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Old 02-08-2016, 04:14   #31
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove View Post
This was a per man, per mess, ration, correct? As in the sailors were organized into messes and each man got this ration, but it allocated to the mess, not the individual sailor, correct?

I'm interested in seeing what some of the recipes might have been. I know we ate a lot better than than when everyone brought pot luck for the Thursday night beer can races.
I think the example was compiled by how the purser would budget the ship's resources, so it would probably be purchased and stored based on per man allocation - distributed to the ship's cook daily based on # of persons living. From that point on I don't think the purser cared as long as he wasn't being rationed
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Old 02-08-2016, 04:38   #32
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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And nitrites(very bad for you). Lots of them. You can get scurvy from just a meat diet. You need vitamin C and that is from fruits, veggies, and to a limited degree dairy products. Pluis when you cook anything with vitamin C it tends to destroy the vitamin. Or just take a Vitamin C supplement. Rare today to find scurvy.
The innuit never had fruits and veg or much dairy until modern times. They werent suffering from scurvy.

Also, the Bailys did not suffer scurvy during their 117 days at sea with fish and turtle their diet.
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Old 02-08-2016, 04:40   #33
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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The innuit never had fruits and veg or much dairy until modern times. They werent suffering from scurvy.
Due to eating raw meat - humans and other primates and guinea pigs are the only known animals that do not create their own vitamin C. If raw, a persistent meat based diet will be okay - but heating destroys the vitamin c.
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Old 02-08-2016, 04:51   #34
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

When John Cabot and his crew arrived at North America in the 1600 hundreds he and his crew were suffering from scurvy. The indigenous natives nourished them with tea made from cedar boughs. He returned to Europe with this information and presented it to the Royal surgeons at court. The information was suppressed and lost....there was no money to be made on something that simple.
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Old 02-08-2016, 05:16   #35
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
... Beer may have been what started agriculture, not bread...
... Beer may well have started civilization.
Mark the Drunk
Indeed.
http://www.logicalpoetry.com/recipes/bread-beer.pdf
What Was Brewing in the Natufian? An Archaeological Assessment of Brewing Technology in the Epipaleolithic | SpringerLink
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Old 02-08-2016, 06:31   #36
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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Due to eating raw meat - humans and other primates and guinea pigs are the only known animals that do not create their own vitamin C. If raw, a persistent meat based diet will be okay - but heating destroys the vitamin c.
Absolutely true. However raw meat does not have a whole lot of vitamin C to begin with. The traditional lifestyle forced the northern folks to burn about 8000 calories per day, and thus eat a lot of raw meat.

Contrast that with the Gauchos on the pampas who use to eat meat while on the pampas with their livestock. They cooked the meat. Many got scurvies until someone figured out that eating grass and other plants prevented teeth from falling out.

Of course with the passing of those traditional lifestyles, such a diet is a death sentence. Also the Inuits and other northern folks use to eat lots of pure fat. Like the sumo wrestlers, you can get away with that if you exercise or burn off huge amounts of calories per day. Few do that today. Interestingly, Sumos are extremely morbidly obese but extremely healthy on their vital signs. Most of their body fat is brown fat. Body chemistry is tricky.
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Old 02-08-2016, 14:07   #37
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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The innuit never had fruits and veg or much dairy until modern times. They werent suffering from scurvy.
.

Only due I believe to the Narwal, without it, I don't think life is possible up there, at least not according to David Attenborough, assuming I have his name correct, I watch a LOT of documentaries with him narrating.


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Old 02-08-2016, 14:33   #38
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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Originally Posted by reed1v View Post
Absolutely true. However raw meat does not have a whole lot of vitamin C to begin with. The traditional lifestyle forced the northern folks to burn about 8000 calories per day, and thus eat a lot of raw meat.

Contrast that with the Gauchos on the pampas who use to eat meat while on the pampas with their livestock. They cooked the meat. Many got scurvies until someone figured out that eating grass and other plants prevented teeth from falling out.

Of course with the passing of those traditional lifestyles, such a diet is a death sentence. Also the Inuits and other northern folks use to eat lots of pure fat. Like the sumo wrestlers, you can get away with that if you exercise or burn off huge amounts of calories per day. Few do that today. Interestingly, Sumos are extremely morbidly obese but extremely healthy on their vital signs. Most of their body fat is brown fat. Body chemistry is tricky.
My diet is about 60% fat. Primarily coconut oil and some from meats. Carbs only make up about 15% of my diet, most of that will be pure fiber. Protein the remaining. I weigh 110 lbs and I eat a normal amount of calories.
I can give you losts of reasearch to help you understand why this is true but its beyond the scope of this discussion. But I am stating that your assumptions on quamtity of food consumed and resulting physique are wrong. I dont exercise! But I am healthy with normal choleserol and low heart rate and blood pressure.
Low carb is a wonderful.way to go!
Best info on this is the art and science of low carbohyde living. Great stuff.

As for c in meat....ya, I bow to more knowledge than I have.
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Old 02-08-2016, 14:36   #39
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

Oh, and by normal my average daily calorie count is about 2500. High for my size really. Its all about cutting out the carbs, fat has nothing to do with size.
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Old 02-08-2016, 14:41   #40
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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Oh, and by normal my average daily calorie count is about 2500. High for my size really. Its all about cutting out the carbs, fat has nothing to do with size.
I agree.
I have been low carb for ages. Except beer.
The trick with low carb is to get the fat intake high enough. Most people just replace carbs with green veg or protein.
Replacing it with fat is much better
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Old 02-08-2016, 15:30   #41
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

Someone made a comparison to the Inuits how about the Sami? It would seem they have six months of day light and a little earth above permafrost. I feel sure they grew a little bit of something with vitamin C. As I recall photosynthesis does not require heat just light? Just a thought. Preservation would only be placing it below the permafrost.
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Old 02-08-2016, 15:40   #42
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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More than that. Beer may have been what started agriculture, not bread.
I'd always figured the first crop was probably pot.
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Old 02-08-2016, 15:44   #43
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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I weigh 110 lbs and I eat a normal amount of calories.
Unless you are 5 foot tall, you might want to see a doctor. :-)
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Old 02-08-2016, 20:14   #44
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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I'd always figured the first crop was probably pot.
No it wasnt.

Gords first link gives you an excellent reason why: the dope seeds could only have been fired to survive. They havent found any so there was no pot smoking. Also no THC has been found in pottery but some acid associated with alcohol has been found.
So, sorry, it was a bunch of drunks who made civilsation, not a bunch of stoners...

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Old 02-08-2016, 21:27   #45
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Re: Typical weekly menu for sailor in the golden age of sail

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Fresh meat is better for avoiding scurvy, no?

I like the menu even though I am a 'vegetarian'. I like the 1 gal beer part best, now can see why all old time sailors were nonanonymous.

b.
fruit is the cure for scurvy. that;s why brittish seamen were called limeys.
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