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View Poll Results: "What kind of Cruiser are you?
I have done or currently am a “Blue Water Cruiser” (BWC) 39 46.43%
I have a definite plan and date when I will become a BWC 10 11.90%
I am a “Coastal/Local Area Cruiser”, with no real BWC experience 26 30.95%
I am a “Dreaming Cruiser” who sails, but will never be a BWC 0 0%
I am a yacht “Wanna Be”; I don’t own/lease a yacht 9 10.71%
Voters: 84. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 20-07-2009, 23:45   #61
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Not "quite the facts" TJ

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
It is impossible to know if a moderator or anyone else who opens this poll thread has voted or not, even if that person left a comment.
Sorry TJ, that is not true. I can see who has voted in each category, and had assumed so could anyone else who had voted. Thus, based on when I last checked (a few moments ago) I can confirm, unless I've missed someone, that NO Moderator has participated!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
But, just for the record, when I was 18 I was a fare collector on the Balboa Island Ferry. And the first time I sailed from Long Beach to Avalon, the water was very blue for almost the entire "passage," so I'm calling myself a Blue Water Sailor. .
Glad to learn that you have some form, albeit a pathetic one, of BW sailing. Now please vote!

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
What these non-members cannot do, however, is post without registering, which also prevents them from voting in polls.
For that reason, posting the number of times this poll has been opened with the reader not voting in the poll is meaningless...... all of the many posts to the thread that merely comment on the poll (of which a dozen, or so, are BlueSovereign's), with the poster not voting while posting that commentary, skew the numbers that much more. Of course, members can only vote once, so additional visits to the poll thread by those who have already voted cannot result in additional votes, yet those repeat visits will increase the number of "views."
I agree 110% with your conclusion. The voter versus viewer ratio is irrelevant, and has no value what-so-ever! Thanks for the additional information that clarifies that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
BlueSovereign may also be unaware that most registered members don't care to participate in polls of any kind, for a multitude of reasons or no reason at all, even if they take the time to open such a thread and see what it's about...
I disagree with your conclusion 110%. Consistent with research on poll participation, especially as associated with organisational study polls (i.e. surveys), the vast array of your "multitude of reasons and no reason at all" can be distilled down to subjectively driven by ego (I don't like the poll so I won't participate) and/or fear based on insecurity (I don't want people to have any information that could be associated with me, as I fear it could somehow be used against me). Both I still submit are forces operating, and resulting in individuals not participating in this poll, including all of CF's Moderators . No doubt GM will bust his nuts trying to find data to dispute this claim ... I will not assist him ... I want to beat him that debate
That side, I might be forgiven for thinking that each and every Moderator has not participated simply because of "no reason at all"

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
In addition, given these flaws in the collection of data through a poll such as the one BlueSovereign has concocted, this poll can never be anything more than what one might find in the back pages of a woman's magazine
I might be forgiven you are accusing members of this site as .... aaaah never mind

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
containing no "quantifiable criteria," whatever that means, and, ipso facto, has no hope of being "validated."
Sorry TJ, however by my defining for the purpose of a poll, a BWC as "someone who has sailed outside the 200 mile limit" is a quantifiable criteria, an thus your use of ipso facto is flawed. As it petains to your use of validated, as it pertains to the statistical definition of valid, you are correct. However that was never the intent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TaoJones View Post
Thus, making the "information informative," as it was put in the first post, is impossible."
Sorry TJ, you are wrong once again, and you and your fellow Moderators have contributed to any degree of it being "impossible".

By definition "informative" means serving to inform, which was most certainly the poll's purpose. Perhaps if you and the other moderators, along with the "able to vote members who did view the poll and have not voted", were to participate and vote, this poll could be more "informative"???

Perhaps each Moderator who well knows this poll exists (most if not all of you), can individually inform us as to why each has not yet participated???

I'd bet the ranch, that few if any Moderators will be that forthright, or vote. Care to demonstrate that conclusion is inaccurate??? .
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Old 21-07-2009, 00:52   #62
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This poll is bogus

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueSovereign View Post
Glad to learn that you have some form, albeit a pathetic one, of BW sailing. Now please vote!


I agree 110% with your conclusion. The voter versus viewer ratio is irrelevant, and has no value what-so-ever! Thanks for the additional information that clarifies that.


