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Old 24-11-2011, 13:12   #46
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Re: The Boat as Idea

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Originally Posted by MikeTurner View Post
Every marina I've ever had a slip in, had just a handful of boats that ever left the dock. I was one of the few who actually went out.

My point is that, to the extent any of these "stationary" boats are owned by dreamers - those just getting started, those fixing up to get ready to go, those whose cruising is now behind them but the boat sustains memories, those for whom boat "ownership" is a thing different than "sailing" - they're helping to keep some of our marinas and boatyards open. And for that, I for one am grateful - they're helping to make my sailing and dreaming possible.
+1 Good post, and a good, big picture view... possibly too big to fit into hairy chested small minds... ...
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Old 24-11-2011, 14:15   #47
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Re: The Boat as Idea

We were all dreamers at one stage and that is fine. But if you only dream and never act, that is just pathetic. Quite pathetic indeed.

I received a poster from my grandfather and had it on my bedroom wall for a few years in my teens. The picture is irrelevant and I don´t even remember it but the words, oh yes, the words were good...

"Happy are those who dreams their dreams but truly happy are those that convert them to reality."

Just a few short words, but what meaning behind them!
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Old 24-11-2011, 14:27   #48
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Re: The Boat as Idea

Sorry, my memory was ok in terms of the meaning and substance, but the exact worrds were differnt.

They were:

"Happy are those who dreams dreams and are willing to pay the price to make them come true."

And those who don´t make them come true are just dragging out the final years of life (and that is fantastic if you are 70+!) or they are making excuses for not going sooner (and that is just pathetic!).

If you under 50 and are not realistically going to do it, find a different dream. Better still, don´t have dreams, only have plans!
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Old 25-11-2011, 03:27   #49
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Re: The Boat as Idea

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If you under 50 and are not realistically going to do it, find a different dream. Better still, don´t have dreams, only have plans!
All my dreams died 4 years ago - with the Missus (and FWIW none of them involved any boat ). Apparently she wasn't indestructible after all - despite plenty of prior evidence to the contrary.........

It's been a few years since I left the dock due to:-

a) having nowhere to go
b) no reason to go there
c) the ever ongoing refurb project ......based around the fact that sitting onboard simply fiddling around with bits and bobs (between cups of tea and snoozes ) is what has largely kept me sane these last 4 years........

FWIW the plan is to liveaboard from next March(ish ) for a few months and see what happens - but have a few ongoing health things at the moment, plus possibly a new twist - yet to be concluded which may impact on all that - but, hey sh#t happens - and however the chips fall - won't be the worst thing that has ever happened to me...........

But can't say living on a boat has ever been a dream of mine. It's only living on a boat Travelling the world for extended periods? Been there and done that - it's full of furriners and can be as dull as living at home in a cubicle......or as interesting as living "The Wire", but funnier .

What you are saying is that I should sell the boat, simply because it is not my "dream"? and it somehow offends you? That's both weird and sad.
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Old 25-11-2011, 04:52   #50
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Re: The Boat as Idea

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Hi - Jim Carrier here, a contributing editor at Cruising World (US).

I'm working on an essay for the May issue and thought you might have an anecdote or thought that would spice the stew:

The piece is about boats as "ideas," that is, their value above and beyond the actual sailing. I have gathered stories from Maine to Morocco about people who own sailboats but rarely use them. About people who never take them out of the harbor -- or even storage. There's a guy in New England who drives to the harbor, sits in his car and watches his boat on a mooring. Day after day. There are plenty of people in Spain who use their boats as cocktail lounges only. There are boats all over the world that gather moss for years on end.

I'm the classic example, with a boat in the Med for a decade now, but precious little sailing time. (That will end in March 2012, when I bring her home on Dockwise.) Because of that sorry record, and perhaps justification for it, I've come to think of Ranger as an "idea" as much as a sailboat, a vessel in which I store dreams and memories, plan voyages that I will never take, and hold dear as an ultimate backup should another disaster strike our household, as it did in Katrina.

How much time do you actually spend sailing on your boat? Do you have stories of other mariners who own floating ideas?

Feel free to reply here, or email me directly at: jimcarrier@msn.com.

I'll assume I can use your story in the piece unless you indicate otherwise.

Thanks,
Jim Carrier,
Madison WI
Hi Jim,
Interesting thought.

… the “value” of your yacht adjusts in ways not dissimilar to the love of a good woman who somehow won your loyalty over the years and became the perfect mate or mistress.

At the beginning, flushed with the scent of unknown adventures and hidden delights, you got it up often (the sails) and tested her in many positions of action and repose.

You eventually found that balance where she still excited….but satisfied your salty desire in a refined way… more a nudge than a wink….

Over the years she continued to inspire you as an ‘idea’ of that perfect partner, still willing to tango despite the baggy wrinkles of age and experience that defined and personified your private successes and failures.

In a perfect world, that selfish loyalty of maintaining her ready for sea should one day be realized in a Viking burial….But instead, we hold on to the boat as an idea, a symbol of all that is free and good and perhaps now beyond our aging reach of innocence.
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Old 25-11-2011, 11:06   #51
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Re: The Boat as Idea

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But if you only dream and never act, that is just pathetic. Quite pathetic indeed.
Yeah. Okay. I understand why you have that opinion. But why would that bother you? Why get so upset about the fact that there are people in this world that you consider pathetic?

I mean, I agree! There are millions (probably billions) of people in this world that I would consider pathetic in one way or another. Doesn't bother me, though. I don't really care if they ever change their ways. Don't understand why anyone would.

