Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 15-11-2010, 18:05   #16
Moderator Emeritus
 
hummingway's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gabriola Island & Victoria, British Columbia
Boat: Cooper 416 Honeysuckle
Posts: 6,933
Images: 5
Spring tides

After a spring tide here in the PNW it can get interesting. If I've seen them I give 'em a lot of room. Sort of like ice bergs, it's the unseen stuff below I worry about. Sometimes getting through tide lines is like running a guantlet.
__________________

__________________
“We are the universe contemplating itself” - Carl Sagan

hummingway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2010, 18:37   #17
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
I live in the Pacific North West, I have had two logs (about 2' in diameter and about the length of my boat bump along the side and hear of a "dead head come up through the crews quarters and out the deck of a 60' fishing trawler. Traveling down the inland water way (east coast) there were losts of signs for propeller shaft straightening services. Of all the stuff I have seen about the worst is logs but I know someone who almost hit a 55gallon drum but was lucky enough to be looking at their radar just as it bobbed up.
__________________

__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2010, 19:43   #18
Registered User
 
SvenG's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Mexico heading South
Boat: Ericson 39B - Senta II
Posts: 1,169
We just sewed a collision mat out of a blue tarp in the hope that having it would mean that we'd never need it. It is a triangle about 10' per side with a 2 lb soft weight-belt weight sewed into one corner. We have yet to rig the lines on it and try it.

I'm not sure it would help even if we needed it but at least we have it. The article in the Swedish Cruising Club magazine that made us make it was quite interesting. They contacted some outfit with a practice boat that could be holed for emergency practice. They found that even with prior discussion of how to locate the leak and what to do it still took 3 tries before the crews were good enough to not "lose" the practice vessel. Not very encouraging.

Reading another article about a steel hulled sailboat sinking within 10 minutes of striking a (presumed) container was also alarming. The lesson there was to slow down at night when you are less likely to see the danger and also less likely to see where you have been holed.

After those two articles we read about sandy beaches and palm trees and felt a lot better.



-Sven
__________________
Senta II - http://www.Grenander.com/Senta_II/Blog/Blog.html
1977 Ericson 39B -- Hull # 216
SvenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2010, 19:54   #19
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Because 5200 cures while wet (actually prefers it) I know people that carry a caulking gun full of 5200, helps seal up a collision mat. I know someone that had a large piece pf 1/4 plywood stowed :just in case", that and 5200 saved their boat.
__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 01:11   #20
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Baltic (Summer) (the boat!); somewhere in the air (me!)
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 19,737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy M View Post
Interphase 200-C. Think of it as underwater radar. Under $3000.

Cruisers & Sailing Forums - Roy M's Album: Interphase 200C Scanning Sonar
I have a system similar to this. Entirely useless for spotting floating containers in time to dodge them. At six knots you're moving at about 3 meters per second. That device has a practical range -- the distance at which you get a clear blob which is not just a flicker on the screen -- is what, 30 meters, at best?

So in ideal conditions you would have maybe 10 seconds from a clear blob on the screen to impact, at 6 knots (we usually sail faster). You would have to have two people watching the screen 24/7 (so they could trade off every 10 minutes or so -- can't stare continuously) and ready to shout at the helmsman, who by he way would always have to be right on his station ready to instantly put off the autopilot and steer.

Ain't gunna happen.
__________________
Dockhead is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 05:57   #21
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 3,898
There have been some interesting previous threads:

Floating Containers in the Ocean

Crash Blankets and Hull Damage

Common causes of cruising boats being lost at sea?
__________________
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 06:43   #22
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,828
Images: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by hpeer View Post
There have been some interesting previous threads:
in any of those threads have any of our actual members ever actually hit a container at sea?

I think you will find the answer is no.

But if theres evedence to the contrary show me the post
__________________
Notes on a Circumnavigation.
OurLifeAtSea.com

Somalia Pirates and our Convoy
MarkJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 07:23   #23
Registered User
 
Tortuga's Lie's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Virginia
Boat: Tartan 4100
Posts: 384
Several years ago, my wife and I were heading into Baltimore harbor when we hit a submerged rail-road tie. After impact, I looked behind us and saw it bobbing up and noticed that it still had spikes in it. I immediately checked the bilge for water and was relieved that there was none. Afer we tied up to the marina as a transient, we saw that a diver was replacing props on a power boat across from us. We asked the owner what happened....he hit the same railroad tie. I dived on our boat and the only thing that occurred was a little creosote smudges on the leading edge of our keel. Our prop was spared
__________________
Tortuga's Lie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 08:51   #24
Registered User
 
svHyLyte's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Tampa Bay area, USA
Boat: Beneteau First 42
Posts: 3,432
Images: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucast70 View Post
The last 20 years or so, containers are designed to sink if they fall off the ship....
Great in theory. In real life, not so much. E.g., Liz and Andy Copeland bashed into the corner of a container floating corner up while sailing Bagherra in the Med. Fortunately, the First 38 is well built and Andy had filled the space between the hull and structural liner below the anchor well with high density foam. The skin of the hull was damaged at the bows, though likely not enough to have sunk the boat, but the foam prevented water intrusion and they were able to make repairs without undue difficulty.