Both I still submit are forces operating, and resulting in individuals not participating in this poll, including all of CF's Moderators . No doubt GM will bust his nuts trying to find data to dispute this claim ... I will not assist him ... I want to beat him that debate
That side, I might be forgiven for thinking that each and every Moderator has not participated simply because of "no reason at all"

Sorry TJ, you are wrong once again, and you and your fellow Moderators have contributed to any degree of it being "impossible".

By definition "informative" means serving to inform, which was most certainly the poll's purpose. Perhaps if you and the other moderators, along with the "able to vote members who did view the poll and have not voted", were to participate and vote, this poll could be more "informative"???


I'd bet the ranch, that few if any Moderators will be that forthright, or vote. Care to demonstrate that conclusion is inaccurate??? .
Following is the extent of the ‘information’ that I have garnered from BS’s ‘poll’.
As of recently, 58 CF members voted in a mixed bag of responses. (see poll results)
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, gives any validity or credence to any of the votes. This can be proved.
In reading this thread, it seems this poll has created animosity and contempt among some CF members.
Other than that, it is much like a train wreck. You hate to see it happen, but can’t help looking as you pass by.
IMHP my original post is confirmed. I was intrigued by the heading of this post and clicked on the thread to check it out. It turned ugly from the get-go and has not fully recovered. Reminds me of the adage ‘You can attract more flies with honey than with vinegar’.
I will continue to sail where I like, when I like, and look forward to meeting at least some of the CF members on the high seas whatever the color.
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Old 21-07-2009, 02:38   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dune View Post
Following is the extent of the ‘information’ that I have garnered from BS’s ‘poll’.
As of recently, 58 CF members voted in a mixed bag of responses. (see poll results)
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, gives any validity or credence to any of the votes. This can be proved.
In reading this thread, it seems this poll has created animosity and contempt among some CF members.
Other than that, it is much like a train wreck. You hate to see it happen, but can’t help looking as you pass by.
IMHP my original post is confirmed. I was intrigued by the heading of this post and clicked on the thread to check it out. It turned ugly from the get-go and has not fully recovered. Reminds me of the adage ‘You can attract more flies with honey than with vinegar’.
I will continue to sail where I like, when I like, and look forward to meeting at least some of the CF members on the high seas whatever the color.
There you have it Ladies and Gentlemen. Direct from another "Opinions" mouth. A CF member with a big opinion, obviously a corresponding ego, who would rather express his subjective views and be afraid to "cast his vote", as that might just risk his "showing his cards" ........

A member who can't even send and/or receive private messages ... a "great communicator"!

As it pertains to his statement: "look forward to meeting at least some of the CF members on the high seas", I suspect those who unlike him, were not afraid to vote will be thinking: "not if I see you first"
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Old 21-07-2009, 02:59   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueSovereign View Post
For the record, please do not incorrectly interpret my statement in my initial post:

"I suspect both advertizers on this site, and members with specific interests would find this information informative."

I DID NOT initiate this poll for some commercial reason/group, or with any specific group in mind. Be assured, neither is the case.

That said, I will be periodically update the ratio of views to voters, as well as how many Moderators participate.

It would be interesting to know what our Moderator's sailing experience actually is.

As of this post there are 23 votes out of 165 viewers, and no Moderators voting.

I wonder what over 140 people and the 5 Moderators currently on-line, have to hide???
Touchy touchy.

Relax, as I'm sure no one has anything to hide.

I guess they like me just can't be bothered to respond to such a poll. The worlds got a funny enough view on putting people in boxes - so helping someone like you to do that on this site is never going to work.

You pose your poll with one rationale saying it is for advertisers etc, and then demonstrate it's got nix to do with that when you don't get the reasponse you expect. Silly.

Chill my friend. I think most site users don't care how much sailing 'experience' you've got so please - don't bother to tell us.

Plus I am more interested in our moderators skills at running a good site (which I think they do) than trying to bully them into fessing up what form or even how much sailing they've done.


Peace.
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Old 21-07-2009, 03:26   #65
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Wow - this thread is up there with mono-multi debates and anchor arguments.
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Old 21-07-2009, 04:17   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swagman View Post
Touchy touchy.
Relax, as I'm sure no one has anything to hide.
I guess they like me just can't be bothered to respond to such a poll. The worlds got a funny enough view on putting people in boxes - so helping someone like you to do that on this site is never going to work.
You pose your poll with one rationale saying it is for advertisers etc, and then demonstrate it's got nix to do with that when you don't get the reasponse you expect. Silly.
Chill my friend. I think most site users don't care how much sailing 'experience' you've got so please - don't bother to tell us.
Plus I am more interested in our moderators skills at running a good site (which I think they do) than trying to bully them into fessing up what form or even how much sailing they've done.
Peace.
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There you have it Ladies and Gentlmen, another "Opinion", who in this case takes out of context one statement, twists it to serve his own clearly stated subjective view, in order to justify his position.

