Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 21-03-2013, 19:38   #466
Registered User

Join Date: May 2008
Location: daytona beach florida
Boat: csy 37
Posts: 2,844
Images: 1
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

sounds to me like you've got all the necessary skills. independence, self reliance, simple living. i think you should give it a try. then you can tell us about the differences between living simply on a boat and living simply in an rv.

my wife brings up the word 'rv' every once in a while, but i'm not ready yet to give up the sea....
__________________

__________________
onestepcsy37 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-03-2013, 21:51   #467
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: WTB Lagoon or Leopard 38'-40'
Posts: 1,273
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
Originally Posted by madgunny View Post
I had two young kids and a wife
we did it all on way less than 500 a month
now the kids are grown, the wife is gone and I'm thinking/dreaming of the sailing life. seems to me that just about all of the land cruiser tricks and moneymakers skills should convert to a water based lifestyle. what say you all?
I also lived in RV's for quite a long time, and have not had much on-the-water experience, but I've been studying it a long time now.

I would say the biggest difference I've observed so far is (1) cost, and (2) access.

After many years of inland cruising, you have seen much, and probably are fine being restricted off-shore locations for a while.

But the cost is a factor you may not be prepared for. In comparison, RV'ing is cheap - VERY cheap - compared to liveboard cruising. Boats are much more costly to purchase, more difficult to maintain, and more expensive to repair by several factors - definitely more than twice as much, maybe less than 5 times as much - I'm not sure the exact factor.

Occasionally we'll see posts here from people who tried to do it on too little. They are not happy stories. Loneliness, discomfort, and boredom top the list. When you are on a sailboat in an isolated anchorage, there is no giant backyard full of animals and trees and fun picnic spots.

Surely there are some spots that have many public docks and lots of fun animal life, but that does not exist everywhere - just like free camping does not exist everywhere - you have to know where to find it, and have the ability to reach it.

I guess the caution here is that if you go too small, try to get by on too little, and don't really understand how and where you can match the pleasures you got in your RV lifestyle, you can end up unhappy.

I don't know how little you have, or how flexible you are able to be, but I suggest that you find a way to ease into it if you do not have the resources to do it "well". Doing it poorly can be very unpleasant.
__________________

__________________
ArtM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 00:28   #468
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: missouri
Boat: still looking
Posts: 34
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

well I won't be flat broke, floating transient when I go.. I have a standing offer( yes still valid and legit) to work as a gunsmith in fl. and I am selling my little log cabin and will start the adventure with a small but comfortable cash kitty. I plan on working full time/ liveaboarding for 6 months or so, kinda shakedown to see if its a fit..if I hate it, fine, I don't lose much and can afford to go elsewhere, if I love it, great, I can always sell a cheap boat for cheap and upgrade, but truth be told, I kinda like small and cozy. too many years of rv living I guess. I mean I built a nice 600sf cabin in the missouri backwoods and then wondered what I was gonna do with all that space. lol
__________________
madgunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 05:49   #469
Armchair Bucketeer
 
David_Old_Jersey's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 10,013
Images: 4
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
Originally Posted by madgunny View Post
what say you all?
My take is that your biggest asset is not so much the useful experiance and skills transferable from RVing (and life!) very useful though they will be , but your mindset.

Anyone can live on $500 a month (or even less!) but most won't want to! or simply don't have the mindset to do so (especially as being broke is often lots of hardwork, takes effort and smarts! - lots of cash can negate the requirement for lots of those).

Whether "you" being able to live on $500 a month with much success boatwise (getting her seaworthy and going somewhere!) is also based around "you" - and particularly whether you can replace cash with smarts / hardwork / effort sufficiently to get enough enjoyment from the experiance to make it worthwhile for you. Everyone will be different on that - just because someone can live a life on a boat on $500 does not mean that they would be happy enough to do so....and IMO nothing wrong with that.

