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Old 14-04-2014, 14:08   #271
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post

The other thing that strikes me as odd, is that the council for the defence repeatedly try to " wish the blog away", like its almost it's an embarrassment. They even talk after the latest blog post by Charlotte ( which ads to the perplexing situation ) that somehow her personal perspective and the truth could be different. That's strikes me as almost like saying, "she was hysterical M'lud "
Her blog is her story, not a recitation of facts. There's no reason that it should coincide with anything. The entire tone of the post was her emotional reaction to the events, not a cold description of the day to day activities or an instructional reconstruction.
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Old 14-04-2014, 14:10   #272
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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so at this stage it is probably a que for eric to speak.
I believe Eric will speak. Only the words will be in a book for sale on Amazon.
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Old 14-04-2014, 14:15   #273
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Her blog is her story, not a recitation of facts. There's no reason that it should coincide with anything. The entire tone of the post was her emotional reaction to the events, not a cold description of the day to day activities or an instructional reconstruction.

Yes but it is the truth as she sees it, that's good enough for me.

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Old 14-04-2014, 14:18   #274
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

[QUOTE=goboatingnow;1518765]Yes but it is the truth as she sees it, that's good enough for me.

Dave


True enough.

I think we all have the basic picture. As we get further from the event, we'll probably have a better chance of figuring out any lessons learned, and I think there were some.
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Old 14-04-2014, 14:20   #275
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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I believe Eric will speak. Only the words will be in a book for sale on Amazon.

Maybe.....

Amazon.com: cruising mexico eric kaufman: Books

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Old 14-04-2014, 14:23   #276
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Yes but it is the truth as she sees it, that's good enough for me.

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I wouldn't even assume that, more like "it's the truth as she wishes to present it". I see nothing wrong with using a blog to present her story the way she wants it known. She's under no obligation to inform anyone.

The National Guard Crew, however, were at a press conference. They were under an obligation to present facts and inform.
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Old 14-04-2014, 14:40   #277
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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I wouldn't even assume that, more like "it's the truth as she wishes to present it". I see nothing wrong with using a blog to present her story the way she wants it known. She's under no obligation to inform anyone.

The National Guard Crew, however, were at a press conference. They were under an obligation to present facts and inform.

In my experience rescuers will go to many lengths to avoid embarrassing rescuees , especially at the time of , or near the rescue when everything is emotional fragile


Hopefully Charlotte will keep up her blog. While I personally countenance against overtly private blogs that are made public , I appreciate them for the mental insights they bring to the debate , rather like that young girl and the Cat and the Atlantic crossing recently.

Mind you I find once the pain subsides, most don't want to talk about the "'reality " they experienced and often like to replace it with a sanitised version ( kinda like childbirth) , often these deeply personal " trauma" blogs disappear shortly thereafter. Especially so if a books in the offing !

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Old 14-04-2014, 14:51   #278
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

here is a very good article from my old friend Darrell Nicholson of practical sailor,whom we cruised the pacific with many moons ago.
he raises some very good points


Treating Child Illness at Sea - Inside Practical Sailor Blog Article

Rebel Heart and Emergencies at Sea

Posted by By Darrell Nicholson at 01:21PM - Comments: (12)

April 8, 2014



Practical Sailor profiled air ambulance rescue services in its March 2014 issue.


The story of the rescue of a sick 1-year-old girl, her parents, and toddler sister from aboard the boat Rebel Heart last week provoked a storm of controversy over whether ocean voyaging with young children is sensible. The Kaufman family of four was pulled from their boat about 900 miles off the coast of Mexico, when the youngest child, Lyra, 1, was covered in a rash and had a fever.

Although my wife, Theresa, and I made a conscious decision after 10 years of living aboard to move ashore to have children, I have known many cruisers who have raised their children aboard. In every case, their own lives and the lives of their children have been richer because of this experience.

What interested me most about the Rebel Heart story were the practical matters. Would it have been possible to treat this infant at sea? Should we be prepared for these types of emergencies—particularly those of us sailing with vulnerable crew, be they the young or the old. (See my recent column about the experiences of the crew aboard Corsair.) Like many cruisers I know, my most frightening experiences while cruising had nothing to do with storms or pirates, or all the imagined threats that landlubbers conjure up. They were health related—severe skin infections, venomous fish, dengue fever, debilitating gastrointestinal illnesses, you name it. Tropical paradises, people often forget, is rife with tropical diseases.