And let me say, yet once more, that if all those dreamers get off their collective backsides and sail off to paradise, paradise is going to turn into a TOTAL DUMP! I say, keep 'em home, safely docked at their marina, and leave paradise the heck alone!
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Old 25-11-2011, 12:05   #52
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Re: The Boat as Idea

dreaming exists as hope for many-- and many of those hopeful souls never begin to understand how to effect their dream. is not the mere act of sailing they dream about but a life of total freedom on the sea, which does not exist.
"boat" for many means freedom...much the same as their dream, and the concept is derived from that same source----they delete the middle steps and equate boat with complete freedom and lack of responsibility. kinda unlike the reality of it all...some try their dream in life and donot get along with it well and return to their land lives , yet maintain the dream of complete freedom, which they deny doesnt exist, as the romance imagined and the life style imagined far surpasses their reality--i would not say they are pathetic, they just werent made for the flexibility( psychological flexibility as well as physical) factors required for their own survival in a strange and unique, even hostile, environment.
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Old 25-11-2011, 16:35   #53
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Ok, sorry if I have stepped on a few toes!

How about dividing up the types a little? I would suggest something along the lines of the following:

1. Nostalgia. This is the old geezer pottering around on his boat in his 70s, reminiscing about the old days, past voyages, storms survived, calms crossed, etc. Great for him! It keeps him alive a few more years. It might very well be me one day if I don't end up in a nursing home first.

2. Planners. These are doing research, reading, investigating, chartering, sailing on others' boats, etc all with a certain, clear aim in their minds.

3. Dreamers. Like Zeehag says, they have a utopic view of boats and sometimes confuse it with freedom, paradise, sex or whatever and conveniently forget about maintenance, port fees, torn sails and all the associated hassles. They are the talkers, the blowhards, the inventors of excuses. Thank god they are not out here and won't ever make it. They provide most of the sales income for the magazines.

If you are currently in the 3rd group, change quickly to group 2! That will ensure some nice memories one day for group 1......

But please don't forget the difference between planning and dreaming!
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Old 25-11-2011, 16:53   #54
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pirate Re: The Boat as Idea

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Originally Posted by Jimbo485 View Post
Ok, sorry if I have stepped on a few toes!
OUCH OUCH OUWWWWCCHHHHHH..... just kiddin...

How about dividing up the types a little? I would suggest something along the lines of the following:

1. Nostalgia. This is the old geezer pottering around on his boat in his 70s, reminiscing about the old days, past voyages, storms survived, calms crossed, etc. Great for him! It keeps him alive a few more years. It might very well be me one day if I don't end up in a nursing home first.
Nope.... not me.... so far so good,,,,,

2. Planners. These are doing research, reading, investigating, chartering, sailing on others' boats, etc all with a certain, clear aim in their minds.
ROFL.... not me either....

3. Dreamers. Like Zeehag says, they have a utopic view of boats and sometimes confuse it with freedom, paradise, sex or whatever and conveniently forget about maintenance, port fees, torn sails and all the associated hassles. They are the talkers, the blowhards, the inventors of excuses. Thank god they are not out here and won't ever make it. They provide most of the sales income for the magazines.
Ahhhhhh......!!.. Now we're getting close....
If you are currently in the 3rd group, change quickly to group 2! That will ensure some nice memories one day for group 1......
You gorra be Bludi Jokin Mate..... sounds like hard frickin work to me...

But please don't forget the difference between planning and dreaming!
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Old 25-11-2011, 17:23   #55
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Re: The Boat as Idea

Forgive me as I haven't read through the previous responses.

I do sail my boat, have lived aboard for several years, voyaged offshore to foreign lands and cruised coastal, and just spend scores of weeks on the mooring not going anywhere.

The idea of a sailboat is to me a lesson in life. The sailboat and the sea is all you need to learn all the lessons of life. The idea is the sailboat is a TEACHER and I am the pupil.

The more I know the further I go.. the more she teaches me... the more I can learn. It's basically an endless journey of excitement and learning, and peace and wonder.

The idea has held man forever... Shiva is my Mistress... I take care of her... she takes care of me.
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Old 26-11-2011, 04:55   #56
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Re: The Boat as Idea

The boat as an Idea, a Mistress, Dream, Teacher, Freedom.....? Maybe I'm less ethereal in my thoughts and possibly too pragmatic, but I tend to think of the boat more as a tool that I would use to obtain more gain for less expended.
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Old 26-11-2011, 07:20   #57
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Re: The Boat as Idea

for me, my boat has been home since 1990--different boats--and is yes a tool for travelling an d relocating home to different locales. there is nothing ethereal nor dreamlike in repairs and relocations. there is a true awesomeness to the sea-- but the boat is a tool for transportation and survival.
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Old 26-11-2011, 07:29   #58
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Not sure i fit into the 3 groups. I sail locally frequently on my own boat. I don't really enjoy hanging out at the marina and don't enjoy working on it. My husband does the maintenance but does not sail. If he was not around i might have to buy a newer boat.
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Old 26-11-2011, 08:28   #59
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Re: The Boat as Idea

I've enjoyed this discussion, and the eloquence of many. It confirms my theory. I'll be sending private emails to those I'd like to quote, for more information and/or permission to attribute. Thanks again. Jim Carrier
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Old 26-11-2011, 23:35   #60
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Re: The Boat as Idea

To add to my post.
I can't wait to move back to the US and get a boat. The day after Thanksgiving, I was going to another place about an hour away from where I live, about 10 minutes away from the destination, some idiot on the German autobahn tried to deliberately cause and accident with me and run me off the road. I can't wait to leave.
At least out on the open water, there's less obsticals to hit. I like the idea of the freedom of movement to go where ever the wind will take me.
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