Smallish Sailboats For Large Disabled Man?

[markpierce]

Perhaps you'd be better off with a small motorboat.

[Broken-Sailor]

Originally Posted by markpierce

Perhaps you'd be better off with a small motorboat.

I don't want a straight motor boat. I want to learn to sail and not have to depend on having enough fuel to go out on the water for the day. Wind is free for now since they have not figured out a way to charge us for the air we breathe and catch in our sails yet. Besides If I wanted to go just fishing I'd use one of the three boats we have here at the house. Eventually I want to get a boat that I can go just about anywhere on and live on as well. If they made a live aboard blue water motorsailor small enough to trailer, sail in waters a foot deep, as well as sail to Europe or across the Pacific that I could solo or have a have a sailing partner live with me on the boat and still have room for a couple of guest now and then, that I could learn on and affordable to me, I would buy it in a heart beat.
Once my Parents are gone I have nothing holding me here and they are well up in years now. Even though I wish I could keep them around forever, I know they will not live forever. When they did emergency open heart surgery on my Dad on 2006 they only gave him 10 years to live after that if he quit smoking and lost weight. He did both and we have had him with us for 8 years so far and counting but his health is slowly going down hill and I am afraid I will not have him around for too many years more. I want to be able to take him out sailing before that happens. Just us two old US Navy sailors out on the water together enjoying the ocean breeze, smells, and everything that goes with it. I want to be able to fulfill my Moms dream too if I can of visiting Hawaii and the cheapest way to get there is by the sea on a sailboat. But to do any of that I have to learn to sail and get a boat. I have found some promising boats thanks to all of you that I could save up for or in the case I did find a boat that would be my home and could go anywhere cheap enough that I could get even if It ment selling just about every "toy" I own I would do it. Living onboard wouldn't be too hard for me to do. I am a loner most of the time anyway. I could "move" to my Nephews address in Florida and change my doctors to one's there. Since I normally only see my doctor once every three months and I get my meds in 90 day supplies, I would only have to be back at my home port for one day every three months. If I could find a small blue water live aboard boat with a min draft of a foot or less that I can afford I would get it.

[Scot McPherson]

Ok so, what you need is two boats...the first one to play with, until you are ready for the second bigger one that's a passage maker blue water cruiser.

Those are two completely different boats that you have to get, which is fine just understand that fact.


Sailing to Hawaii is no small feat. You are sailing across a huge ocean looking for a tiny island. It's a long trip, too long for some folks.

[Broken-Sailor]

Originally Posted by Scot McPherson

Ok so, what you need is two boats...the first one to play with, until you are ready for the second bigger one that's a passage maker blue water cruiser.

Those are two completely different boats that you have to get, which is fine just understand that fact.


Sailing to Hawaii is no small feat. You are sailing across a huge ocean looking for a tiny island. It's a long trip, too long for some folks.

Yes I will need a bigger live aboard boat down the line. I just wish I could get one boat to do it all but I know that is not going to happen. I have found a few boats that will work in the lakes around here at prices that I could have one in less than a year. For anything blue water type will have to wait till I come up with some real money

[Scot McPherson]

Well, you could apply the same principles of building the larger one. If you are going solo, you can build a 28-30fter. If you will have a guest here and there I'd recommend 30-40ft and if you plan on living together with someone you want 45-60ft.

A lot of people are going to say that's hogwash, you don't need a big boat, but not everyone can live with each other in such tight spaces for forever.

You can built a big boat one piece at a time in 3-5 years if you keep at it.

Your biggest costs when you get to those points will be your engine and your sails. Epoxy too if you buy it all up front. You can buy it as you need it, but that's the expensive path.

Buy this book: "backyard boat building, by George buehler" you can get it for less than $20 on amazon.

Even if you never build a boat like his designs, the book will teach you more about boat building than any other single book without all the maths and naval architecture. Just common sense stuff is all it's filled with. His boats are designed to keep you safe in the ocean. Don't listen to the naysayers who talk about over engineering and too heavy displacement...just read the book.

[Jim Cate]

Broken, I've been following your posts with interest, and empathize with your situation. But I note one thing that you recently said... something like the cheapest way to get you and your Mom to Hawaii is on your own sailboat.

I think that if you weigh the costs honestly, the reverse is true: it is a very expensive and not necessarily pleasant way to get to Hawaii. Doesn't mean that one should not do the passage -- actually, SF to Oahu was the first blue water voyage that Ann and I undertook -- but it can be pretty challenging, especially if you consider a relatively inexperienced crew and at least one non-sailor senior citizen in a low budget environment. I don't want to discourage your general goals, but tempering your dreams with some reality checks is a good idea IMO.

