats would make it clear for what keels will fall off and which ones don't. For the scant information available we are all speculating why. It fell of and we won't know more until they get back to shore.

Racing boats just plain lack the ability and features for hauling lots of crap over great distances in comfort. Getting there first just isn't the same idea when it comes to cruising. If you are cruising and racing then you have yourself at cross purposes and prone to problems.
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Old 14-08-2010, 16:50   #11
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Yes, good points.

But I'm left to ponder what is a prudent action of something like this occurred and you couldn't receive support (diesel etc) - radio out, or just off the grid - or too far away for engine etc? I guess you could somehow create water or fuel ballast with jugs you may have about, and then use your storm jib to drift back to Hawaii? Intentional swamping of the boat a bit would just create slosh in a more rough seas increasing chance to capsize.

Don't know why I am fascinated by this story. Part of it is Ronnie's bad luck bio, and how he overcomes issues and sticks at it.

Pete7 - Two keels make me moody
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Old 14-08-2010, 16:54   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by pete7
Btw me? I have two keels just in case
And a skeg hung rudder.

Some boats are able to continue on with the loss of a keel, I think they are the ones with internal ballast tanks. Others turn turtle with little or no warning and sometimes the entire crew is lost without ever getting out a mayday. Some racing boats (Vendee globe for example) have escape hatches built into them.
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Old 14-08-2010, 18:06   #13
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From Ronnie's website:

Quote:
The boat has a water ballast system, but that will be disabled when I race it in the 2010 Singlehanded Transpac.
Why disable it? Would it have be enabled for the trip back?
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Old 14-08-2010, 18:24   #14
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Not all fin keels are attached by Keel bolts, right? As an example, there are steel boats with fin keels, and no keel bolts. I think your point is misguided. Perhaps it should have read, "Why I don't like bolt on keels".

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Old 14-08-2010, 18:27   #15
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It is not your normal cruising keel obviously.

Also, here is what the owner said in a comment on Ronnie's site

Initially I was concerned that keel bolts failed and that the hull might have some issues. In talking with a designer of these type boats I now think that the top part of the keel where it attaches to the hull is still there ( a flange about 12" x 36")but that the weld attaching the fin to that flange has failed.
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