Removing a bee hive from the mast

[seadago]

Originally Posted by mikereed100

Thanks to all for the great replies. Unfortunately, most suggestions don't apply in my situation as the only insecticide i have found anywhere in Tapachula is Raid. The soapy water thing sounds interesting. The trick is getting it to the top of the mast. The hive is inside the mast at the sheaves and any disturbance sends a cloud of very pissed off bees out the top of the mast. I have a few seconds to do whatever I am doing, but by the time they reach the top spreaders it is time to retreat to the cabin until they settle down again. As others have pointed out, these are almost certainly Africanized bees.

I have rigged up a contraption that I can haul up the mast that will carry a can of Raid that, theoretically, I can aim into the hive and trigger from below. On the first try it got stuck on a spreader and the can discharged into the air. The bees did not even bother to swarm me that time, preferring to mock me with their indifference. I will try again today.

Of course the preferred method would be to let a beekeeper, ("apicultor" in these parts) deal with it but I have not been able to locate one.

If it comes down to it we will be heading to Costa Rica next week and hopefully this move will take care of the problem. The problem is, I will not be able to raise the main, or reef it, without the risk of being stung.

Mike, chemicals (that you can buy OTS) won't do it. Not because they don't work, but because you wont be able to apply them effectively. If the hive is inside the mast cavity, try the black bin bag trick -previous posting-. If you can get to the mast top, it's something you can acomplish in a couple of mins, minimising you exposure to stings. A sudden rise in temp to above 40 deg C WILL kill the bees. The same method is used to kill wood lice and termites in old wooden buildings. You will still have to clear up the mess inside after, but at least it will be less of a hazzard.

[RaymondR]

I have accessed the top of the mast on boats without mast steps to replace halyards by rafting up to another boat and using a line over upper spreaders to winch the masts together (Won't work with cats) Perhaps you could do this to ambush the little buggers and slip the garbage bag over them.

Farmers use pills which release a gas in grain silos to kill insects. The pills don't react with alloy and come in alloy cans.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by RaymondR

I have accessed the top of the mast on boats without mast steps to replace halyards by rafting up to another boat and using a line over upper spreaders to winch the masts together (Won't work with cats) Perhaps you could do this to ambush the little buggers and slip the garbage bag over them.

Farmers use pills which release a gas in grain silos to kill insects. The pills don't react with alloy and come in alloy cans.

The bag/ multiple bags sounds like a good idea. I'm not sure about the stealth approach method.
I wonder if a good wet suit would be adequate protection. I have no idea what might work for your face, a bee keepers hood? . if they could be bagged it would seem introducing spray would be much more effective. A pro sounds much better.

[mikereed100]

I think the bag idea would work brilliantly, but I would not be able to get it over the VHF antenna, so would have to just wrap it around and hope for the best. To be honest, I am losing interest in anything that involves me at the top of the mast with the bees. The little buggers are vicious and I am racking up stings daily. I have made a couple of attempts with my custom "bee-liminator" but the 1.0 and 2.0 versions were failures. I will try version 3.o tonight. This is a box I have made with a can of Raid and spray mechanism that I haul up the spinnaker halyard, but aiming is a challenge.

Interestingly, any messing with the bees during the day results in a bloodthirsty swarm, but I can fiddle around at night without them stirring. Last night, however, I had a bit of a different result when I moved the main halyard, which passes directly through the hive. Hundreds of bees began dropping around me, a handful flying but mostly just dropping and walking around the deck. By morning they were all dead, whether from cold, hunger or despair, who can say? Today we noticed several larger bees, drones I presume, on the deck.

Current plan is to try my bee-liminator again tonight, then, assuming it does not work, I will sew rags onto the halyards and soak them with Raid and pull them into the hive. I may try garlic as well. The idea would be to make life unpleasant enough that they would relocate. We plan to head for Costa Rica next week some time. Hopefully the 3-4 day passage will encourage them to leave. It has worked on relatives in the past.

[Clamdigger]

First off, folks the term 'killer bees' was coined by the media. The correct term is Africanized bees, which escaped some experimental hives in Brazil in the 1960's iirc. They are more aggressive than typical honeybees used by beekeepers. If you piss off a hive of africanized bees they will swarm and attack anything trailing co2, be it human, animal. Not to be messed with by average person, certainly not with a can of Raid and jury rigged outfit!

Normal bees are sedated, calmed with a smoke can, and dealt with accordingly. In this case your best bet is to unstep the mast to deal with removal. If need be submerging the masthead underwater for 30 minutes to an hour will kill 90-95% of the bees in saltwater. Some will be trapped in the mast, so blocking exits below the spreaders will trap them. Have a suited beekeeper deal with the removal once the mast is on sawhorses. You have honeycomb and honey gunking up the works, so anticipate removal of the masthead. Pressure washer will come in handy.

