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Old 15-04-2014, 11:55   #346
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Originally Posted by Palarran View Post
The only things I'd personally be interested in is why did the motor leak when it ran and how could that be prevented and why did the boat loose steering. There are a lot of instances lately with these same problems and it would be good to have options to repair if it ever happened. Loss of steering especially seems to be a common problem with abandoned boats.

Yeah the loss of steering is something that I've contemplated... It does seem to often be the cause of abandonment. I have thought to myself in the past that I would have a really hard time leaving the boat, due in large part to the loss of steering. I'm pretty handy (and have a degree in engineering, if that helps!) and have thought thought that I'd HAVE to be able to figure something out... But then I was out in pretty heavy conditions again a week or so ago, and thought about it again while I was actually out there in the conditions, and pretty quickly reconsidered ;( the force that is applied to a rudder in heavy weather is so amazing, the thought of being able to jury rig something that would last for more than a couple waves was kinda scary!

I was thinking that the taking on of water on RH was possibly due to the loss of steering, and the resultant taking on of waves at an unfavorable angle. (An already leaky 36' boat could potentially be pretty wet in that situation). And it probably sounded worse in her blog writing because from her motherly perspective she was a host to the rescuers, and the only space for them to sleep was where they were getting wet. So maybe to her it was unacceptable, and to rescuers always wanting to look like unflappable tough guys (which they are!), it was no big deal

But I do think that there's usually something to learn from unfortunate situations of others... Even if they don't want to/are being told not to speak etc, we can still use the situation as a hypothetical to game plan any other possible options that could have been employed differently....
Let's just say that the steering was a defining reason to hit the button, what are the best tactics to deal with disabled steering? (Could either be broken and freely turning, or frozen in one direction)
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:00   #347
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Hi Boaty!

I take it (and no one knows as we are in the dark) that Eric used his satellite phone. There was no word of an EPIRB activation and it would have been a pretty stupid thing to do in their situation whilst they had a sat phone.

According to Charlotte's blog they punched the EPIRB. This was also reported by the SAR team early in the process. That was 3 days before the parachute jumpers arrived on scene.
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:12   #348
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

Loss of steering is unlikely on the Hans
36, does it not have a robust worm drive steering and a emergency tiller? Leaking fuel tanks prior to leaving?
I saw this couple in La Paz over a period of several weeks and advised them to have a method of long distance comms, I believe they purchased a sat phone.
Both the children were exposed to measles prior to their leaving and yes, there was dengue fever around. The marina was spraying for it continually.
Despite RH large number of posts on cf he seemed to lack any offshore experience as did his wife and it would appear they just had enough and came up with a excuse to push the big red button to get off. In turn this has cost the taxpayer a huge sum not to mention putting life's in danger. The USCG did not take part in this rescue. It was the National Guard and the US Navy. Now the funds that have been donated should go to the wounded warriors and not lining their pockets for endangering themselves and the children.
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:21   #349
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

baz--That all may be, but your comments seem unkind and intended to get this thread closed.
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:34   #350
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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According to Charlotte's blog they punched the EPIRB. This was also reported by the SAR team early in the process. That was 3 days before the parachute jumpers arrived on scene.
Oh? OK. I stand corrected.
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:49   #351
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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baz--That all may be, but your comments seem unkind and intended to get this thread closed.

Unkind? It's the truth. No good trying to make excuses for poor judgement. The sea is seldom kind.
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:56   #352
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Unkind? It's the truth. No good trying to make excuses for poor judgement. The sea is seldom kind.
It isn't the truth, it's wild suppositions based on the small amount of often contradictory information that is currently available, mixed in with your personal opinions.

Your post seems designed to fire people up, not add anything useful. You're playing the Troll.
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Old 15-04-2014, 12:57   #353
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Unkind? It's the truth. No good trying to make excuses for poor judgement. The sea is seldom kind.
And so apparently are you!!!!
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Old 15-04-2014, 13:11   #354
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

Sailing offshore never has "Perfect" timing. I have been known to loose patience waiting for the "weather window" and just took off when the weather looked bearable.

On the other hand, we can look at this story constructively and use it as a good reminder to double check certain things before taking off, Even though I believe the main issue with Eric's family was the baby's health.