Telemedicine Trends

The March and April 2014 issues of Practical Sailor addressed a growing trend in health at sea, the use of telemedicine services to treat onboard illnesses remotely, and the growing number of private air-ambulance services to rescue people in remote places. Although it is unlikely that the family’s rescue would have gone differently had they subscribed to an air-ambulance service (none of the services we polled are equipped to manage such a complicated at-sea rescue), a subscription with one of the telemedicine services we profiled might have allowed the Kaufman’s to treat their daughter on board and keep their boat. (Ultimately, the U.S. Navy scuttled Rebel Heart, so it would not be a navigational hazard.)

One of the reasons that Theresa and I chose not to have and raise children aboard our boat were our own dicey experiences with illness in the tropics. (Our threadbare, vagabond lifestyle at the time raised other salient concerns, as Theresa put it—“I’m not giving birth in the forepeak!”) But if we had decided to cruise with young children, we would have likely avoided long passages and kept pediatric care within close reach. If we had decided to embark on longer passages such as the Kaufman’s into the Pacific, I would have likely invested in satcom equipment (as the Kaufman’s did) and subscribed to one of the telemedicine services offered today. But there are other, more affordable options.

Predeparture Planning

One of the biggest benefits of telemedical services is the pre-departure consultation, which ensures that you have pharmaceuticals and first-aid tools on board to treat the most likely ailments. You don’t have to be a subscriber to benefit from this pre-departure advice. It can be a one-time consultation.

This is the path we took before we set out. Before our own departure, we paid a private physician who specialized in tropical diseases to consult us on equipping our first-aid kit, which included several courses of antibiotics of different types. He and my father, who is a physician, also helped us build a library of books on board for treating illnesses, and provided specific guidance on the use of the medications we had. For non-prescription supplies, we looked at various commercial kits and built our own based on their contents. Our December 2008 issue profiled Practical Sailor's favorite pre-packaged medical kits for voyagers.

Fortunately, when the most serious illness struck Theresa (dengue fever), we were near an island clinic, but even then, the only thing that the doctors could do was diagnose the problem and prescribe an anti-nausea pill that we did not stock (but soon did). Ultimately, I was the one who treated her using our own medicines to control fever and ensure that she remained hydrated.

The bottom line is that when you do decide to embark on a more prolonged cruise, you will almost surely find yourself in a situation where you have to be your own doctor, if only temporarily. Like storms and squalls and reefs, illness is something we should try to prepare for as much as possible. Though it is reassuring that such rescues at sea are possible in worst-case situations like the Kaufman’s, it would be wrong (and potentially fatal) to embark on any cruise without making our own health and the health of our crew a top priority.

Editor's note: For those inclined to donate, a fundraising site has been set up to help the Kaufman family.
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Old 14-04-2014, 15:11   #279
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

dengue fever - boy I'm not gonna sleep tonite.
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Old 14-04-2014, 15:14   #280
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

Atoll, you're right this is an excellent article.

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Old 14-04-2014, 15:19   #281
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

Delfin asked, "how the heck does a 36 foot fiberglass HC become unsound enough after 9 days half becalmed to ship water with every wave? Something unanticipated before leaving shore, I have to assume, because if this is true, no responsible mariner would have left shore until the vessel was sound. I'd like to understand what that catastrophic event was, since it sounds like something to prepare for."

Delfin, it doesn't have to be catastrophic. We once had the sealant under the lip of the hatch frame let go mid Pacific. The sea water then came in onto our best sea berth, and both the salt water soaked sleeping bag and the sprinkles in the face impaired sleep. [Adequate rest is very important for couples at sea.] Said hatch had never leaked before, and nor, was it possible to fix, beam reaching in 20 ft. seas. There was no danger, but I felt miserable and whiny. And that's only one way enough water can get in to be demoralizing. The half of their days being very light airs is irrelevant, if RH's ingress problem was from sealant failure like that, the water "eats" its way at it, unbeknownst to one till it fails and comes away, loses its grip on the fiberglass and metal, and then it's just gone!

Something some of the posters here don't seem to get is that it is almost impossible to write an objective "truth" in a blog, except about mechanical things: there's never enough time or perspective for objectivity. And the unfolding of the RH story certainly seems to illustrate one reason why one might not want to have one.

Another issue raised above pertains to men leading their partners into their dreams. Until I met Jim, I sailed for sociable entertainment. It was from following him into his dream that we adopted our lifestyle together. I gave up a separate dream to do this. Such decisions are extremely individual. I would say that established couples should probably reach the go or no go decision together--especially to the extent that the less willing one feel okay about doing it. One couple we know has an arrangement that if either one of them doesn't want to go (wherever), or leave port that day, neither goes. All of us, men and women, have their own tolerance levels for inter relationship inequalities.

