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Old 14-04-2012, 22:34   #376
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

That’s the crux and the dilemma..
I think therefore I am….?
........................…. How do you know it is you who is doing the thinking…?
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Old 14-04-2012, 22:43   #377
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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That’s the crux and the dilemma..
I think therefore I am….?
........................…. How do you know it is you who is doing the thinking…?
Oh no, .... its those voices again.
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Old 15-04-2012, 01:01   #378
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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Oh no, .... its those voices again.
….would something need to exist in order to hear?
(please … no ‘Voices of God allowed’…)
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Old 15-04-2012, 01:09   #379
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….would something need to exist in order to hear?
(please … no ‘Voices of God allowed’…)
Now you're just messing with my head Pelagic! Those voices are real ...... aren't they?
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Old 15-04-2012, 01:46   #380
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

Sure….
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Old 15-04-2012, 03:00   #381
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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Except this sort of Eastern imagery tends to send a Western brain on its usual dualistic tracks.
Woo comes in many flavours, including Eastern - the good news is that you get to pick your own flavour , the double good news is that if can't find something that suits you, can simply make own up .

If you come up with something really good can then sell it to others (perhaps an idea for the "Making money whilst Cruising" Thread? ).
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Old 15-04-2012, 06:42   #382
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pirate Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

This thread was giving me a headache. Then I realized it might not be me in pain. Now I don't know whether to feel it or not.

One of the docs around here should be able to figure me out.

Astrid?
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Old 15-04-2012, 18:47   #383
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

Just came across this discussion. Interestingly, I happened across a copy of Alan Watts - Wisdom of Insecurity a few weeks after I began helping Larry build our first cruising boat (Seraffyn). That, coupled with Larry's love of sailing and dislike of maintaining the equipment on the charterboats he'd been skippering plus a desire to get cruising sooner (i.e. the money for an engine was the same as we needed to cruise for a year in Mexico) helped lead us into a simpler sailing style which has definitely worked for us.

Yesterday some cruising folks on board a relatively expensive 50 footer came to anchor in the bay where we have our homebase in New Zealand. They invited us out for dinner. It was beautiful evening and we rowed "Cheeky" the 8 foot tender to Taleisin out to their boat (about 600 yards). When dinner was over they said, "let us tow you home with our outboard. My first reaction was, why would anyone want to disturb the tranquillity of such a beautiful starlit calm night? Larry's was, do they think it's hard work?

The row home, with the oars stirring up masses of bioluminescence at each stroke, was the perfect end to a lovely evening. Simplicity at it's best, good food, good conversation and a bit of easy exercise on the way home.
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Old 15-04-2012, 18:51   #384
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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Originally Posted by Lin Pardey View Post
Just came across this discussion. Interestingly, I happened across a copy of Alan Watts - Wisdom of Insecurity a few weeks after I began helping Larry build our first cruising boat (Seraffyn). That, coupled with Larry's love of sailing and dislike of maintaining the equipment on the charterboats he'd been skippering plus a desire to get cruising sooner (i.e. the money for an engine was the same as we needed to cruise for a year in Mexico) helped lead us into a simpler sailing style which has definitely worked for us.

Yesterday some cruising folks on board a relatively expensive 50 footer came to anchor in the bay where we have our homebase in New Zealand. They invited us out for dinner. It was beautiful evening and we rowed "Cheeky" the 8 foot tender to Taleisin out to their boat (about 600 yards). When dinner was over they said, "let us tow you home with our outboard. My first reaction was, why would anyone want to disturb the tranquillity of such a beautiful starlit calm night? Larry's was, do they think it's hard work?

The row home, with the oars stirring up masses of bioluminescence at each stroke, was the perfect end to a lovely evening. Simplicity at it's best, good food, good conversation and a bit of easy exercise on the way home.
While I sympathize with your thoughts, I suggest another reason. Perhaps they were thinking, "Can we do anything else nice for these lovely people?"