Kept bees for years and never worked around africanized, thankfully!!

[seadago]

Originally Posted by mikereed100

I think the bag idea would work brilliantly, but I would not be able to get it over the VHF antenna, so would have to just wrap it around and hope for the best. To be honest, I am losing interest in anything that involves me at the top of the mast with the bees. The little buggers are vicious and I am racking up stings daily. I have made a couple of attempts with my custom "bee-liminator" but the 1.0 and 2.0 versions were failures. I will try version 3.o tonight. This is a box I have made with a can of Raid and spray mechanism that I haul up the spinnaker halyard, but aiming is a challenge.

Interestingly, any messing with the bees during the day results in a bloodthirsty swarm, but I can fiddle around at night without them stirring. Last night, however, I had a bit of a different result when I moved the main halyard, which passes directly through the hive. Hundreds of bees began dropping around me, a handful flying but mostly just dropping and walking around the deck. By morning they were all dead, whether from cold, hunger or despair, who can say? Today we noticed several larger bees, drones I presume, on the deck.

Current plan is to try my bee-liminator again tonight, then, assuming it does not work, I will sew rags onto the halyards and soak them with Raid and pull them into the hive. I may try garlic as well. The idea would be to make life unpleasant enough that they would relocate. We plan to head for Costa Rica next week some time. Hopefully the 3-4 day passage will encourage them to leave. It has worked on relatives in the past.

Sure! At night worker bees are dormant.
They are visual forragers, so need daylight to operate. Wrapping the mast in plastic may work just as well. Make sure the plastic you use is black or dark colour. That's what will absorve the sun's heat and increase the temperature. Transparent food wrap polyethilene will not work I think. Good luck.

[DockDoc]

Hello,

I raise and keep bees so a few things I would and would not do.

1. Do not spray or attack at night. You will be in the dark and the hive will be full. They will still defend the hive at night! If they didn't BooBoo and Yogi would have it easy.
During the midday motor even just a few yards away. Foraging bees will go back to exactly the same spot the hive was located and they will be "lost".
Now you're dealing with a lot fewer bees. Much easier, I do this when I open hives to inspect them, I open in the daytime, never at night or early morning.

2. Use very soapy water to drown them. Bees breathe thru their exoskeleton, you will suffocate them. They could live without flying for months as is evidenced by the queen, and attendant bees who almost never leave the hive. Dawn and some water works fine in a pressurized spray can that can be hoisted to you. BY spraying and moving you will get rid of them in a non toxic way.

3. Get a beekeeper jacket with hood. You can buy, or perhaps a beekeeper will lend you one. You could rig up some tape and netting MacGuyver jacket, but bees work as a group. They will not come out and randomly sting you. One of the guard bees will come out, decide your a threat and sting and mark you. It will smell like a faint ripe banana scent. Once that happens your going to be full forced assaulted by every bee until they are dead or you are dead or removed from the hive. They will go for your face where you exhale carbon dioxide. If you have even a tiny hole somewhere in your suit, they will find it, imagine 600 bees on your face stinging you, while you are 60 feet in the air. Even Belushi can't make that funny.

4. I do not think you can save these bees. I have tried many times to save hives and swarms. The queen has to be caught and transferred, preferably with some brood (capped cells with larva inside). You might get a beekeeper to go up a mast and kill them, but I wouldn't count on it.

5. You can try toxic elements up or in the mast, Carbon Monoxide just seems like a bad idea, but it is a toxic gas that is slightly lighter than air. "Air" is mostly nitrogen and 18-21% oxygen. Whatever you use has to be a lighter than air gas.
I think someone said wrap the mast. This will work as long as there are no other exits/entrances for the bees. It will take days for them to die. Bees can go a long time, and they are experts at heat and cold variations.

Good luck, please update us.

[Mauruuru]

I'd suggest using air instead of water for less mess.....use an airpump if you have one for an inflatable-usually have different tips that will plug the end of the tubing and air pressure will blow the bug killer out the other end

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by billknny

If you were in the USA, I would suggest doing what I have done in the past when presented with the challenge of a beehive, call a local beekeeper. There are a lot of enthusiastic amateur and professional beekeepers who would jump at the chance to add another queen to their stables.

I'll bet if you get in touch with the locals, someone nearby knows someone, who knows someone, who loves bees and would be happy to help in return for a few pesos.

