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Old 01-08-2013, 09:35   #226
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
You must be easily impressed. Any idiot can post on the internet, only the clueless post on a forum expecting only a group hug. For sure it needs a bit of a thick skin on some subjects, but CF pretty tame as far as internet forums go.
.
I'm not the only one who was surprised a guy posted here, laying fresh meat out for the wolves. It may be better than most forums, but it ain't all that in terms of kindness and generosity. PErhaps some of you spend too much time on the other ones, and have lost perspective on what helpfulness and education really looks like? Half the time I feel like I'm in middle school here, and I'm one of the ones that pays a little to help support something I value. I guess I'm not afraid to give a guy a hug who just lost a boat, but maybe that makes me queer? Lots of jaded old cynics here....think that people need a spanking to insure they do it right in the future?

And often the same cast of characters that lack the finesse to really make a teaching moment of it. Can't entertain your buddies online and really help someone at the same time, at least not always, not this time. If helping someone looks like this, then we are living in a different paradigm for sure. Nothing to be done about that, but I feel compelled to say how I feel. I do not look to this forum for validation, but as a sheepdog running among what I see as wolves - I can't help myself.
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Old 01-08-2013, 09:37   #227
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
No one can ever be 100% ready for anything the sea can dish out to a sailor in a small boat. Not even 90% ready. Not even 50% ready, probably.

We were all beginners once and we all learned most of what we know by making mistakes, mostly stupid ones. By the grace of God, they didn't kill us, and most of us didn't lose boats, but it could have happened to any of us.

I'm not saying you shouldn't learn anything -- of course you should. You need to know a lot of things, and you need to have a lot of skills, including how to fix broken systems. It's also very useful to be tough, resourceful, and stubborn by one's character. But not any single one of us waited to go to sea until we had amassed very many of the needed skills -- not one. In this sport, the training is mostly of the school of hard knocks variety. In my opinion, it's ridiculous to blame someone for going to sea "unprepared" -- we are all unprepared, to some degree or another, every time we go to sea. You get gradually better prepared as you learn from making mistakes -- that's the only way forward. But you're still only relatively prepared. And anyone who thinks otherwise is making just one more rookie mistake.
Amen, brother.
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Old 01-08-2013, 09:44   #228
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
saying that ... maybe the 80% of the sailing comunity dont know how to use a sextant
I would think 99.5% of the sailing community does not know how to use a sextant (I don't), and that 80% of the ones that do haven't had enough practice in recent years to actually use one in anger.

The sextant thing is a red herring for a debate. Those days are past, as are rdf's and navigating by wave train interference. None of the abandonments in the past decade would have been prevented if the sailors could use a sextant.

GPS's are ubiquitous and backups are pretty much immune to mainship electrical problems. We have two cameras on board with navigable GPS built in!

HH units, tablets, phones, cameras, watches, dongles, radios, etc containing GPS are everywhere - no problem getting basic position information anywhere, anytime. We took a direct lightning hit that took out everything wired on the boat except the GPS antenna/receiver (the display was gone), and all of our non-connected GPS devices were fine.

And yes, the whole satellite system can be brought down by a sharknado. The sun might also not shine for a month at a time.

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Old 01-08-2013, 09:45   #229
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by kmacdonald View Post
WOW, abandoned ship with the mainsail still up. Time to pile on!!!!!!!
Guess you never thought of the benefit of visibility? Come on, this nonsense is for the other forums. I know you're trying to be funny, and I want to recognize the effort.
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:01   #230
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

