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Old 20-09-2013, 16:51   #226
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pirate Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Originally Posted by frank_f View Post
I was just looking at Dockhead's sailing area using Live Ships Map - AIS - Vessel Traffic and Positions.

No wonder you know a thing or two about the COLREGs.

There are hundreds of ships in there at this minute moving between 10 and 25 knots. There's even what looks like a sailboat race coming out of the Solent heading towards France (looks like 15 or more) and these are only the boats with AIS.

It looks like the LA freeway at rush hour.
LOL... that'll likely be the Friday night sail to Cherbourg for the W/end... likely a few heading outa Poole as well
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Old 20-09-2013, 16:53   #227
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Actually it's been mentioned, although not quoted (thank you). That is the situation where I live. Tampa Bay is quite shallow, and so is the Gulf of Mexico, especially within, say, 25 miles of shore in most places. A very specific channel has been cut for freighters and cruise liners. That actually makes it easier because you know exactly where that big boat is going to be, because if it doesn't, it's going to run aground. There is absolutely no doubt that those freighters and cruise ships are the stand-on vessels. They have nowhere to go except through that channel.

I'm not sure the path for the ferry was that cut and dried in the accident that started this discussion. Nevertheless, something went very wrong that day, and it's the little boat that's going to sink, not the big one. I could be wrong, but I believe I am capable of staying clear of ferries. The guy who lost his boat must also be capable of it, since apparently he sailed those waters for fifty years. I think it was so familiar to him that he didn't think about it being a poor choice to get so involved with his electronics where he was. For fifty years he was somehow able to stay out of those ferries' way, and I believe I would be able to do the same thing -- under sail or under power. It's not rocket science.

This has all been a giant pissing contest to try to prove that some people "know the colregs" better than others. A tremendous amount of ego has been involved. To me it reminds me of tin soldiers marching around. Behavior counts as much as seamanship. I'm not going to stand on my little 31' sailboat and announce "I'm the stand on vessel -- YOU MOVE." I'm going to get out of the way, and YES, I will do it in a timely way so I do not end up under that freighter's bow.

I believe the man who lost his boat has managed to do exactly that for 50 years, and for whatever reason, he had a *really serious* lapse of attention at just the wrong time. Unfortunately for him I think there's no excuse. I think he may have been out of the ferry captain's scope of concern, and his boat shifted direction while he was looking at the electronics, and by the time he was in the path of danger the ferry captain couldn't even see him. That's what I think happened.

I'm not going to pound on it but that's what I think happened. I think the sailboat moved into a collision course in a way that made the collision inevitable.

Talking about the fog earlier was just excuse-making. It wasn't foggy when the accident happened.
That does it for me, that's really convincing, don't let any reports or facts get in the way, hang the sailor...or at the very least fine him for scratching the ferry and making it late!!
It must be right, a serial poster on the internet says so, it must be right and we save the expense of a hearing, that's a good thing isn't it.
Well done, well done.
Do chugging and trampolines get into this somewhere, no maybe not.
I'm starting to have doubts, doctor oh doctor!!!
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:05   #228
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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LOL... that'll likely be the Friday night sail to Cherbourg for the W/end... likely a few heading outa Poole as well

the bulk wine brigade I always called them . properly stocking up for Christmas

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Old 20-09-2013, 17:06   #229
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Originally Posted by Rakuflames
I could be wrong, but I believe I am capable of staying clear of ferries. The guy who lost his boat must also be capable of it, since apparently he sailed those waters for fifty years.
Or does it prove that the ferry skippers are usually capable of not running into sailboats? Raku, you seem to be imagining things, rather than understanding the realities of some situations. Do the math: in some cases you may not be "capable of staying clear of ferries". This may have been one of those cases -- I don't know.
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:06   #230
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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LOL... that'll likely be the Friday night sail to Cherbourg for the W/end... likely a few heading outa Poole as well
God, I just thought of something.

I'm looking at this in real time. Where I'm at, it's 7:00pm and where they are at is 5 hours ahead so it 11:00pm there. They're doing this at NIGHT.

Oh man, I'm heading for the liquor cabinet just thinking about that.
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:08   #231
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

[QUOTE=Rakuflames;1344753]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post

But of course you know I wasn't talking about your situation.