BTW - just to make clear that this thread is more about swapping ideas on living cheaply (on whatever budget) as it is on a strict $500 (likely that 99% of even low budget boaters spend more - just that each will be able / want / be happy to economise in differing areas).
David_Old_Jersey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 06:59   #470
Registered User

Join Date: May 2010
Location: St Pete FL
Boat: 1972 Contest 33
Posts: 781
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
Originally Posted by madgunny View Post
okay all, am new here, and was/am looking for advice about shoestring liveaboards and boat buying in general.
since finding THIS thread I am now certain I am in the right place. I have very little sailing experience and none as a liveaboard cruiser, but what I do have is a ton of experience as a full time RVer. cruising the highways for roughly ten years, almost always on a tight budget, so heres the crossover for my two cents..When I went RVing fulltime, I bought a fixer upper motorhome that ran, and made improvements as I had time/resources
I never bought new anything, swapmeet and sales ad finds only
I never paid for parking.. no KOA for me, stateparks or similar free camping only
I would hunt/fish/trap, and hit farmers markets or barter for most all food I used
Only once did I pay a repairman and that was to use his shop and tools when changing a motor.but I could have used a cheap comealong and a tall tree!
my income was from gunsmithing and general auto/repair
I had two young kids and a wife
we did it all on way less than 500 a month
now the kids are grown, the wife is gone and I'm thinking/dreaming of the sailing life. seems to me that just about all of the land cruiser tricks and moneymakers skills should convert to a water based lifestyle. what say you all?
I say STOP!

To much to fast. First go to your local marina yacht club and crew on a boat. Learn some sailing skills and learn if you even like to sail. You only think you do until a down pour with 6 ft swells.
I got my boat and hammered by a small storm and I mean storm off the coast of Florida (Johns Pass St Pete Beach to be precise ) and got knocked down twice.
Every sailor I have told was had fear in their eyes when I told them about it.
I now know when to reef how to reef and why I should reef. But most never want to be in that situation. I now know why I should wear a harness when single handing. It taught me a lot. I didn't like it at the time but now I'm glad yes glad I went through it. Like the Pardeys say, you are not a sailor until you go to sea.
I still watch the weather reports and make sure all is fine when I go out but still things happen especially in Florida and you never know what you will run into.
What I'm saying is see if this is the life style for you first then buy the boat.
__________________
Auto pilot is saying get up here and grab the tiller.
w1651 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 07:13   #471
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,949
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
But the cost is a factor you may not be prepared for. In comparison, RV'ing is cheap - VERY cheap - compared to liveboard cruising. Boats are much more costly to purchase, more difficult to maintain, and more expensive to repair by several factors - definitely more than twice as much, maybe less than 5 times as much - I'm not sure the exact factor.
I disagree with this--isn't the whole point of this thread to point out the ways you can do it on the cheap? For example, you probably won't have the fuel cost of driving an RV if you mostly sail, you can anchor practically everywhere for free, you can row a dinghy for free, you can buy a smaller used boat for a lot less than an RV with less space, boats basically have a floor on depreciation whereas RVs eventually reach $0, in many cases you can arrange it so there is no annual registration fee (CG documentation), many sail without any insurance or just liability, you can go where the weather is favorable so no heating or cooling, you can often catch fish and other food in these places, etc.

Bottom line we have found is that living on a boat on the water is a fraction of what it costs to live on land, even when comparable lifestyles are considered. I always joke about this now as I am not living aboard--but it is much cheaper for us to go on vacation on the boat than it is to stay home, even with annual maintenance, etc. taken into account.
__________________
Kettlewell Cruising
Kettlewell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 11:01   #472
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: missouri
Boat: still looking
Posts: 34
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

good points one and all, firstly, I've very little experience sailing, but am friends with several sailing / live aboard friends( who are also willing to throw in "expert" opinions for the price of a few steaks!) and are willing to help me out in the boat selection vs. floating wreck decisions, they will let me crew/ teach me to sail, and I can even raft up with them for the first little while, even though I will in all honesty probably rent a slip for working full time.. I'm not in the all or nothing financial level, so I can afford a few mistakes, as I have no expectation to get any return on my boat investments, just a cheap way to learn/get a feel for the lifestyle, as I said before, if I hate it, fine, I go somewhere else( maybe was another thread). I don't live super cheap because of a lack of options, merely because I'M CHEAP lol. and not being related to Bill Gates has hampered my playtime assets, I earn enough that I can afford to fix things as they come.
__________________
madgunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 11:09   #473
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: missouri
Boat: still looking
Posts: 34
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