Oh, BTW, I'm likely older than your Mom, and suppose that I am a very experienced blue water sailor... and I'm finding that rough passages are harder on me than they used to be, and are not as much fun to contemplate. She might well prefer to fly!

Hang in there, mate, and do try to get out on the water in your own small sailboat ASAP. Doing it will answer for yourself so many of the questions for which you have been getting contradictory answers.

Jim

[gah964]

I built this boat with free cedar I got on craigslist.

[Broken-Sailor]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Broken, I've been following your posts with interest, and empathize with your situation. But I note one thing that you recently said... something like the cheapest way to get you and your Mom to Hawaii is on your own sailboat.

I think that if you weigh the costs honestly, the reverse is true: it is a very expensive and not necessarily pleasant way to get to Hawaii. Doesn't mean that one should not do the passage -- actually, SF to Oahu was the first blue water voyage that Ann and I undertook -- but it can be pretty challenging, especially if you consider a relatively inexperienced crew and at least one non-sailor senior citizen in a low budget environment. I don't want to discourage your general goals, but tempering your dreams with some reality checks is a good idea IMO.

Oh, BTW, I'm likely older than your Mom, and suppose that I am a very experienced blue water sailor... and I'm finding that rough passages are harder on me than they used to be, and are not as much fun to contemplate. She might well prefer to fly!

Hang in there, mate, and do try to get out on the water in your own small sailboat ASAP. Doing it will answer for yourself so many of the questions for which you have been getting contradictory answers.

Jim

Thank you for your input, I would probably have to take a boat over there to use as her "hotel room" while she flew there and back. Dad promised to take her there one day but one day never has gotten here yet in the 50 years they have been married. Dad is 73 and Mom will be 71 this year.

I was hoping to have time to stop by the yacht club and get some first hand information on their "Learning at the Helm” (LATH) program on the way back from a family dinner in Nashville last night but we didn't get out of there till 20:15 so I didn't think anyone would be there at that time of night. As soon as I can I'll spend some time at my sisters place in Nashville so I can spend that time learning to sail. I did learn something on that trip to Nashville and back yesterday, never ride in the back seat of the van for any trip taking over 30 minutes to get there. My knees are still killing me from that trip.

You all have made some great suggestions for boats that I can use and some that are not in my line of thought for needs, so let narrow the requirements down and go from there.

1. With the center board up the sailboat has a draft of a foot or less. (this is required for launching and boating in some of the smaller lakes around here.)
2. Be trailer-able by a small car or truck.
3. Has a cabin large enough for two people at least that I can camp out in for a weekend or a little longer with no problem. (this should include a small galley, a place to sleep, some type of heating/cooling system, a place to put an 12v electric cooler if there isn't a small refrigerator built in, and a head if possible.
4. Have a Bimini top over the pilot box to keep me out of prolong sunlight zone which some of my medication require me to do.
5. Be low enough in cost used that someone on a fixed income with only 100-150 a month to extra to spend could ether save up for or apply towards building material to build.
6. Be able to mount a trolling motor, and an small outboard motor on the boat. (Note this could be just one unit in the case of an electric outboard, but so far from what I see they cost as much as some used boats.)
7. Is or can be equipped with a proper electronics package for safety and needs. This would include, proper two way radios, navigation equipment, depth sounder/recorder (we have one of these graph type depth finder on the pontoon boat that shows the shape of the bottom not sure off hand it it can be saved or printed out for future use though), WX radio, and any other electronic gear needed for the safety of the boat and crew (Thats Me the crew) whether out on a lake or traveling down the Mississippi river to the gulf. This includes ways to recharge the batteries without running a gas outboard. Though I could put a small gas generator on board but trying to keep the weight down as much as I can.
8. Be a stable boat that won't turtle and stay that way. Even if the first boat is basically a cheap learning boat that I can also fish from and camp out on for night fishing and such. I'd like it to be able to sail the coastline with it even if I can't make passageway to other places overseas or even the islands of Hawaii. Example: sail to the Gulf and follow the coast around the tip of Florida and up the coast to South Carolina where I have family. Have family along the Florida and Georgia coastline too. Basically I need a coastal cruiser that with the board up I can beach the craft while still being able to sail in shallow waters that are only a few feet deep with the board down like the flats.
9. Be able to handle the boat solo if needed and for me to get in and out of easily.
10. Have a good flat area on deck to use as a casting platform for fishing along the way. (This could be a small added flat deck added to the bow area over the existing deck if needed.)
11. Probably should have but not imperative to have on board is a water maker, but since it will stay near the coastline I can alway put in to resupply the water on board.
12. Probably should have some type of auto piloting/weather vain system too but I don't know what type for a smaller sailboat.