I remember coming out of Half Moon Bay with my girlfriend on my Olympian 34. It was like a washing machine out there and I wanted to shake down the boat before I set off south. We had a fun time and I felt I should head back. There was a very large Coast Guard cutter off in the distance making for the anchorage also. I had losts of time to get in before him. So when I went to start the engine, it started then died. I tried cranking it but to no avail. The cutter was getting on me and it was blowing 25. I tried tacking in but the waves were setting me past the jetty. The cutter squeezed in past me and I could see a few sailors on board with astonished faces looking at me. I tried the engine one more time. She fired up and I full throttled into the anchorage entrance. Later, as I tore into the engine area, I found a piece of sandpaper that had floated out of a milk crate that was near the engine. It sucked into the screen of the intake killing the engine. In all the comotion it had fell off , allowing the engine to start. My engine room on this boat is really tidy. Another lesson learned.
It's easy to become critical on the Internet of someone but eventually we all will experience something that could potentially get us in big do do. This is the reason we work into sailing further and further out. Like Captain Ron use to say..."If somethings going to happen...it's going to happen out there".
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:09   #231
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by colemj View Post
I would think 99.5% of the sailing community does not know how to use a sextant (I don't), and that 80% of the ones that do haven't had enough practice in recent years to actually use one in anger.

The sextant thing is a red herring for a debate. Those days are past, as are rdf's and navigating by wave train interference. None of the abandonments in the past decade would have been prevented if the sailors could use a sextant.

GPS's are ubiquitous and backups are pretty much immune to mainship electrical problems. We have two cameras on board with navigable GPS built in!

HH units, tablets, phones, cameras, watches, dongles, radios, etc containing GPS are everywhere - no problem getting basic position information anywhere, anytime. We took a direct lightning hit that took out everything wired on the boat except the GPS antenna/receiver (the display was gone), and all of our non-connected GPS devices were fine.

And yes, the whole satellite system can be brought down by a sharknado. The sun might also not shine for a month at a time.

Mark
I was never quite confident in my sextant skills. But I kick butt at dead reckoning . I always loved to DR our current position every 24 ( offshore) then see how close I was. Even the mistakes were a fantastic learning opportunity. The ocean is a hinky place . Near shore it is vital, especially in reef strewn waters.

PS, the comments about the boat making it to port is not accurate, she is on a reef, that is not making it, not a successful landfall.
IMO, This thread is not for criticizing the op defects and judgement. If you want to turn it into a learning experience, do what someone else did and start another thread about system failures, or fatigue, singlhanding etc. keep the personal out of it and the learning will happen, pointing fingers only brings out the "your not fit to be a sailor crap". This thread was to support a person while they are down, community.

I remember a longtime CF poster and popular judgment giver having a very very bad day. The thread was full of sorry and support. That is the way it should be for everyone.
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:15   #232
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by rebel heart View Post
This guy bailed from a perfectly good boat, probably spilled fuel on the reef, left Mexico with the disposal, got a free ride home, and is off to have a beer at the marina.

And you're taking issue with the denigration of that ?
I hope your windvane install is going better today
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:17   #233
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by cheoah View Post
I'm not the only one who was surprised a guy posted here, laying fresh meat out for the wolves. It may be better than most forums, but it ain't all that in terms of kindness and generosity. PErhaps some of you spend too much time on the other ones, and have lost perspective on what helpfulness and education really looks like? Half the time I feel like I'm in middle school here, and I'm one of the ones that pays a little to help support something I value. I guess I'm not afraid to give a guy a hug who just lost a boat, but maybe that makes me queer? Lots of jaded old cynics here....think that people need a spanking to insure they do it right in the future?

And often the same cast of characters that lack the finesse to really make a teaching moment of it. Can't entertain your buddies online and really help someone at the same time, at least not always, not this time. If helping someone looks like this, then we are living in a different paradigm for sure. Nothing to be done about that, but I feel compelled to say how I feel. I do not look to this forum for validation, but as a sheepdog running among what I see as wolves - I can't help myself.

Great post. I was thinking along the same lines.

I don't think the OP was looking for a group hug, but he likely wasn't expecting to get skewered by one-liners from the cheap seats, either.

Don't make me quote Teddy Roosevelt's "Man in the Arena (Not the critic who counts)" speech.
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Old 01-08-2013, 10:24   #234
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Guess you never thought of the benefit of visibility? Come on, this nonsense is for the other forums. I know you're trying to be funny, and I want to recognize the effort.
It should have been sunk. If not to eliminate the navigation hazzard, to keep the drooling bystanders from profiting.

