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Old 22-01-2019, 10:09   #1
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Sexism In The Sailing Community

I belong to quite a few sailing communities, on-line because I like to network with other people.. make friends, and learn. Several of them are "women only" sites. I didn't seek out groups for women only, but, as a woman, I did join them when I found them. I find the "women only" groups to be a good source of information, but, no better or worse than any other sailing community, such as this one.

That being said... I am so tired of the rampant "sexism" on those sites that I am very close to just walking away. Everyday there are postings bashing men. "Men don't respect me in sailing"... "men don't include me"... "men talk to my husband and not me"... "men are so sexists"..."The men wanted to watch a video about a male sailor, and they didn't realize how offensive and exclusive that was of women... They should have watched a video about a woman so that it was more inclusive"... on and on and on... enough already!!!

I have no idea where those women are sailing, but, I have never seen even one instance of men discriminating against a woman.. or talking down to a woman... or ignoring a woman in the sailing community. I have never been excluded from a conversation, or disrespected by a fellow male sailor. I find that the sailing community is one of the most inclusive breed of people I have ever met. Especially here! Cruisers forum is just amazingly welcome to anyone who loves to sail, no matter what demographic you belong to. Maybe it is because it is a sport where neither women, nor men have a physical advantage... we are all created equal on a sailboat. right?! So... I just want the male bashing to go away! We don't elevate our sex by trashing the other. I've gotta think that perhaps some of these woman are guilty of "finding what they are looking for".

Anyway... just a little mini-rant.. carry on!
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Old 22-01-2019, 10:35   #2
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Armchair sailors can be like that.. on both sides of the divide.. out on the water its another story.
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Old 22-01-2019, 10:38   #3
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Thanks Scarlet - I had the same experience.

I belonged to one womens sailing forum for about 24 hours. I made the mistake of saying that some group of people at the marina (so long ago I can't remember the details) were acting "like children". Wrong, wrong, wrong.

I was just about put in the stocks, lynched, burned at the stake, you name it. The entire thread became about my politically incorrect analogy. Then it became about men, sexism, historical enslavement, etc.

By the bottom of the first page the original subject was lost.
By the bottom of the second page, I "unjoined" the forum.

I've been treated well by the men we encounter, but we're not in a "yachtie" environment. Up here in the Pacific Northwest there are women doing commercial fishing, sailing, motoring, you name it. I think they're over it here, thankfully.
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Old 22-01-2019, 10:50   #4
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

I find boating a unique and interesting mix where social groups who would never otherwise interact, meet and work together daily. We've had "pampered" women on the dock tell my partner she should wait until her husband shows up before trying to tie up and help from some others who know more about boating than I ever will.

I try to keep my partner out of my galley and she prefers to helm while we are sailing. Others lead a really traditional lifestyle where she spends her time perfecting recipes and barely knows how the boat even works, while he will only BBQ. But at the end of the day, when we are sitting around having a drink and some appies on the dock, most cruisers are friendly, forgiving and interested in my focaccia recipe.

Personally, while I know women's issues still exist and sexism is rampant is some parts of our society, I prefer to subscribe to people-ism. I may assume a 95 lb woman needs help with a line, but then again I would do that with a 95 lb man.
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Old 22-01-2019, 10:50   #5
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

i have sites for women who cruise mexico--no man bashing, no anyone bashing. i have a site for cruising women. we only bash spiders. there is no reason to bash anything or anyone ever. if folks cannot get along they should not be in groups. everyone has positive stuff to share--why not just share and stop the bs.
the largest womens sailing group was started by a lady who was tired of being bashed by her bully husband and started her group. that group has changed drastically in the past years.
no i am not a member, as i choose not to be so.
when one searches hard enough there are groups of like minded souls who donot bash.
best of luck to you in your search for like minded souls with whom to share.
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Old 22-01-2019, 10:51   #6
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
we only bash spiders.
Here, here! Nasty little things
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Old 22-01-2019, 16:58   #7
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

A bit surprised because at least half of the really competent,
tough, hard core, gung-ho sailors I know are women.
Might even be more than half.
These sailors donít take **** from Anyone
A beautiful thing.
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Old 22-01-2019, 17:51   #8
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Hey.!!! Spiders have feelings too..
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Old 22-01-2019, 17:54   #9
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
.... we only bash spiders...
How insensitive of you!
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Old 22-01-2019, 17:58   #10
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Ive seen sexism here on CF in the past. For example, when a single female posts in the Crew Wanted section. But, havent noticed it recently.

Petty low brow behavior by men...as a male, I find it offensive.
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Old 22-01-2019, 18:38   #11
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Somone should start a mens only sailing/cruising forum and then troll the womens sites with the url and then watch the hilarious threads appear...

