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Old 31-12-2004, 23:57   #1
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Pop the cork

Champagne all around. We got the boat Sailing for it's first time. I was very impressed. I thought she would be as slow as an ole boot. I have even had a few comment on why on earth did I buy something so slow. One even made a sly comment that if I wanted to see the worl, I had better start now, as it would take me all my life to sail anywhere.
So for those that don't know, I have a Ferrocment Hartely Tahitian 46ft Ketch. She has a modest engine, 6cyl Perkins @120HP. This will push here along at about 7.5knts comfortably. She has only ever been under power. We purchased her Dec 2003 and spent all last year and all last dollars getting her to a Sailing state.
Well the weather hasn't been great, but we got an opertunity to get the sails up at last. I couldn't believe the responsivness from her. She just came alive. What power these vessels have. We clock 9knts. The speed is over ground registered by the GPS, but the motor was only giving us 7.5Knts. So sailing was pushing us along faster.
I have a few things to finish yet and hopefully when Summer is actually here, we will be spending much more time Sailing.

One point of interest to a discussion we had awhile back, in regards to locking the shaft or not. I noticed that in light air, with motor off, under Sail, we would sit at about 3-4knts. If I started the motor and let it idle in gear, the speed would quickly build to 7knts. Now normally at idle under engine power only, we would only sit at around 3-4knts also. Under Sail power only, at 4 knts you can here the whine of the gear train come in, so I know the prop is spinning the shaft up with the water flow. I am suspecting that the prop turning under engine power was causing far less drag than the prop being turned by water flow. Thus more speed with engine in gear at idle. It will be interesting when I get to a stage of being able to lock off the shaft and see what happens.


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Old 01-01-2005, 03:30   #2
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Congrats on finally sailing.

Are ya guy guys selling everything and moving onboard?
(Wish I was)

Got some pictures of the ship?

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Old 01-01-2005, 10:42   #3
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have you thought of a folding prop? i did and picked up about a knot and a half no vibrations, no wear and
tear . jt
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Old 01-01-2005, 13:15   #4

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Congrats, Alan! I am happy to hear you are ready to go! Now comes the true enjoyment - sailing.

Best of luck, and best wishes.
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Old 02-01-2005, 00:53   #5
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Thanks Guy's.
CSY, no we sold everything to buy the boat in the first place. We lived aboard last year, but I needed a workshop. My wife gets cheap Airforce rent, so we moved back to a house with a Garage for my gear. And yep, I better work on some pictures hadn't I

Jt, I have looked at props. But mate they are very expensive. Probably worth it, but I figured I have to keep priorities at the mo. I Still have a lot to have to buy and fit to her. So the luxury of another knot has to be left to something of greater importance at present.

I still have some work to do. One main area of problem is the Genoa track system. I tried to drill a hole through the Ferroncement decking. It was impossible. So as I was running out of time before our trip, I thought I would glue to the deck, a strip of timber and fix the track to the timber. So I sanded down the paint till I met what I thought was epoxy. I then bedded the 4" wide timber strip down to that epoxy coating, with one of those new generation polymer Adhesives. Damn good stuff. But under a very strong gust, up cam the timber strip along with the epoxy coating. So I reset it down again to the Cement. This so far has held. But I only consider it a temporary situation. I want to fix the tinber via bolts or something more peramanent. I may have to try diamond hole cutters, but don't know how that will handle the steel core. Or I also thought of shooting nails through, (called Ramset here)but I can't find anything SST so far.

I also have a small sail repair to do. I got caught by a gust that came from a different direction. It's a common problem sailing in our sounds and I need to get a prventer rigged before my next outing. But anyways, the boom swang around with great force and I had all the sail slides break off along the foot of the main. Oooops

So here is a question. Does everyone use plastic sail slides/plastic shackles???? Should I be considering something stronger, or are they kinda the week link so as no worse damage results????
I have had fitted SST slides at each Battern point to act as a strong point to stop the "zipper" effect of slides breaking up the mast track. Should I do the same along the Boom??

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Old 02-01-2005, 02:19   #6
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Congrats on getting sailing.As for drilling and fixing the track to deck if we cannot drill a hole with a normal hammer drill we use a rotary hammer drill start small and slowy increase in size.We than use bolts all the way through making shore they are sealed or if blind drill 1mm over the size of s/s all thread you want to use and than put chemset in the holes and just push the all thread in and in 12 hours they will never move.Chemset is a ramset product Cheers greg.
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Old 02-01-2005, 03:55   #7
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Drilling Concrete (ferro-cement)


To drill into or through coarse masonry materials, including ferrocement, you need to use a hammer drill (percussion drill) and a carbide masonry bit.
A hammer drill enhances the fast rotating action of the bit, with a slight impact that helps to break up material being drilled.
Use a carbide tipped percussion masonry bit for hammer drilling. Deep-fluted bits (as opposed to Fast-spiral) are best used in concrete, where the deep flutes help clean out the concrete chips and dust.

