Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 02-03-2015, 07:56   #136
Registered User
 
Group9's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,599
Images: 7
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Calif View Post
You seem to be getting a bit passionate - All arguments are debatable that's why they are arguments.

Also every situation is unique. But a couple of truths (believe it or not) over time property appreciates. Over time boats don't.

Sure point out mortgage crises and market resets yada, yada, yada.

A boat behaves like a car - over time there is a residual value but it doesn't appreciate - ever (OK classic yachts aside). Real (dirt) property behaves like, well dirt property. They ain't making any more.

I made 3% per year on my house over the 9 years I owned it. I also "avoided" paying rent. I did pay a fair share of property taxes.

Ignore boat depreciation if you will. Your choice. Some people want to take house equity, buy a boat, cruise 5 years and think that 100% of the boat equity is available to re-buy a house when they are done. Good luck with that strategy is all I can say.

BTW - My brother refinanced after the crisis to a 15 year fixed at 3%. And yes I know how mortgage interest is loaded.

(Jeez I hate these cost of cruising threads that devolve into finance threads - I can always argue both sides - as can anyone and I am as much a part of the problem as anyone. Bottom line of How Much Does it Cost to Cruise is simply - How much do you have (Mic drop, Ex-Calif out))
To me, it's like asking someone "How much does it cost to go out and eat at a restaurant?"

That's a pretty simple question, but the answer is not going to be the same for everyone.
__________________

__________________
Cruising again!
Group9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 09:01   #137
Registered User
 
cwyckham's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Boat: Niagara 35
Posts: 1,870
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by brookiesailor View Post
Ok we agree that sailing costs more than staying home...but think of all the sights and experiences you would miss if you only had your back yard to look at


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
I don't think we agree on that at all. Many people find cruising to be much less expensive than staying at home on a cash flow per month basis.

The only time it gets a bit tricky is when people start trying to factor in the value of their home and the boat into it and trying to look at opportunity cost for cash, etc. Then it gets to be a very individual calculation.

In my case, I don't own real estate and my boat is 35 years old. I can truly ignore all of the above and look at the $5000 per month it takes me to live on land in one of the most expensive cities in the world vs the $1500-2000 it would take me to live on the boat in a third world country.

Of course, cost is only half of the equation. The other half is income. But that's a different thread.
__________________

__________________
cwyckham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 09:03   #138
Registered User
 
cwyckham's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Boat: Niagara 35
Posts: 1,870
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by Group9 View Post
To me, it's like asking someone "How much does it cost to go out and eat at a restaurant?"

That's a pretty simple question, but the answer is not going to be the same for everyone.
That is, bar none, the best analogy I've ever heard in this ongoing debate. I plan to rip it off and use it liberally.
__________________
cwyckham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 14:40   #139
Registered User

Join Date: May 2008
Location: daytona beach florida
Boat: csy 37
Posts: 2,844
Images: 1
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by brookiesailor View Post
Ok we agree that sailing costs more than staying home...but think of all the sights and experiences you would miss if you only had your back yard to look at


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
I don't agree. When we're cruising it costs considerably less than staying home. Next time you have nothing to do, add up all the costs of a house and two cars. ALL the costs.
__________________
Take two at low eight
onestepcsy37 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 15:22   #140
Don't ask if you can't handle it
 
sailorboy1's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: On the boat somewhere
Boat: Hunter 410
Posts: 12,310
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by onestepcsy37 View Post
Next time you have nothing to do, add up all the costs of a house and two cars. ALL the costs.
Compared to my gross income as a percent

house - 15%
boat - 14%

That was for 2014, which was a low cost boat year. The 2 prior years the boat cost more than my house.