If you can think of anything I might have missed that is a absolute need for this type of sailing please let me know.

So far of the prebuilt models the West Wight Potter 19 would fit the bill for lake use but I am not sure about sailing the coastline with it for long periods, or if it could be rigged for such. Plus I know what it is like to be caught out on the Mississippi river between two passing barges in bad weather so what ever boat I get will have to be very good in rough water.

I found a MacGregor 26X for $5k so I might be able to find something like that for cheaper and equip it for my needs. So what do you all think? Is there such a boat out there to meet those requirements to get till I can acquire the knowledge, knowhow and funds to get a live aboard blue water motor-sailor for passage-making cruises.

Note: We were on a ferry crossing the river before the bridge was built in the middle of a storm when the ferry got caught in the middle of the river between the two passing barges at night. One heading north and the other heading south. Let me tell you on a calm day getting hit with the swells from one barge going up river would toss our 8x27 foot rescue boat around pretty good and could be dangerous if the driver didn't know how to surf the 4 to 8 foot swells kicked up by those beast. That day with the storm and the two barges passing they had the swells crashing over the bow and my best guess would be that those swells were at least 12 to 15 feet high. They were high enough that we would lose sight of the barge it self and would just catch sight of the top of the tug pushing it up river. That is where the pilot had to keep his spot light on was to tug to keep it in sight till it safely passed and we could get to the far bank. To me it was like a roller coaster ride and was fun. It didn't really sink in till later how much danger we was actually in at the time. To my little sister and brother it was a nightmare in the making. It didn't really faze Dad, he stood outside with a poncho on smoking a cigarette. But he has also piloted a LST in a hurricane before while in the Navy. Mom staid inside the car and was concerned about the safety of us but she handled it well.

Sorry I am so long winded but that is just how I am when I write.

[Scot McPherson]

I am telling you, the type if boat you are describing is called a sharpie. It's a design style that's been in use for couple hundred years for fishing and oyster dredging along the mud Atlantic.

Check out Phil bolger, he had hundreds of designs, designed specifically for what you are looking for.

[Broken-Sailor]

Originally Posted by Scot McPherson

I am telling you, the type if boat you are describing is called a sharpie. It's a design style that's been in use for couple hundred years for fishing and oyster dredging along the mud Atlantic.

Check out Phil bolger, he had hundreds of designs, designed specifically for what you are looking for.

I believe you, I have already sent a request to join the bolger yahoogroup but since it is a restricted group I am still waiting on hearing back from them. Till I can get the details for building a boat I am looking to see if there are any prebuilt factory built boats that fit the requirement for me too see.

[Broken-Sailor]

Originally Posted by Scot McPherson

Join the bolger@yahoogroups.com mailing list. Tell them exactly what you are looking for and why. Phil and Suzanne have designed something like over 800 different designs and have designed boats for special use circumstances. Although Phil is no longer with us, but I am certain his wife who is also a designer, and the rest of the group would be more than able to help you pick a design, whether it's one of theirs or not. I am a member of that group as well, but I don't have the exposure to all the designs some of those folks know about.

Scot just checked my email and thanks to your help they added me to the group as of 08:44. Thanks. Now to try to properly word a post there.

[Scot McPherson]

Yeah I gave them a little poke in the belly button.

[Broken-Sailor]

Originally Posted by Scot McPherson

Yeah I gave them a little poke in the belly button.

Yeah saw that after I send you the PM. I am typing up the reply now.

[Broken-Sailor]

Can anyone answer a question for me, what is the average depth of the flats in the keys? I can't find that information anywhere so far. If I know that I'll know what my max draft can be for a fixed keeled boat. That would allow me more designs to look at like the twin keeled boats that are still shoal draft boats. I might not be able to beach the boat like I would a centerboard design but I would still by able to get into places that I couldn't get into with a deep draft boat. And maybe find a middle ground on a boat that take across the Atlantic later on or go down to the Panama Canal and visit my friends out on the west coast. Oh by the way you can drop the being pulled by a small truck or car part too. If I can put it on our lowboy that has and put it with our Freightliner it is trailerable to me. I know any boat that has a beam over 8.5 feet is going to need permits and possibly escort cars to move across the US. But once the boat is back in the water and ready to sail again I will not need to be hauling the thing by road again anytime soon if ever. So lets keep the boats under 40 feet and keep the beam under lets say 12 feet. Thanks.