When someone bleeds in the water like that, they should expect sharks to gather.
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Old 01-08-2013, 11:21   #235
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

Quote "GPS's are ubiquitous and backups are pretty much immune to mainship electrical problems. "

Agree.

Over here in the UK, the RYA, who are the body who 'govern' sailing and sail training are still very big on paper charts. As far as I am aware, their Dayskipper to Yachtmaster Ocean qualifications are still 100% based on paper navigation.

Like roller furling genoas, GPS is a subject that offends the 'purist' but like furling genoas, mobile phones, microwaves and all the other things that were meant to kill us, pretty soon everyone will accept them because they are so damn handy. And, as you say, when you have three battery powered backups on board, the old arguments against are getting less convincing.

Personally, I have never had a failure on my GPS system(s) but I have been unable to use my paper chart when I had to be on deck in a combination of a wind tunnel and a jacuzzi.

As my mate says, "show me an airline pilot who still navigates with a paper chart on his lap and I'll throw my GPS overboard".
Rav.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:01   #236
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

Link to local newspaper story. Not much info there. I did learn a new word ECOCIDIO, which I translate as an expensive day for the OP.

Encalla otro velero en el Parque Nacional de Arrecifes de Xcalak
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:12   #237
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

Translated basically the woman say,,,, Thaa Hunter do a lot of damage to our reefs... Natural Park?? good job... and is the second boat stuck in the reefs this year, previously another boat named Ayla hit the reefs , Ayla rest in the bottom, no idea whats next with serenity, but i suspect the mexicans are going to remove serenity no matter what and probably sunk it if is holed....
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:15   #238
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Translated basically the woman say,,,, Thaa Hunter do a lot of damage to our reefs... Natural Park?? good job... and is the second boat stuck in the reefs this year, previously another boat named Ayla hit the reefs , Ayla rest in the bottom, no idea whats next with serenity, but i suspect the mexicans are going to remove serenity no matter what and probably sunk it if is holed....
There will be some red tape and fees, no doubt, but it's not like this is the first or biggest boating disaster ever to hit the Mexican coast.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:16   #239
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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Originally Posted by 1ercru View Post
Link to local newspaper story. Not much info there. I did learn a new word ECOCIDIO, which I translate as an expensive day for the OP.

Encalla otro velero en el Parque Nacional de Arrecifes de Xcalak
A translation of the article:

Run aground sailboat 'Serenity'; new ecocide in Banco Chinchorro

A sailboat with American flag ran aground overnight yesterday at the atoll reef Banco Chinchorro, damaging at least 10 colonies of coral in the area.

The boat is located one kilometer from where the 'Ayla' ran aground.

The Director of the reserve of the biosphere of Banco Chinchorro, María de el Carmen García Rivas, said that in the coming days they made the study of the area to accurately determine the affected area, as well as actions to be carried out to prevent further damage.

For the second time in the year so far, a sailboat ran aground on the shores of the reefs of Xcalak National Park. The first was the Argentine-born 'Ayla' sailboat, which was stranded on 23 March, the second is the 'Serenity' ship, which was found on 30 July.

As part of the journey undertaken by the authorities of the authorities of the National Commission of natural protected Areas (Conanp) on the shores of the reserve, as part of the measures of protection and shelter in the area, mainly to avoid illegal fishing of marine species in veda, the location of this boat was possible.

According to the preliminary report, the ship Serenity is of American origin, and it was abandoned by its crew members, since at the time that the staff that carries out the routes in the area fell to inspect found his or her possible pilots.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:18   #240
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Re: Regret to Inform Have Lost my Boat off Honduras...

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I hope your windvane install is going better today
I walked an hour from the Home Depot back to the boat carrying two 6' sections of 2" pvc. It's gotta be over 100 out there.
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