And no this does not include any depreciation But then in the past 4 years since I got my boat the selling prices have increased
__________________
jobless, houseless, clueless, living on a boat and cruising around somewhere
sailorboy1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 15:53   #141
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 17,038
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Sailorboy,
I believe to get to the true cost difference, you have to add all the costs, like the automobiles, insurance, fuel, upkeep, water, sewage and utility bills, Cable TV, Internet, cell phones, Burglar alarm, pool, yard, and lord know what all else. My utility bill alone is considerably more than my slip rent for example.
I don't know about you, but the automobiles I believe cost more than the boat, but I do not track costs like you do, I'm the guy that knows I make X, and wonder where the Hell it all goes to, I add all the expenses and can't come up with X


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 16:05   #142
Don't ask if you can't handle it
 
sailorboy1's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: On the boat somewhere
Boat: Hunter 410
Posts: 12,310
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Sailorboy,
I believe to get to the true cost difference, you have to add all the costs, like the automobiles, insurance, fuel, upkeep, water, sewage and utility bills, Cable TV, Internet, cell phones, Burglar alarm, pool, yard, and lord know what all else.
I did, some people need smaller houses! This is my big picture spending break down

total saving 22%
spent on boat 14% (payments, use, maintenance, upgrades)
house 15% (payment, maintenance, taxes, utilities)
taxes/govt 22% (federal, social security, medicare)
everything else 26%


everything else includes: food, clothing, entertainment, eating out, car (low as it has been paid off a long time), vacation etc. etc.

Most people (including me) don't know where their money goes, but always wonders why they don't have any.
__________________
jobless, houseless, clueless, living on a boat and cruising around somewhere
sailorboy1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 16:09   #143
Moderator Emeritus
 
Ex-Calif's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Singapore
Boat: Maxi 77 - Relax Lah!
Posts: 11,514
Images: 4
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by a64pilot View Post
Sailorboy,
I believe to get to the true cost difference, you have to add all the costs, like the automobiles, insurance, fuel, upkeep, water, sewage and utility bills, Cable TV, Internet, cell phones, Burglar alarm, pool, yard, and lord know what all else. My utility bill alone is considerably more than my slip rent for example.
I don't know about you, but the automobiles I believe cost more than the boat, but I do not track costs like you do, I'm the guy that knows I make X, and wonder where the Hell it all goes to, I add all the expenses and can't come up with X


Sent from my iPad using Cruisers Sailing Forum
The problem with this is that many of your land based costs are also discretionary. I disabled the cable, I could arguably have no car, I could arguably have no electricity or gas and use whale blubber lamps and coleman stoves etc. etc.

Basically I could live under a bridge on land in a sleeping bag or cardboard box. I could also live under a bridge on water but I'd need a boat to do it...

Maybe a better analogy for boats is trailer park living or RVs.
__________________
Relax Lah! is For Sale <--- Click
Click--> Custom CF Google Search or CF Rules
You're gonna need a bigger boat... - Martin Brody
Ex-Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 18:20   #144
Registered User
 
SimonV's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Brisbane, Australia.
Posts: 1,316
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by cwyckham View Post
I don't think we agree on that at all. Many people find cruising to be much less expensive than staying at home on a cash flow per month basis.

The only time it gets a bit tricky is when people start trying to factor in the value of their home and the boat into it and trying to look at opportunity cost for cash, etc. Then it gets to be a very individual calculation.

In my case, I don't own real estate and my boat is 35 years old. I can truly ignore all of the above and look at the $5000 per month it takes me to live on land in one of the most expensive cities in the world vs the $1500-2000 it would take me to live on the boat in a third world country.

Of course, cost is only half of the equation. The other half is income. But that's a different thread.
Where do you get your figures from. Third World and you think it would cost so much, you need to get out a bit. For instance Vanuatu may be third world but closer to 2nd world. You can eat out at the markets every day 2 cooked meals with drink $14. Open 6 days. If you buy your own produce less than $4 per day. Eat what the locals eat and if you drink the local beer you don't crook, well that what I reckon.

Sent from my GT-N7105T using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
__________________
Simon

https://svgoodonya.blogspot.com.au/
SimonV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2015, 18:43   #145
Registered User
 
zboss's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: On a boat
Boat: Cabo Rico 38
Posts: 3,426
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

I think this is why the Tiny House Movement is getting more popular. No doubt that if you lived in a Tiny House and subscribed to all that entails then it could be much cheaper to live on land....