kettlewell. good call on the depreciation values... after 10 years RVing, I drove three plumb intd the ground, $0 zero resale and that despite good maintenance and many upgrades.. I see about the same with boats, but as long as it still floats people seem to be getting something back out of it when it sells. Ilike the call on gas as well. ain't cheap, and although my boating friends all say they motor more than they sail( schedule keepers, every one) those little yanmar and A4's seem to get an awful lot more mileage than my 454 c class chevy ever did. lol Vheap living to me seems to be a state of mind.. I know RVers who "live cheap" on 2-3k a month, thats their comfort level, and I've been there, I've also been where 2-3 hundred was alot of cash.. seems like when I have money to burn I go looking for the matches, but when I get strapped for cash I get out the toolbox. go figure
__________________
madgunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 11:21   #474
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: WTB Lagoon or Leopard 38'-40'
Posts: 1,273
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettlewell View Post
I disagree with this--isn't the whole point of this thread to point out the ways you can do it on the cheap?
My assertion is that no matter how cheaply you cruise, RVing is cheaper
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettlewell View Post
For example, you probably won't have the fuel cost of driving an RV if you mostly sail, you can anchor practically everywhere for free, you can row a dinghy for free,
Even if used less often than an RV engine (a 454 is as bad as they come, some RV's have smaller engines - mine had a 1400cc 4 cyl), a boat is far less fuel efficient. It seems there are few people (according to my read from this site) who sail exclusively, or nearly exclusively. You have to motor whenever you are near land features, and if you have somewhere to be you have to motor to get there most of the time. And when you do, fuel efficiency is pretty poor.

An RV can be parked anywhere for free (though overnight camping is not "always" allowed)

You can row a dinghy for free - to where? Where can you row a dinghy to that will not cost money? As I stated, there are SOME places where can do this, but there are a great many where you cannot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettlewell View Post
you can buy a smaller used boat for a lot less than an RV with less space, boats basically have a floor on depreciation whereas RVs eventually reach $0,
I disagree entirely. Boats often reach a value of $0, and in fact reach values less than $0. An RV can never reach a value of $0 because it always has a scrap value of at least a hundred dollars, unless it happens to crumble more than 100 miles from the nearest town.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettlewell View Post
in many cases you can arrange it so there is no annual registration fee (CG documentation), many sail without any insurance or just liability, you can go where the weather is favorable so no heating or cooling, you can often catch fish and other food in these places, etc.
Ditto with an RV. Registration can be quite cheap, though you are right - it must be registered if you plan to take it on public roads. Most RV'ers are registered in Florida, Texas, or Nevada. Florida recent doubled it's annual registration fee from $25.00 to $50.00. Insurance is much greater cut than registration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kettlewell View Post
Bottom line we have found is that living on a boat on the water is a fraction of what it costs to live on land, even when comparable lifestyles are considered. I always joke about this now as I am not living aboard--but it is much cheaper for us to go on vacation on the boat than it is to stay home, even with annual maintenance, etc. taken into account.
Whenever I hear about someone RVing, or Cruising for less than $500 per month, I merely assume that they are breaking, bending, or abusing a number of minor laws - and that is how they are keeping it cheap.
__________________
ArtM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 12:30   #475
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: missouri
Boat: still looking
Posts: 34
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

well I like tje $500 a month bend to this thread, its lower than my monthly budget these days, but its a good ballpark to start an argument/discussion. lol. I've " bent " a few of those laws myself sometimes, and yes , people can disagree over the why's and wherefores about it, but it was what it was. I've always found that necessity was the mother of invention, but thank god she wasn't a lawyer. if people like to live on 500 a month, or 200 or $12.00, or maybe they do it out of a lack of options at the moment, then its fine, do it. I spend not a heck of a lot more each month, sometimes significantly less.. In my cabin in the backwoods, it's not unusual to go 2 months without a trip to town.. hunting/fishing the pond, doing the chores(firewood is a favorite!) these don't cost money, or at least very little, and in the off times or when its snowing, maybe I work on a customer gun or build a nice flintlock rifle on spec( in the hope someone will later buy it), these skill sets I think transfer well to a boating lifestyle, and if not, then at least the mindset. RVers on a budget practice the same mentality.. a big hammer and some duct tape can often save you the cost of a repairbill. I don't see boaters being so diffrent
__________________
madgunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 12:47   #476
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,949
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
Whenever I hear about someone RVing, or Cruising for less than $500 per month, I merely assume that they are breaking, bending, or abusing a number of minor laws - and that is how they are keeping it cheap.
Obviously, we disagree. My experience is different than yours. Here are just a few refutes:

I can't remember the last time I paid to dinghy ashore somewhere--maybe six years ago in St. Augustine, FL, but that is rare most places.

