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Old 15-07-2013, 12:58   #1
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Sailing Against the Weather

I was reading some article where author wrote that modern 30-35 feet cruiser will not be able to get out from the lee shore in a full gale. I am fully agree.
What I would like to ask - what is a boat of similar size which will be able to do so?
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Old 15-07-2013, 13:14   #2
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Re: Sailing against the weather

I am not sure there are any under full gale conditions unless you have motor or motors which can get you some sea room. The trick is not getting caught off a lee shore with no where else to go.
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Old 15-07-2013, 13:19   #3
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Re: Sailing against the weather

It is what I thought also. But wording in article made me suspect that there are such boats...
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Old 15-07-2013, 13:23   #4
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Re: Sailing against the weather

Our old Palmer Johnson Standfast 36, with a 29 ft. waterline was able to motor-sail off a lee shore in about 55 knots, using storm jib and engine, and tacking, after the eye of a small cyclone passed over the anchorage. It had been forecast to go 1/2 way between Raoul Is. and Tonga, but did not go where anticipated. I don't know if we would have been able to sail her out without the engine being on.

Ann

P.S. Perhaps the scariest part of that exercise was how hard it was for Jim to work the manual windlass with the waves coming in when we went to get the anchor up.
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Old 15-07-2013, 13:35   #5
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Re: Sailing against the weather

I do not feel good with fact that I can not go against the wind if motor fails.. But probably in some weather it what we have. Interestingly - can we predict where is such wind/waves for different boats?
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Old 15-07-2013, 13:46   #6
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Re: Sailing against the weather

[QUOTE=sea_kaban;1285765What I would like to ask - what is a boat of similar size which will be able to do so?[/QUOTE]

Is there a list of such boats?

I hope I never find out if I can do it because I probably had to cut away the anchor (that probably was holding) and would be fully committed to the action.
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Old 15-07-2013, 14:15   #7
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Re: Sailing against the weather

Quote:
Originally Posted by sea_kaban View Post
I was reading some article where author wrote that modern 30-35 feet cruiser will not be able to get out from the lee shore in a full gale. I am fully agree.
What I would like to ask - what is a boat of similar size which will be able to do so?
IMHO either you are not saying what the article said or the author was bsing.

I think most modern boats will. Modern boats tend to sail better to windward than older designs. Some of them may be less comfortable upwind in a gale.

You do need decent sails in full gale though. I think small and flat sails tend to work fine.

Older designs that will: Carter 30, J/35, Bavaria 35, Jeanneau 32.

Send a PM to Mark J, ask if his Bene will.

What is in the article? Can I read it online?

b.
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Old 15-07-2013, 14:20   #8
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Re: Sailing against the weather

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IMHO either you are not saying what the article said or the author was bsing.

I think most modern boats will. Modern boats tend to sail better to windward than older designs. Some of them may be less comfortable upwind in a gale.

You do need decent sails in full gale though. I think small and flat sails tend to work fine.

Older designs that will: Carter 30, J/35, Bavaria 35, Jeanneau 32.

Send a PM to Mark J, ask if his Bene will.

What is in the article? Can I read it online?

b.
I am trying to find it out... May be it is in one of magazines...
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Old 15-07-2013, 14:34   #9
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Re: Sailing against the weather

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Originally Posted by sea_kaban View Post
I am trying to find it out... May be it is in one of magazines...
I looked up Wiki and found myself wrong: full gale may be possibly another meaning for whole gale (= storm force). That's not how I use it (I tend to name a gale a gale and then there is a storm, which is likely technically incorrect on my side).

So I say in a whole gale many boats may struggle, also many older designs.

Many newer designs have tall freeboard/structures and this does not help in a storm.

Many older designs are generally inefficient upwind.

I would stick with smaller, flat-cut sails and choose a boat that is neither of too classic design nor of a modern, paper boat, design.

Apologies for all possible mess-up I caused with my above post!

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Old 15-07-2013, 16:27   #10
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Re: Sailing against the weather

Quote:
Originally Posted by sea_kaban View Post
I was reading some article where author wrote that modern 30-35 feet cruiser will not be able to get out from the lee shore in a full gale. I am fully agree.
What I would like to ask - what is a boat of similar size which will be able to do so?
Well If by "modern "The OP means high freeboard, low weight ,full sections and a rather flat and full entry, I am inclined to agree that in gale conditions this type of craft be at a disadvantage compared to many traditional craft when going to weather and manned by the usual mom and pop crew.

It is almost a given that the sea state will be short and steep and brutal. It has been my experience that those with the dingy type hull form will have a particularly difficult time getting away from our dreaded lee shore. That said, in lighter conditions or downwind, or even marina living ,going modern has a lot of appeal.

There was a thread a while back that got a little silly regarding this lee shore business but I think this topic is worth exploring ;besides it was 102 degrees today here in the Hudson Valley and I am afraid to go outside to my boat.
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Old 15-07-2013, 16:34   #11
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Re: Sailing against the weather

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It has been my experience that those with the dingy type hull form will have a particularly difficult time getting away from our dreaded lee shore.
what type of hull is that?
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Old 15-07-2013, 16:43   #12
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Re: Sailing against the weather

It will also have a lot to do with the guy sailing the boat and his sail selection.

Also, depending on the type wind and his experience, he may be able to sail through "holes" in the wind. If he knows to wait and select the times to go forward or to hold his position, he may be able to get out. This would take a good crewman on the main and jib sheets though and the skipper giving orders unless the crewmen are really good. (and in a position to see what wind is coming)
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Old 15-07-2013, 16:59   #13
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Re: Sailing against the weather

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what type of hull is that?
"Too much" displacement fore does not help. I found narrow entry boats sail against bad seas best.

But I would pay very close attention to the sails - a 'lee shore efficient' hull will not get away with it if the sails are too big, too baggy or poorly located.

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Old 15-07-2013, 23:04   #14
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Re: Sailing against the weather

I can recall recently light displacement boat (SO 439) was sailing perfectly upwind on flat see, but lost a lot of speed against the modest waves. I think because it is light. In the same time leeway of such fin keel boat is significant. In some waves I would expect progress to just stop...
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Old 16-07-2013, 02:06   #15
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Re: Sailing against the weather

surely the tacking angle has a lot to do with it? we can tack through less than 80 degrees in ideal conditions, but more like 110 degrees in stronger winds, sloppier seas.
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