What Is The Tiny House Movement? « The Tiny Life
__________________
zboss is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2015, 06:32   #146
Registered User
 
Group9's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,599
Images: 7
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Calif View Post
The problem with this is that many of your land based costs are also discretionary. I disabled the cable, I could arguably have no car, I could arguably have no electricity or gas and use whale blubber lamps and coleman stoves etc. etc.

Basically I could live under a bridge on land in a sleeping bag or cardboard box. I could also live under a bridge on water but I'd need a boat to do it...

Maybe a better analogy for boats is trailer park living or RVs.
Hey, I've known New Yorkers in their 30's and 40's who not only have never owned a car, they have never even driven one. But, in most parts of the country, most people would say having a car is a necessity.

My brother has a cabin in Alaska. There are tons of cabins up there, that still don't have running water and or electricity. And, some of them go for hundreds of thousands of dollars.

There is always a tendency to look for a one size fits all solution to everything, when the truth is, people are different from each other in a lot of way, and in a lot of things.

__________________
Cruising again!
Group9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2015, 06:39   #147
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Harwich/Cape Cod, MA, USA
Boat: 1984 Aphrodite 101 Hull #264
Posts: 166
Send a message via Skype™ to NormanMartin
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

I have read every posting. Fatastic. Thanks for sharing.

My parents coastal cruised a lot, especially in their later years and said the cost of cruising was pretty much the same as living ashore.

That led me to consider the question this way, does cruising cost more-- the same-- less than living in a house? And then there is the question of which is more satisfying? Which lifestyle has greater utility? A gardener won't find as much joy in cruising as will a windsurfer... for example.

Early in the thread a lot of complaints focused on the lack of long term data. My friend, Tim on Slick, is nearing the end of a three year circumnavigation. He addresses the "cost of cruising" in his inimitable way.

Mes Malo in Mahon, Menoirca, Spain | Slick's Adventure

That should be his September 2014 entry from Meniorca, Spain.

The rest of the blog is amusing too. Have fun.

Norm
__________________
NormanMartin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2015, 08:03   #148
Moderator
 
a64pilot's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Albany Ga.
Boat: Island Packet 38
Posts: 17,038
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboss View Post
I think this is why the Tiny House Movement is getting more popular. No doubt that if you lived in a Tiny House and subscribed to all that entails then it could be much cheaper to live on land....

What Is The Tiny House Movement? « The Tiny Life

I think your exactly correct, truth is average earnings or spendable income, buying power however it's correctly phrased is decreasing. Just about everything that can be done to prop it up from our Wives working, to working longer hours, to skipping vacations, creative financing, drawing equity out of our homes etc. has been done. All that is left is to sink further into debt if the banks will let us, or downsize.
I hate to say the American Dream is dead, but it died some time ago.
__________________
a64pilot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2015, 10:15   #149
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 209
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

I think the tiny house was where the American dream started. Then over the years, and with the advent of more money and more affluence the dream eventually became a nightmare that people lived in. Untill it became the reality, more important than the life itself. Boat people are arguing about how much money they need to live the American dream instead of how much life they can live for the money they have. When I bought my boat I changed my lifestyle. I didn't try to move my lifestyle on board my boat. So I had no depreciation. I just had a new appreciation for my new lifestyle. Mac
__________________
Hard Rock Candy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-03-2015, 11:10   #150
RTB
Registered User
 
RTB's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Home port Kemah, TX Currently in Brunswick Georgia
Boat: Hunter 36
Posts: 1,509
Images: 2
Re: The Answer to How much it Costs to Cruise

Nice one, Mac.

Ralph
__________________

RTB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cruise

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Its Not How Much Someone Costs, Its What You Bring to the Table. s/v Beth Our Community 27 28-02-2012 10:50
Costs to Cruise Caribbean (Broad, I Know, But Try) dniello Atlantic & the Caribbean 5 11-09-2011 18:44
Change keel to deeper, costs how much burrowsmark Dollars & Cents 0 25-03-2009 23:40
How much boat is too much? David M General Sailing Forum 36 09-10-2007 20:02
Draft depth for Caribean Islands - how much is too much? theloneoux General Sailing Forum 11 07-08-2005 14:21



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:58.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.