As I said, sail most places and you don't burn fuel. Maybe you don't do that, but I know people who do. I had some friends who did multiple Atlantic circuits without an engine over the course of decades. Plus there are no tolls most places, but there are often fees to check into various countries.

The lack of depreciation for boats is real--if it floats, and most of the systems work, it has value. Vehicles eventually get to the point where you pay someone to tow it away. I have never sold a used boat, and I have owned 8 of them, for less than I paid for it.

Free boat anchorages are perfectly legal, while free RV parking often is not. There are other countries in the world where the living is much cheaper than in the U.S., and you can get there cheaply by boat. In Panama my family of four had a hot meal (dinner) in a restaurant for $8 once. When in the San Blas there is practically nothing to buy, so you don't spend money. I hear Mexico is still reasonable.

Bottom line is I don't believe you have to break any laws to live cheaply, but you do have to be careful and work very hard at it. I'm not going to throw out a number, but I do think boat living has the potential to be cheaper than an RV.
__________________
Kettlewell Cruising
Kettlewell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 13:29   #477
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,635
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

one need not violate laws to live well under 500 dollars, us , per month. that statement is irresponsible.
is difficult t live under 500 usd per month in usa. is easy to do it inmany other places.
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 13:44   #478
Moderator
 
sailorchic34's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: SF Bay Area
Boat: Islander 34
Posts: 4,769
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtM View Post
My assertion is that no matter how cheaply you cruise, RVing is cheaper

Whenever I hear about someone RVing, or Cruising for less than $500 per month, I merely assume that they are breaking, bending, or abusing a number of minor laws - and that is how they are keeping it cheap.
Hum, I get about 12 miles per gallon of diesel on my boat, so a little better then a 34' RV.

Many many places to row a dinghy, many dinghy docks or city docks are free for a few hours use.

As to salvage value, many sailboats have lead keels worth at least 50 cents a pound, that even for my boat is about $1500 worth. So think sailboats can be salvaged more then a worn out RV. But lets just call that even.

I kind of hover around the $500 a month living expenses. Its not that hard to do and don't have to do anything illegal either. Oh don't have health care, but then even under obamacare the $500 a month cruiser is exempt from needing health care. That is there is no "health" tax on folks who's income is under $9000 per year... Actually there is no tax at all on folks who make less then $9000 a year.. No car, no car insurance, no utility bills, under $200 a year property taxes, etc, etc. No alcohol, drugs or smoking, that right there is a chunk.

Oh sure it does depend on where you live and what lifestyle you need/want. But even in northern California it's doable... barely... without breaking or bending a single law...
__________________
sailorchic34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 13:52   #479
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Boat: WTB Lagoon or Leopard 38'-40'
Posts: 1,273
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

you guys are more experienced than I am , so I appreciate the education. I go in part by what I've seen other cruisers posting in the past, and by what I see in person - but my "in person" experiences have been most limited to Miami and Keys area.

As to salvage value, we frequently hear about derelict boats that people don't seem to know how to get rid of, and I've seen suggestions that people pay to have them removed.

I know that I can pick up a phone in any town in the US, and someone will arrive to drive or tow away any RV or car that can be moved, and give me at least a few dollars for it.
__________________
ArtM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-03-2013, 13:59   #480
Wayfaring Mariner
 
captain58sailin's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Homer, AK is my home port
Boat: Skookum 53'
Posts: 4,045
Images: 5
Re: Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II)

Perhaps there is a business there, to salvage derelict boats, and sell the parts to lower budgeted people that need parts for their boats. You would have to figure out what to do with the hulls.
__________________

__________________
" Wisdom; is your reward for surviving your mistakes"
captain58sailin is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
budget

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Thoughts on a 1962 Columbia 29 Ripples Monohull Sailboats 283 17-10-2017 22:41
Shoestring Sailors (Cruising on $500 per month - part II) David_Old_Jersey General Sailing Forum 1353 07-09-2017 11:07
Pulled the Trigger on an Islander 34 Spadonky Monohull Sailboats 28 24-07-2015 02:15
Two Bilge Pumps on the Same Hose amarf Plumbing Systems and Fixtures 36 27-03-2012 10:23
OpenCPN Build on Windows - Please Help! kenchan OpenCPN 2 25-03-2012 18:55



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 16:37.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.