If I see A FERRY I'm going to stay out of its way.

If I see ten big ships I'm going to need a change of clothes.
Thats fine Raku, we appreciate your candour, I can't imagine your wardrobe on a busy night in the English channel.

But please just stop telling everyone that cut & run always works .

Tks

Dave
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:12   #232
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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God, I just thought of something.

I'm looking at this in real time. Where I'm at, it's 7:00pm and where they are at is 5 hours ahead so it 11:00pm there. They're doing this at NIGHT.

Oh man, I'm heading for the liquor cabinet just thinking about that.
The sailboats are getting stuck in now
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:16   #233
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pirate Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Originally Posted by frank_f View Post
God, I just thought of something.

I'm looking at this in real time. Where I'm at, it's 7:00pm and where they are at is 5 hours ahead so it 11:00pm there. They're doing this at NIGHT.

Oh man, I'm heading for the liquor cabinet just thinking about that.
Mate... its knock of work in London or where ever.. a mad drive to the marina.. pile on the boat and away... get there in time for Café au lait and fresh croissants before the Super Stores open...
Night sails are the best..
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:20   #234
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Mate... its knock of work in London or where ever.. a mad drive to the marina.. pile on the boat and away... get there in time for Café au lait and fresh croissants before the Super Stores open...
Night sails are the best..
Guess I better cinch up my panties and get out there sailing more.
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:20   #235
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Originally Posted by frank_f View Post
God, I just thought of something.

I'm looking at this in real time. Where I'm at, it's 7:00pm and where they are at is 5 hours ahead so it 11:00pm there. They're doing this at NIGHT.

Oh man, I'm heading for the liquor cabinet just thinking about that.
LOL, well, don't let me stand between you and your liquor cabinet, but it's actually easier at night. You can better perceive the aspect of the ships by their nav lights so you're better oriented. I love doing it at night.
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:24   #236
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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LOL, well, don't let me stand between you and your liquor cabinet, but it's actually easier at night. You can better perceive the aspect of the ships by their nav lights so you're better oriented. I love doing it at night.
Ive had a few close ones at night in the channel, Its obviously easier in good light , but night time is fun. I prefer crossing the TSS areas in daylight in the channel if possible, though it never seems to quite work like that

I fully agree with your earlier comments on AIS, it sure does lesson the "pucker" factor. and yes reduces the tendency to "bail and dodge"


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Old 20-09-2013, 17:28   #237
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

The Julia is cutting right through the pack.

This is like NASCAR for boats.
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:37   #238
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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Some posts here remind that many people do not sail in high density large shipping areas, especially with large high speed ferries doing 35-40 like these boys ( and thats a small one)

Yes of course in simple situations of course you stay away and avoid close quarters , I change course well before the COLREGS apply.

BUT, in close situations , or when one of these boys comes out of low vis at 40 knots, you have no choice but to apply the COLREGS. Not applying them gets you killed, applying them only might get you killed.

And btw the way using the VHF, don't make me laugh the boat would over the stern before you got the working channel sorted out.

Dave

As for the radio not working, that would kind of depend on when you started contact, wouldn't it?

Except for that, you said nothing that hasn't been said here over and over and over.

So now all of a sudden everyone agrees that staying out of the way is a good strategy.

I'm so glad we got that straightened out.

So the pissing contest is officially over? PLEASE say yes!
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:39   #239
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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and lots of it is monitored by UK and French radar, you get your arse handed to you in fines if you don't know your COLREGS.

dave

Drat. Still pissing.
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Old 20-09-2013, 17:41   #240
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Re: What can happen when you cut off a ferry

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That does it for me, that's really convincing, don't let any reports or facts get in the way, hang the sailor...or at the very least fine him for scratching the ferry and making it late!!
It must be right, a serial poster on the internet says so, it must be right and we save the expense of a hearing, that's a good thing isn't it.
Well done, well done.
Do chugging and trampolines get into this somewhere, no maybe not.
I'm starting to have doubts, doctor oh doctor!!!
Exeunt stage left.

I'm so sorry you don't recognize speculation when you read it. It's a GUESS. I SAID it's a guess. What is the matter with you?
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