Or you could have one that is age exclusive...

Why stop there! There are so many Other ways to divide people!!

The women segregating themselves is a form of discrimination. Though i think most men dont care?
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Old 22-01-2019, 18:51   #12
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

I was very surprised one day when I read a thread on here where single girls were saying that they were worried about their safety living on board at marinas and in life generally, to the extent that they bought work boots covered them in mud and left them beside the boat. This was a bit of a wake up call for me, I must have gone through life with my head in the clouds because it had never occurred to me.

I think there maybe a place for women only places, forums etc..

Like everything though, if its not for you
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Old 22-01-2019, 19:02   #13
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Quote:
Originally Posted by scarlet View Post

Anyway... just a little mini-rant.. carry on!
Ok, you too
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Old 22-01-2019, 20:16   #14
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Hi, Scarlet and others !

Let us be honest ... and talk freely. Maybe I can give an insight by my own experience as professional sailor I work on traditional sailing ships (up to 42 meters / 245 tons displacement) I have to deal during a sailing season (7 months in Northern hemisphere) with different kind of charter guests, around 300-400 guests from May to October. - These charter groups are of very different sizes, from school classes with 30 participants to smaller family & friends collectives of 12-14. Some book just a weekend, others sail 4-5 days or one week.

Within this spectrum of groups, we also find "pure male groups" ... which exclude any female, naturally. Such male groups on their own can be of very different constellations, e.g. purely seniors, who know each other living as neighbours and working colleagues since very long in same village, and who oraganize seasonal sailing trips since 20-30 years. Or former student colleagues, who are in well paid jobs, and who enjoy it to see each other each couple of years just to have fun, without having their female partners on board. Or males who rent a sailing ship with crew (skipper, chief officer, cook) for celebrating a bachelor party, BBQ etc. ...

Personally I don't like such "purely male driven groups", as mostly one dominant component, beside the thrill and adventure seeking, is drinking, alcohol and/or drug consumption (excessively) and of course "dirty talks" (about absent women).

A women, who unluckily makes the eperience, to get in touch wich such "men habit", will feel it discusting, disrespectful and I can imagine, seeks for a peer group, e.g. specific online platforms "only" for women.

The sailing world is a mirror of our societies, you find the whole spectrum, family and kids friendly sailing to extreme macho habit. There is no need to generalize from one side against the other, as I suppose, if a women crew with a female skipper goes sailing we might also hear "dirty talks" and jokes about absent men. And most men would not feel well within souch femaile dominated crews, I suppose.

One has to seek carefully which community might be the right one to feel well. Also a man himself can feel uncomfortable, if he did come on board of a ship with a male group he cannot identify with their unpolite habit, uncivilized manners and (sexistic) macho attitudes.

What we do as professional sailors ? How we deal with such groups ? - We just take care that we bring back all safely. That's has first priority. If the guys are too drunken, we dont hoist the sails, avoid sailing manoevers, very simple the answer to gruops, which get out of control. The engine will do the job to bring the drunken souls from A to B and safe back into the harbour. Actually we know how to manage bigger sailing vessels with the professional crew alone. - If its going worst, some captains even decide just to go on anchor and wait, till all have a clear mind again. (Of course, that what no paying charter guest came on board for.)

Luckily such bad experiences are very, very rare. During one season, we have maybe 2-3 groups we better like not to have on board. But traditional sailing ships are very costly, so we deal it professionally, like hotel management deals with drunken guests. We are happy when they go from board without any injuries, and with no bigger damages of the ship. We expect the new charter guests with joy and happyness, as we know that most people (women same as men) are well educated, have good manner, and know to keep alcohol consume, dirty talking to a minimum everybody (and the females) can live with during their holidays, not feeling uncomfortable.

Naturally, amateur skippers mostly don't have the deeper experience to deal with such stressfully situations. In my understanding, its always the skipper who defines what kind of atmosphere on board is being created. Its his/her duty to care for every crew member, either its a child, stubborn and rebellish teenager, macho guy, feminists or seniors with limited physical strength.

And yes, Cruisersforum is a phantastic community. I feel very comfortable with the tonality I experience within every communication. Very helpfully and supportive. :_)

As a warm up for the coming sailing season ... here some ships I sailed in season 2018 ... :-)
Click image for larger version

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P.S.: I graduated at the nautical colleague in Netherlands with the captain diploma for commercial sailing vessels (up to 500 tons), see Enkhuizer Zeevaartschool ( www.ezs.nl ) .
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Old 23-01-2019, 05:58   #15
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Re: Sexism In The Sailing Community

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave_S
... I think there maybe a place for women only places, forums etc...
There might even be a place dedicated to cruisers.
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