'Nuff for now. We'll be offline for a while.

Ann
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Old 14-04-2014, 15:34   #282
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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The National Guard Crew, however, were at a press conference. They were under an obligation to present facts and inform.
The people who rescued Rebel Heart's crew are professionals. What would it serve to go 1400 miles to rescue people, and then throw your traumatized victims to the wolves in the media in the post-rescue press conference? They're under an obligation to inform, and to present the information in such a way not to fuel more controversy for your victims.

This wasn't their first rescue, and it wasn't their first press conference.
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Old 14-04-2014, 15:44   #283
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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In my experience rescuers will go to many lengths to avoid embarrassing rescuees , especially at the time of , or near the rescue when everything is emotional fragile


Hopefully Charlotte will keep up her blog. While I personally countenance against overtly private blogs that are made public , I appreciate them for the mental insights they bring to the debate , rather like that young girl and the Cat and the Atlantic crossing recently.

Mind you I find once the pain subsides, most don't want to talk about the "'reality " they experienced and often like to replace it with a sanitised version ( kinda like childbirth) , often these deeply personal " trauma" blogs disappear shortly thereafter. Especially so if a books in the offing !

Dave
Some people here are saying "Oh gawd -- they might get criticized on a public forum! She ought to be keeping those thoughts to herself!"

The fact is that the reason the blog is interesting is because she gives her real opinions, and doesn't sugarcoat it.

They might get a bit of criticism, but I'm thinking the blog is useful to others who might choose this path. Their donation site has raised $18K. I'm thinking partial credit for that goes to the blog.
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Old 14-04-2014, 15:46   #284
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

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Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
Delfin asked, "how the heck does a 36 foot fiberglass HC become unsound enough after 9 days half becalmed to ship water with every wave? Something unanticipated before leaving shore, I have to assume, because if this is true, no responsible mariner would have left shore until the vessel was sound. I'd like to understand what that catastrophic event was, since it sounds like something to prepare for."

Delfin, it doesn't have to be catastrophic. We once had the sealant under the lip of the hatch frame let go mid Pacific. The sea water then came in onto our best sea berth, and both the salt water soaked sleeping bag and the sprinkles in the face impaired sleep. [Adequate rest is very important for couples at sea.] Said hatch had never leaked before, and nor, was it possible to fix, beam reaching in 20 ft. seas. There was no danger, but I felt miserable and whiny. And that's only one way enough water can get in to be demoralizing. The half of their days being very light airs is irrelevant, if RH's ingress problem was from sealant failure like that, the water "eats" its way at it, unbeknownst to one till it fails and comes away, loses its grip on the fiberglass and metal, and then it's just gone!

Something some of the posters here don't seem to get is that it is almost impossible to write an objective "truth" in a blog, except about mechanical things: there's never enough time or perspective for objectivity. And the unfolding of the RH story certainly seems to illustrate one reason why one might not want to have one.

Another issue raised above pertains to men leading their partners into their dreams. Until I met Jim, I sailed for sociable entertainment. It was from following him into his dream that we adopted our lifestyle together. I gave up a separate dream to do this. Such decisions are extremely individual. I would say that established couples should probably reach the go or no go decision together--especially to the extent that the less willing one feel okay about doing it. One couple we know has an arrangement that if either one of them doesn't want to go (wherever), or leave port that day, neither goes. All of us, men and women, have their own tolerance levels for inter relationship inequalities.

'Nuff for now. We'll be offline for a while.

Ann
Fair enough. I guess I was thinking of something more than that which can be fixed with a roll of amalgamating tape or duct tape.
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Old 14-04-2014, 16:11   #285
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Re: Rebel Heart's Contribution to the Cruising Community

My wife and I discuss our offshore sailing openly so that we both understand each other and I know how much she can handle. So far she has not come with me when I sail offshore, but likes to sail with me in the Puget Sound and coastal areas. I don't pressure her to sail with me, but I am patient until she feels confident enough to go with me.

One time I took a friend with me that had some Puget Sound experience and had a dream to sail offshore. But as soon as we cleared the straight we went right into some large swells and wind waves enough to come over the deck.
After that trip he didn't want to sail offshore again. Apparently he thought the open ocean was not much different than sailing on the sound until he experienced it.

To me, heavy weather sailing is addicting and I like the challenge, while others get freaked out.
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