The Frugal (AKA poor) Sailor

[a64pilot]

Weavis, I keep seeing over and over where you keep driving the thread back to focus on those with less means, and I get that those with less means are likely to be frugal and could be argued are more motivated to be so.
But, whether your cruising on $1,000 a month or $10,000 a month, I'd argue that being frugal will benefit you, and in fact that the tips on how to save money and or get the most for your money are just as applicable to both groups.

However, I see over and over people that it would seem have the least means buying milk at a convenience store and getting money out of ATM's and other foolish things that I will not allow myself to do as I see it as wasting money.

From my observations frugality isn't tied to income, not like you would think it would be anyway.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

So then, what's wrong with someone buying a "quality-built boat" like an Oyster, Swan, Hallberg Rassey etc, "that is in good shape, and that will do what you need it to do (not more, not less,)?" Which "is how a frugal person [may] approach this choice.". Or is it the cost or make of the boat that troubles you?

Looking for a good return on an investment should be the essence of making a good frugal decision.

Ken, I have never said your boat choice is wrong for you. Those are all excellent, quality boats. And I agree with your ROI comment, except to say "returns" are not only measure in dollars.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Weavis, I keep seeing over and over where you keep driving the thread back to focus on those with less means, and I get that those with less means are likely to be frugal and could be argued are more motivated to be so.
But, whether your cruising on $1,000 a month or $10,000 a month, I'd argue that being frugal will benefit you, and in fact that the tips on how to save money and or get the most for your money are just as applicable to both groups.

However, I see over and over people that it would seem have the least means buying milk at a convenience store and getting money out of ATM's and other foolish things that I will not allow myself to do as I see it as wasting money.

From my observations frugality isn't tied to income, not like you would think it would be anyway.

As you say.. its all down to managing ones budget however large or small.. different folks different strokes.
For some folks its down to trying to save in the good times for the future and to maintain stability and security..
For others its 'Even the bad times are Good'.. manage when one's down and fiesta when times are good.. tomorrow will look after its self.
Like someone else said.. I also respect Keno for what he's achieved.. but I don't envy him.. my brain is not wired the same way and I know it..
However that does not make one superior to the other as I doubt he could have lived my life any more than I could have lived his..
He'd likely not be seen dead where I hang and Vicky Veruka..
And.. quite likely we both derive great pleasure from the fact..

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I see over and over people that it would seem have the least means buying milk at a convenience store and getting money out of ATM's and other foolish things that I will not allow myself to do as I see it as wasting money.

From my observations frugality isn't tied to income, not like you would think it would be anyway.

Can't speak for prices everywhere but here milk is cheaper at the corner gas station /convienence store than it is in the local Safeway or albertsons grocery store.
I do pull money out of an ATM sometimes ( using your banks ATM doesn't cost anything). There are places that it saves money to do that and pay cash rather than pay with my debit card. ( gas/ diesel is up to ten cents a gallon more when using debit/credit cards)

[Blue Crab]

And what's so wrong about thread drift?

I recall many discussions along the lines of the actual answers to actual questions are offered up quickly in a thread. After that anything goes. We've over 400 posts in this thread. Is it likely some hugely pertinent new point will be made?

And there are a buncha threads on the low buck sailor already. Most have been great reading.

[barnakiel]

My attitude and findings are very much like Mike's. I even like snow. ;-) I could winter over in the Antarctic, if our boat were big and strong enough for this. Maybe one day.

Interestingly, it is easier to live a frugal sailor's life if one takes off with a quality boat. A boat well designed, well built and well maintained.

When one starts with a poorly designed, built and/or maintained boat, frugality will only lead to further deterioration of the boat and possibly to a sudden dissipation of the cruising dream.

I am a keen online brokerages browser and just yesterday I came across a point in case. Two boats: one cheaper, bigger but in need of a HUGE amount of tlc, the other a bit smaller, a bit more expensive, in apparently bristol shape.

A frugal sailor must be a smart person, not a greedy one. Someone who actually feels more drawn to 'go small go now' than to 'buy the biggest boat you can afford'. A smart sailor will quickly notice that the first phrase says 'go' twice while the second motto says 'buy' and 'big'. There is a major difference though between going (sailing, cruising) and buying (consuming, owning).

Nothing that can be taught or preached, just how a particular brain is wired.

Musings on minds and matter.

If you want to be a frugal sailor rather than a frugal owner of a quickly deteriorating object tied to a dock, BUY A QUALITY BOAT.

Cheers,
b.

[weavis]

A number of Centaurs for sale. Apart from the cheapest, as close to £7k would be a good deal

Westerly Centaur | eBay

[Cool Hand Luke]

Originally Posted by weavis

Whether we drink a bottle of $300 or $30 or $3 wine - - - the hangover is the same.

I disagree! The hangover from the $300 is nonexistent vs the hangover from the over-saturation of sulfites in the $3 wine is what gives you a migraine for a day and a half! I'm not saying you should spend a lot of money, but it's also a health thing.

You should never save $$$ when it comes to your health. Who cares if you save those extra $20 when you die 5 years earlier. I always splurge a little on the better, top-shelf alcohol.

As for food, that macaroni and cheese or Ramen noodles are so unhealthy that I wouldn't eat them for free unless death from starvation was imminent.

