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Old 08-11-2018, 10:31   #31
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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People on "expeditions" usually want to be noticed by others; My favourite kind of cruisers just want to get on with it, and "slip below the radar"
And you know a lot of "expedition" cruisers? And what about those you don't know? How you know what's usual if you don't know them all? I know you're another Jon Snow

That aside, expedition could be to local coves and creeks. Pretty much anything unconventional what comes to places and aren't mentioned in Pilot books or Sailing magazines..
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Old 08-11-2018, 10:39   #32
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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Expedition Cruising is any night spent not tied to a dock with water and power.


By "Dog house", do you mean hard dodger ?
Dog house is the raised roof companionway..
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Old 08-11-2018, 10:43   #33
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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Well, the OP was asking something a bit different I think. As in “What is an Expedition Boat” as opposed to a “Blue Water Boat.” But since we can’t agree on Blue Water I give up on Expedition.
I think you are getting closer. There is a class of boat these days called an "expedition trawler". I suppose you take one on an "expedition cruise".
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Old 08-11-2018, 10:47   #34
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

As someone who did field research for many years, I'd say an "expedition" is a purposeful journey that requires long-term self-sufficiency. It requires a great deal of logistics, compared with a mere field trip (cruise). However, once a robust logistical model is worked out, it is usually relatively easy to repeat it with a variety of different destinations and environments.

(Only one organization that I worked for felt the need to hold press conferences, which I found very strange...)
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Old 08-11-2018, 11:10   #35
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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Originally Posted by Bruce K View Post
People on "expeditions" usually want to be noticed by others; My favourite kind of cruisers just want to get on with it, and "slip below the radar"
That's a pretty cynical way of looking at it but I can't argue that those who go on expeditions, usually do have something to prove.

But it isn't always about themselves

In 1999-2000 I got to know Peter Blake and his wife quite well in Auckland as the super yacht I was running was being used by Louis Vuitton for the Americas Cup.
The LV Group was also a big sponsor of the Cousteau Society, which Peter then served as their Captain of Calypso 2, so he spent a lot of time on board our yacht talking to sponsors and we became friends over 3-4 months of working together

Listening to his plans for upcoming expeditions to highlight environmental issues, it was not about him, but the opportunity to learn and showcase some bad situations.

Given all the justified accolades thrown at him as NZ sailing hero, it definitely made him confident and centered on what he could accomplish.
But I never, ever felt he was doing it for any kind of self aggrandisement.

He just knew he could probably use Calypso 2 better than anyone else, to help the environment.
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Old 08-11-2018, 11:18   #36
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

My take on expedition cruising is that it covers any areas where facilities for recreational boating are not going to be in reach for an extended period and may include not being able to resupply. The challenges include such things as larger water tanks, backup food, long range com's and carrying more tools and spares. The boat needs to be well prepared but more importantly better know to the crew. You need to be able to fix problems without help or outside supplies.
Two specifics that spring to mind. Charts. Accurate small scale charts are unlikely to be available so you need skills such as being able to enter an anchorage by dingy, assess it and make a basic chart. You also need to understand how to plan a coastal passage with less information. The same applies to weather info.
Second one is to reduce reliability on complex tech. If a chart plotter goes down you won't be able to fix or replace it. The same applies to a water maker. Yes you can try to carry a lot of spares for important systems but this is very expensive and takes lots of space. You also have to worry about keeping the spares in serviceable condition (A problem in tropical areas particularly). A better approach is the KISS principal and learning how to do without. Ideally you should aim to be able to make a significant passage with no electricity. A step up is ensuring that you can run on mobile battery powered gear that can be separately charged via solar power.
Expedition planning is all about organization, experience and flexibility. I disagree with the comments about it being necessarily expensive. Throwing money at it does not work. In some cases using simpler but more robust equipment actually makes it cheaper. For example a thanked sail is more field serviceable the a curling one but also much cheaper.
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Old 08-11-2018, 12:30   #37
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

An outfit called Rubicon 3 has two 58' sailboats that do "expedition cruising" in all parts of the world. I have signed up for a two week sail from Jamaica to Cuba with most of it cruising the Cuban coast. It is a UK company. You can look it up on Google.
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Old 08-11-2018, 12:48   #38
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

World Sailing guidelines link: https://www.sailing.org/specialregs for yachts heading offshore are normally Cat 1.
Given what the OP said about high latitude locations then Cat 0 rather Cat 1 requirements according to their guidelines.
It's basically the ability to exist for several weeks without outside outside assistance, including medical.

Oh and OP if in stating Aukland Islands (ie. the archipelago about 600nm south of New Zealand) they're actually the Auckland Islands. A permit to visit is very difficult to gain.
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Old 08-11-2018, 13:03   #39
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

I do a lot of planning and run a fair number of contingencies in my current desk job. (Yeah, I know and please don't remind me a desk is not a sailboat nor is it in the middle of nowhere.) So all this sounds like a worthwhile challenge. I agree with all the comments about sufficiency, safety and redundancy.

I think Jim Cates cynicism is well founded in that a lot of people buy the dream instead of living the reality (and here I am at my desk...hmmm.) Having said that, there are also a lot of worthy causes that are brought to light because of well funded expeditions with very public boisterous bigger than life personalities. More power to those guys. I'd say most of them believe in their cause and deserve the accolades.

And then there's the people who really do the exploring in their backyard. Hell, there's a Texas200 race here in the Gulf of Mexico. Mostly home made skiffs/sailboats skidding along the Texas coast camping along the way in June. Those guys and gals got some serious grit.
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Old 09-11-2018, 02:37   #40
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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Only if you have Alzheimer's.
LOL

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Baltic is not counted as expedition 10nm north from my whereabouts..
Had to try!
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Old 09-11-2018, 02:49   #41
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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@mglonnro- Are you in really in Finland? And are you really a naked sailor? That kind of debunks the whole “anywhere you need a winter coat” theory. Sorry Jammer ; )
Yes, Finland here, ahoy!

My mind went into an infinite loop trying to solve this dilemma, this is bad
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:06   #42
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

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Obviously no one objective definition, but to me implies "exploring" far off the beaten track, strongly built well equipped with technology and for self-sufficiency in primitive locations.

I would consider a boat traveling far up the Amazon to have earned the label, does not need to mean in icy waters.

I would consider the travels of MingMing to be exploration cruising.



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Old 09-11-2018, 04:19   #43
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

I'm thinking ice in the water, howling winds, heavy external chain plates for standing rigging, steel hulls, life rafts, rifles, strict adherence to jack line protocol, extreme attention to weather, augmented medical and self-reliance skills, not recommended for senior sailors.....or maybe an expedition to more temperate locales
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Old 09-11-2018, 04:23   #44
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

KON-TIKI would be too an expedition, check out "Burghard Pieske" doing singlehanded the captain Bligh mutiny of the bounty tour (bounty bay).

This are barefoot sailing expeditions.
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Old 09-11-2018, 06:44   #45
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Re: What the hell is "expedition cruising" and what's the difference?

If you are sailing the Strait of Magellan and Patagonia you are expedition cruising...
GRP hulls can very well do it, though I hope you have insulation and a diesel heater...
I guess the main thing is to be able to be self sufficient, in water, energy and maintenance/repairs, thus you must have lots of spare parts and tools.
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