Wouldn't you just love to have someone like him sitting on your jury and be responsible for reaching an unbiased verdict??? . Someone who only hears one statement made, makes a judgement, without taking the time to listen to all the testimony presented??? Mate, may I suggest you sharpen your reading skills ..... and take time to assimilate all of my posts
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Old 21-07-2009, 04:30   #67
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BS by name BS by nature?

I think you need to get out more Lots more to do in the world than deliberately being a tw#t on the internet..............but that's only if your mum lets you of course
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Old 21-07-2009, 04:44   #68
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Quote:
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Wouldn't you just love to have someone like him sitting on your jury and be responsible for reaching an unbiased verdict???
Yes I would like to have Swagman on my jury, he seems like a decent bloke - assuming I ever caught for my crimes
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Old 21-07-2009, 04:48   #69
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At the risk of really taking this off course - have you ever considered that 12 people on the street are flat out agreeing what day of the week it is - but thats how how jury system works.

Sorry - as you were - back to the who has the biggest offshore kahunas debate.
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Old 21-07-2009, 05:07   #70
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Whether you agree with the idea of this poll or not, let's leave the personality debates out of this please.

Thank you.
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Old 21-07-2009, 06:05   #71
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Sure glad I responded to the poll before reading this string. I didn't know I was suppose to be upset, angry, insulted, and violated by responding to it. I thought it was just a simple poll. By the way I could care less if someone is a Coasty, BWS, or a BTS (Bath Tub Sailor) for that matter as long as their having fun.

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Old 21-07-2009, 06:30   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueSovereign View Post
Regarding your "level of experience": some people have 12 years of experience, some have 3 years of experience 4x, some have 4 years of experience 3x, some have 2 years of experience 6x, etc. The word you are referring to is called competence, and no poll short of actually testing individuals will give you that data.

As it pertains, to most of your other re-definitions: that is what you've in effect done in your response; re-defined the polling categories. I didn't poll whether you are "a Dreamer", the poll defines "Dreaming Cruiser" as someone who sails but has no plans to ever BWC.

Bottom-line: there are no "BUT"s when taking polls. there are only defined categories, and votes within each one. I.E no one voted for Obama or Bush and was able to right next to their vote "BUT"

Finally, and as it pertains to your "real cruisers hate to be pigeon-holed”: that I am quite coinfident, professionally speaking, more accurately equates to "whose egos and/or insecurity prevents them from voting"

Coincidently, to date NOT ONE Moderator has voted ...

I'm glad you also feel it would be rewarding to learn the make-up of the indididuals how view on this board.

Be assured to date the "voter to viewer ratio", and "no Moderator participation" offers the most informative insight......
Once in a while you meet a character whose objective is anything but!...... and seems to delight in stirring up personal slights and attacks on those who simply and politely query the validity of what they are trying to do, or infuse suspicions on neutral Moderators.

For the record:
  • Experience does not equal competency
  • Ego has nothing to do with trying to qualify a meaningful response
  • Clerics make unfortunate shipmates!
  • A sailor who tries to pigeon hole his response to every situation is usually the one who ends up wrecked on the beach.

In the end, the tenor of this pollster now makes me simply state:

“Perfect Example of when to Ignore!”…. which I will now proceed to do
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Old 21-07-2009, 06:38   #73
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Quote:
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Whether you agree with the idea of this poll or not, let's leave the personality debates out of this please.

Thank you.
HA! I thought the idea of this poll was to have personality debates! I was sure it was a psychology experiment having to do with acrimonious debates on public forums. By the way, I didn't vote in the poll. I didn't see any added value in voting on a poll that attempted to define who I am by my experience. In case anyone was wondering. I have coastal cruising experience.
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Old 21-07-2009, 07:13   #74
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HA! I thought the idea of this poll was to have personality debates! I was sure it was a psychology experiment having to do with acrimonious debates on public forums.
Actually, you are correct. So, who shall we eat first?
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Old 21-07-2009, 07:17   #75
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who shall we eat first?
That sounds like could make another poll
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