And I agree that the Hans 36 has one of the most robust steering and rudder designs in the industry with the ability to quickly attach a emergency tiller if it breaks. So I am assuming that part of the story got miss-interpreted some how, unless the rudder bolts broke loose.
Lesson here is to double check my rudder post and mounting brackets.

A few years ago there was a "Wannabe" sailor who took off from PNW headed for Hawaii and made it several days out before his rudder fell off. He was picked up by a freighter luckily, never to try it again..sad.

From tidbits of the story seams like the electronics got knocked out. Possible salt water got into the power panel? I am making sure that even if the cabin got soaked, my panel and batteries will still be dry.

Leak in the boat? I would make sure I have backup hoses, wood plugs, hose clamps, bolts, etc etc for stopping the water coming in.

Just some thoughts.
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Old 15-04-2014, 13:20   #355
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Now the funds that have been donated should go to the wounded warriors and not lining their pockets for endangering themselves and the children.
By the way, it is exactly what Mr. and Mrs. Kaufmann asked the prospective donors to do
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Old 15-04-2014, 13:37   #356
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Unkind? It's the truth. No good trying to make excuses for poor judgement. The sea is seldom kind.
Commence the eye rolling!

You all are regurgitating the same old misinformation. Misinformation that is corrected on this very same forum and some on this very same thread(with links to creditable sources).

Since assumptions abound here, I can only assume that 1) you are personally very well versed in stupidly 2) your motives are to simply spread gossip and misinformation. 3) Since #1 and#2 have troll like characteristics, I can only assume there are more than a few trolls slithering around here.

I don't have the energy to pick apart the plethora of imaginative (read stupid) posts, I'll just remind everyone that at the end of the day there is a little baby who is not dead, thanks to the parents diligence and sacrifice, thanks to a few hundred heroes with the 129th, Coast Guard, and Navy. And no thanks to you, the "I told ya so" armchair sailors.
Sheesh.
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Old 15-04-2014, 14:17   #357
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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According to Charlotte's blog they punched the EPIRB. This was also reported by the SAR team early in the process. That was 3 days before the parachute jumpers arrived on scene.
Actually, what the blog says is that they had three days from the time they pushed the EPIRB until the Vandegrift arrived - the PJ's probably asked them to turn it on to serve as a homing beacon.
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Old 15-04-2014, 14:22   #358
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

Looks to me like the PJ in the background has his hand on the wheel like he is driving. I don't know why you would bother trying to drive a boat that didn't have steering.

Try to explain wind-vane self-steering to the general public in a sound bite. Good luck!

Just a wag but maybe they lost their self-steering which as far as the media is concerned means they lost their steering.

Now tell me how Eric is supposed to single hand the boat back without self-steering? Maybe that was the reason he abandoned the boat? Because he didn't have a choice?

I mean seriously, if you want to speculate fine. At least put your thinking caps on.
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Old 15-04-2014, 14:22   #359
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Personal note to the Rebel Heart Kaufman Family:

Please take your time, get well and I sincerely hope you get everything sorted out and launch into a bright, successful future; whether cruising or not, that's for you to decide... do whatever works best for your family.

Ignore all the criticism from the press, forums and others as best you can. When you're ready, you'll certainly be welcome back here anytime on CF with our full support. If you decide that you want to talk about your cruising experience.... that's fine, if not... that's fine too.

Cheers

Ken
Ditto that!
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Old 15-04-2014, 14:32   #360
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

All,

It is not a sin to criticise RH and the events, nor is it a sin to deconstruct the events, if done in a manner that is for the pursuit of knowledge versus pure belligerance.

We all understand there is little information to work with and much of it is contradictory, but that does not mean there is a conspiracy. It is best to avoid ad hominum style reductions as it only breeds conflict and does not add anything to the discussion.

Most importantly the be nice rule applies both to supporters and detractors - and applies to old members as much as new members!!!! Just because someone is criticising events does not mean they aren't protected by the same rules as supporters of events.

This event has many of us feeling uber-protective, but let's not let "vigilantism" prevent the truth from being wiggled out of this story and helping others avoid this same fate.

I say this as a father of small children who has also done long passages and understand the immense difficulties this entails and there is little "real" information about what is involved. I say this even after multiple passages made before having children, the difficulties of sailing wi little ones can be intense.

I found my first passage with wife and 20month old vastly more difficult than single handing.

Let's try and let the truth come out and let legitimate criticism and deconstruction happen so we can learn from this important and unique event.

Thanks.
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