Sometimes when you cross paths with someone you like it is easy to fall all over yourself to "be nice" and cement a friendship. Sometimes you slip up and don't think about the real needs or wants of those people. It could have just been a moment where they didn't know what else to do but wanted to continue being nice.
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Old 15-04-2012, 18:56   #385
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

as my grandmother used to say..."there's nowt strange as folk",some poeople will never work it out.......................
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Old 15-04-2012, 19:07   #386
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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While I sympathize with your thoughts, I suggest another reason. Perhaps they were thinking, "Can we do anything else nice for these lovely people?"

Sometimes when you cross paths with someone you like it is easy to fall all over yourself to "be nice" and cement a friendship. Sometimes you slip up and don't think about the real needs or wants of those people. It could have just been a moment where they didn't know what else to do but wanted to continue being nice.
We came to the same conclusion, especially after spending this morning having coffee with them.
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Old 15-04-2012, 20:16   #387
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

While your here Lin, I would be really interested in knowing how you feel about the simplicity vs depervation issue: How simple do you think cruising can get before it becomes a hardship?
I am still trying to get this one straight in my own mind.
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Old 15-04-2012, 20:31   #388
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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This thread was giving me a headache. Then I realized it might not be me in pain. Now I don't know whether to feel it or not.

One of the docs around here should be able to figure me out.

Astrid?
She's a horse doctor, but if you like your pills in the large dosage...........
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Old 15-04-2012, 20:38   #389
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

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While your here Lin, I would be really interested in knowing how you feel about the simplicity vs depervation issue: How simple do you think cruising can get before it becomes a hardship?
I am still trying to get this one straight in my own mind.
You should ask this guy that question

I think Lin hit on a very important point. Not so much about simplicity, or hardships, but EXERCISE!

I'm about to sell the outboard I recently bought for the simple fact that rowing will give me a good workout. And I need it... All those good rice and beans I'm eating are starting to settle in all the wrong places

But then, exercise is exactly the right analogy for 'hardship', isn't it? For the most part, it sucks! but we do it because we know it's good for us. We know that a little pain today will result in a better tomorrow. And in the grand scheme of things, a few hours a week of 'hardship' will result in the blissful embodiment of power and freedom of movement (relatively speaking). It's a love/hate thing for most of us. I hate it, therefore I need to force myself into it. It's much simpler to forgo the outboard motor than it is to get up and go jogging in the morning
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Old 15-04-2012, 22:10   #390
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Re: The Philosophy behind Sailing Simply and cheaply

Hardship or simplicity, involvement or detachment. Using the folks I mentioned earlier...they were on their way into the big smoke to get their watermaker repaired, upgrade their alternator, check the alignment on their shaft, part of a list of maintenance items that would probably cost a year of our cruising chips. Did we feel it was a hardship to be becalmed for 5 hours just outside Apia harbor? Guess i thought of it as an excuse to clean up the cabin and write up the log book, read a book and let Larry get a few hours extra sleep before the hustle of entering a new port.

I think the difference is one of mindset. 6 foot plus tall John Guzzwell spent four years exploring on 21 foot Trekka, said he carried lots of food and water, could always climb into a dry bunk, always make a hot cup of soup or tea, always kept meeting really nice folks along the way. I climbed inside Trekka and at 4'10 just had headroom under the hatch and wondered how someone could spend so much time in her. My 29 footer is totally luxurious in comparison.

Another beautiful yacht that sailed in today - 60 feet, elegant, really nice folks we'd met previously in Chile. Invited them in for dinner but they couldn't because they'd been in radio contact with people on another yacht that was sailing in company with them. Already had a date and hoped we'd come to their boat. We couldn't that evening, but suggested they stay another day or two so we could catch up. But they also had three other dates lined up by email and telephone so couldn't stay an extra day. Thus their on=board complications kept them detached from the place they'd sailed so far to see.

Guess I can't actually easily answer your question Newt, probably would take a 2000 word article to do it.
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