There are plenty of bee keepers outside the USA...ask around. Ive seen bee keepers resolve this exact issue in both Guatemala & Belize.

[german64]

I was anchored near the beach, enjoying the sea and the sun, when suddenly saw hundreds of bees accumulating on the port side of my boat. In a few minutes there were thousands. Everything was becoming black due to the number of bees!
My wife and kids went outside the cabin, I put my weather clothes, covering my body as much as possible, turned the engine on, pulled the anchor up and moved the boat out, far from the beach. After 2 or 3 miles, all the bees flew away. Only one managed to get into my jacked and bitted me!

[SVPerpetua]

In Mazatlan a fellow cruiser was told be the marina manger to soak a rag in kerosene (ring it out some otherwise a big mess) and host it up the mast on the halyard and leave it there for a day or so. You may have to resoak the rag again but this drove the bees away. Worth a try?
Pat

[fatherchronica]

We have used a product you can purchase online from bee keeping websites, I forgot the name and I am too lazy/busy to go to Mana for the name, but it is a spray that smells like almond extract. If you spray it in the general direction of bees they fly away poste haste. I do not know how a hive would react as bees are pretty well trained to protect their homes.

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by DockDoc

Hello,

I raise and keep bees so a few things I would and would not do.

1. Do not spray or attack at night. You will be in the dark and the hive will be full. They will still defend the hive at night! If they didn't BooBoo and Yogi would have it easy.
During the midday motor even just a few yards away. Foraging bees will go back to exactly the same spot the hive was located and they will be "lost".
Now you're dealing with a lot fewer bees. Much easier, I do this when I open hives to inspect them, I open in the daytime, never at night or early morning.

2. Use very soapy water to drown them. Bees breathe thru their exoskeleton, you will suffocate them. They could live without flying for months as is evidenced by the queen, and attendant bees who almost never leave the hive. Dawn and some water works fine in a pressurized spray can that can be hoisted to you. BY spraying and moving you will get rid of them in a non toxic way.

3. Get a beekeeper jacket with hood. You can buy, or perhaps a beekeeper will lend you one. You could rig up some tape and netting MacGuyver jacket, but bees work as a group. They will not come out and randomly sting you. One of the guard bees will come out, decide your a threat and sting and mark you. It will smell like a faint ripe banana scent. Once that happens your going to be full forced assaulted by every bee until they are dead or you are dead or removed from the hive. They will go for your face where you exhale carbon dioxide. If you have even a tiny hole somewhere in your suit, they will find it, imagine 600 bees on your face stinging you, while you are 60 feet in the air. Even Belushi can't make that funny.

4. I do not think you can save these bees. I have tried many times to save hives and swarms. The queen has to be caught and transferred, preferably with some brood (capped cells with larva inside). You might get a beekeeper to go up a mast and kill them, but I wouldn't count on it.

5. You can try toxic elements up or in the mast, Carbon Monoxide just seems like a bad idea, but it is a toxic gas that is slightly lighter than air. "Air" is mostly nitrogen and 18-21% oxygen. Whatever you use has to be a lighter than air gas.
I think someone said wrap the mast. This will work as long as there are no other exits/entrances for the bees. It will take days for them to die. Bees can go a long time, and they are experts at heat and cold variations.

Good luck, please update us.

Very informative, thanks!

[MagnusS]

I have successfully used a vacuum cleaner with an elongated hose to exterminate wasp nests. The last couple of meters of hose has a rod taped to it, sticking out an inch or so. By pushing an sucking, the whole nest can be damaged and be sucked in with all the hysterical wasps, and by waiting and running now and then for an hour or so, returning wasps searching for the nest will be sucked in as well. I have not needed any protective clothing during the operation, and I have used it several times.
When turning the suction off, tape the hose opening. Then get an anti-insect spray, remove the hose from the vacuumcleaner and spray into the chamber. DO NOT RUN THE VACUUM CLEANER WITH SPRAY IN THE CHAMBER. It may explode, if the spray gas is flammable.
After spraying, tape the chamber opening and await the wasp humming to become dead silent.

Maybe some variation of this method could be used on a beehive in the mast?

[HopCar]

I agree with the suggestion to move the boat. Do it in the middle of the day when the foragers are out of the hive. You might have to do it several times.

This product might help but I’m not sure how you would apply it. I use it to get bees out of the honey boxes when I want to harvest the honey.
https://www.betterbee.com/harvesting...SABEgKN0PD_BwE

Bee careful, I worked an Africanized hive yesterday. Even with my full bee gear on I was stung five or six times. My buddy who was working with me left his bee suit outside. When he came back an hour later the bees were still attacking the suit!