For our part, we banged into a dead-head one evening while sailing from Catalina to Long Beach in 1988, about mid-way. No damage to the hull but the damned thing broke our shaft strut leaving us unable to motor. Fortunately, winds were favorable and we were able to sail right into our slip at Alamitos Bay YC without difficulty. In our wake, the thing looked like a vey big piling floating vertically with the top just at the water's surface. It gave me the chills... We were lucky.

FWIW...
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the Sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."
svHyLyte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 09:27   #25
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Considering the large number of stray logs up here in the PNW (there is a paper mill next door) I am surprised that that none of these power boats running at 20knots has ever hit one. Up in BC I have heard over the VHF warnings of stray logs and some marinas up there give away flags you can stick on a log and report.
__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 09:35   #26
Registered User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, Wash.
Boat: no longer on my Cabo Rico 38 Sanderling
Posts: 1,794
Send a message via MSN to John A
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
in any of those threads have any of our actual members ever actually hit a container at sea?

I think you will find the answer is no.

But if theres evedence to the contrary show me the post
Several years ago a HC 33 did an emergency haul-out after hitting something sumeraged outside of the SF Golden Gate. It had a two inch square notch in the front of its full keel which had not been there before.

Social Media had not been 'invented' yet so there is no post.

If your boat sinks while off-shore and you're not rescued there will be no post from the skipper. Rather he will be blamed for poor seamanship.
__________________
John A is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 10:00   #27
Registered User
 
Capt Phil's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Stateline NV
Boat: Prior boats: Transpac 49; DeFever 54
Posts: 2,749
That's why 'deadheads' are called 'widow makers' in the PNW... Capt Phil
__________________
Capt Phil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 10:36   #28
Senior Cruiser
 
roverhi's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Kona, Hawaii, Carlsbad, CA
Boat: 1969 Pearson 35 #108 & 1976 Sabre 28
Posts: 6,003
Send a message via Yahoo to roverhi
Refrigeration containers are heavily insulated and tightly sealed. The will undoubtedly sink if filled with water but that could take a long time to happen. There have been a lot of unexplained boat losses that could very well be container strikes. A Westsail 32 that sank north of Hawaii comes to mind. The epirbs automatically actuated as did the life rafts but no sign of crew or the boat and no distress signal. Moderate sea and wind conditions. Whatever happened to that boat, it sank almost instantly. If you've read the account of the fellow who hit a container and drifted for months in his raft afterwards, you know these things will rip the heart out of a boat and sink it in the blink of an eye.

According to one reliable source, more than 10,000 containers go 'walk about' each year. That's a whole lot of big metal boxes that could potentially be floating around waiting to nail you. It's really nothing to worry yourself to death about, however. They are floating so low in the water that you'd probably never see it before hitting it unless you were really really lucky. It really wouldn't matter how close a watch you are maintaining, if it's your time, it's your time. Go sailing and enjoy the experience.

FWIW, about the only boat construction that might survive a container hit is steel or aluminum and even they would be suspect if you hit the corner of a container.
__________________
roverhi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 10:49   #29
Registered User
 
NotQuiteLost's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Paradise (better known to most people as: Philippines)
Boat: 65' Custom Steel Ketch
Posts: 322
Images: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by roverhi View Post
FWIW, about the only boat construction that might survive a container hit is steel or aluminum and even they would be suspect if you hit the corner of a container.
Have often wondered how effective those forward-looking sonar units are for detecting these things? I can't imagine the range is anything special, so it would seem to be nothing more than a 'brace for impact!' alarm.

And yeah, if you hit a container corner on one side of your boat, it's hard to imagine anything outside of the big ships surviving with nothing more than a dent.
NotQuiteLost is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-11-2010, 16:09   #30
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 3,898
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
in any of those threads have any of our actual members ever actually hit a container at sea?

I think you will find the answer is no.

But if theres evedence to the contrary show me the post
I found at least one.
__________________

__________________
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
collision, security

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale: Crewsaver 6-Person Liferaft in Rigid Container - In Sydney, Australia CaptStarboard Classifieds Archive 2 11-10-2010 18:51
Whale/Container Collision chad.lawie General Sailing Forum 42 07-05-2008 16:07
Container ship accidents MysticGringo Off Topic Forum 1 15-08-2007 12:14
A proper fuel dispensing container Rick Product or Service Reviews & Evaluations 12 25-06-2007 23:37
Container Ship Capsizes in Belgian Port knottybuoyz Off Topic Forum 21 13-03-2007 09:12



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:41.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.