I love sailing and I want to live to 100 and be sailing as long as I can. So, I try to stay as healthy as possible (except the weekend binge drinking parties)

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Cool Hand Luke

I disagree! The hangover from the $300 is nonexistent vs the hangover from the over-saturation of sulfites in the $3 wine is what gives you a migraine for a day and a half! I'm not saying you should spend a lot of money, but it's also a health thing.

You should never save $$$ when it comes to your health. Who cares if you save those extra $20 when you die 5 years earlier. I always splurge a little on the better, top-shelf alcohol.

As for food, that macaroni and cheese or Ramen noodles are so unhealthy that I wouldn't eat them for free unless death from starvation was imminent.

I love sailing and I want to live to 100 and be sailing as long as I can. So, I try to stay as healthy as possible (except the weekend binge drinking parties)

I hate to be the one to break the bad news to you... It's 90% genetics and not much to do with so-called "health food."

So enjoy some dessert.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

My attitude and findings are very much like Mike's. I even like snow. ;-) I could winter over in the Antarctic, if our boat were big and strong enough for this. Maybe one day.

Interestingly, it is easier to live a frugal sailor's life if one takes off with a quality boat. A boat well designed, well built and well maintained.

...

A frugal sailor must be a smart person, not a greedy one. Someone who actually feels more drawn to 'go small go now' than to 'buy the biggest boat you can afford'. A smart sailor will quickly notice that the first phrase says 'go' twice while the second motto says 'buy' and 'big'. There is a major difference though between going (sailing, cruising) and buying (consuming, owning).

Just back in the land of good wifi, so catching up. Fully agree with my wise and frugal friend here. As has often been repeated, a frugal cruiser does not waste money or time on a POS old boat, just as (s)he doesn't waste it on some over-priced new boat. Know what you actually need (which may not be what you want), and then buy the best quality boat that you can afford that meets your needs.

If you need a 50-foot world-class cruiser, and you can afford to buy and maintain it properly, then great. You'd be a fool not to get one. If your needs and resources line up with a mid-30s world-class cruiser, you'd be an equal fool to buy more (or less).

I don't quibble with people who say they need a 50-foot boat to go cruising. I don't understand this need, but who am I to say. Thirty years ago my boat would have been considered extravagantly large, and I'm sure all the cruisers in their 26 to 32 footers were shaking their heads and saying: "How could anyone need 37 feet to go cruising. That's crazy!"

What I do quibble with is when someone from the "go big" group forcibly insists that other cruisers must also have large, new, expensive boats with all the modern tools and toys to go cruising. Or conversely, when a go-now, go-small person says this is the only way.

There is no "only way" for everyone.

Learn what you (and hopefully your sailing partner) needs, then find the best quality match that fits your resources. This is how to be a frugal sailor.

[sailorchic34]

I had a issue pop up just a few days ago that ties into the frugal issue. My lift pump went out as I was cruising down river. So annoying when that happens.

Being someone with very limited means (less then $200 in the bank), my options were a replacement mechanical pump for $100 off ebay, or a electric fuel pump for $12-$15 dollars.

What I've decided to do is buy the $15 electric fuel pump and 25 feet of hose for $16 and a bit of fuel pump diaphragm material for $10. So for less then $40 dollars, I have an electric fuel pump to get by on, new fuel line to re-plub the 22 to 44 year old fuel system and diaphragm material to rebuild the old lift pump with.

So I saved $50 over just buying a replacement pump, and will have a backup pump and new fuel line all around too. Mind you I'm not yet taken a fuel pump apart before. But it can't be much harder then rebuilding the engine.

Oh I also rigged up a Day tank using a 5 gallon jug, extra fuel hose aboard, to run the engine till the parts and pieces come in.

I am a happy camper.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Learn what you (and hopefully your sailing partner) needs, then find the best quality match that fits your resources. This is how to be a frugal sailor.

Sometimes its the other half that drives the "needs". I put it in parenthesis as vast majority of our needs, really aren't, they are wants, but nothing wrong with that either. Comfort is sometimes important.
If we are truthful with ourselves, actual needs are very little and not difficult to come by in our Western World.
I found a lovely 32' boat, that I though would fit us very well, she "needed" bigger, so we kept looking and ended up with older, but bigger. Same money.
I will admit she was right, bigger is also faster and more comfortable it seems.

[a64pilot]

SC I hope it works out for you, but sometimes the diaphragms have a metal disk in the middle of them that may be tough to swap over, then you run the risk of fuel contamination with your oil too, I'd stay with electric, just have a spare. If you mount it in an accessible spot it's very easy to change out.

[sailorchic34]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

SC I hope it works out for you, but sometimes the diaphragms have a metal disk in the middle of them that may be tough to swap over, then you run the risk of fuel contamination with your oil too, I'd stay with electric, just have a spare. If you mount it in an accessible spot it's very easy to change out.

Your right.

The key is to drill the rivit holding the disk on off, tapping new threads and screwing the disk back down once the new diaphram is in place. I've read up on it before, as the fuel pump on my old 70's goldwing is now made of unattainimum.

[a64pilot]

You had me for a second, then I remembered that you sat on a Goldwing's fuel tank if I'm remembering right.

You want real Unobtanium? Try finding carburetor parts like a float for my 46 Cessna