Mark the location for the hole with a rather large cross, or 'X.' Masonry bits tend to jump around a bit as, they're being started, and a smaller mark might disappear.

Set the drill to run on itís slowest speed (350 - 750 RPM), or control it with the trigger to do so. This increases both the effectiveness of the hammering, the effective torque, and ease of control.

Push the drill hard enough to keep it moving, but don't try to force it. Let the drill do the work (in fact, applying too much pressure reduces the impact).

Frequently removing the bit from the hole, to clear out the cuttings, will help prevent the bit from overheating (but do NOT immerse the bit in water to cool it off).

- Always wear safety glasses when cutting into concrete.
- Hammer Drilling tends to shatter the material as it penetrates, resulting in a tendency to "blow out" a section of the material as the bit emerges on the back side.
- Let the tool do the work for you.
- Keep the dust out of the hole you're drilling into.
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"If you didn't have the time or money to do it right in the first place, when will you get the time/$ to fix it?"

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Old 02-01-2005, 08:28   #8
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There are drill bits for concrete to use in your regular drill. If you can get a few 5/16 or 3/8 bolts in your piece of wood it should work. Whatever you use be careful that the area does not crack, I do not think this will happen because of the hole size and the fact that there is reinforcing within the concrete. I built a dodger for a concrete boat in 1968 and advised the owner to figure out how to attach it as I did not have the equipment at that time. Which slides are you referring to? I got industrial strength ones for my new main that go up the mast, they are some kind of plastic but I do not think they will break. There are also stainless steel slides of the kind that go on the main tack at the boom. My main is loose footed so there is only one. Did you see my post where I mentioned I would like to talk for your yacht broker friend.
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Old 02-01-2005, 11:29   #9
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Thanks for the suggestions guy's. I have had quite some experiance with drilling concrete. I worked on several large construction sites installing the sound systems. My problem is I am using a standard eveyday handymans hammer drill and cheap carbide bits. So I think I will borrow the air hammer drills I used when installing. The big advantage is the quick locking bits are a little better at handling steel when they meet it. I think the ordinary "cheap" bits can't and that maybe my problem.

Thanks ozskip. I have considered the chemset stuff. Looks interesting and would help seal the bolt after fixing as well.

Sorry Mike, I didn't see your question to me.
Are you buying or selling??
Email Toby McDonald ( the new owner) at Ted Church Marine.
Tell Toby Wheels sent you
Good luck.

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Old 02-01-2005, 12:30   #10
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Exclamation Alan, one more thing

If you happen to run into a piece of rebar you'll have to switch drills to get thru the metal. See link below. They come as small as 3/8" (10mm) and as big as 2-1/2" (64mm). For larger holes you can get water cooled core drills. They can be purchased from a cement tooling supplier

A standard cement drill will not go thru rebar but will glance off and elongate the hole or will not move at all. This drill below only needs a standard drill motor but you'll have to pre-drill with the cement drill to get to the rebar, if any.
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Old 02-01-2005, 17:14   #11
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Thumbs up Sucker's delight!!

At each boat show that I attend, I find some gadget or another that appears interesting, and inevitably I get suckered in. Well, at one show, a man was drilling old files. Not the kind that you stuff junk into, but the kind that you use to reshape metal. They are hard, very hard. He was drilling holes like they were wood. Nice trick. What else will it do?
"Well", says the man, "these bits will drill concrete, steel (hardened or otherwise), most metals, wood, ceramics, and virtually anything else that gets in its way." That is a tall order but the man was convincing so I took a bite. For mere money, I could now drill any substance on my boat. Yeah, sure. If the drills are half as good as he said they were, it would be worth the investment.
The first attempted use was on the bed of my wife's truck. I could have penetrated the steel sheet metal better with a soldering iron. A patent failure. The second attempted use was into cast iron. The drill penetrated like it was in butter and most surprising was my attempt to drill into a reinforced concrete floor. The drill penetrated the concrete at a rate equal to that of a solid hardwood. When it came upon a rebar, it continued like the substance did not change. I was amazed. I have attempted many times to drill into concrete with less than stellar results. This time was different. The name of the bits is "Rodman" and they are made in the USA. The only information I could garner from the box was the phone number 800-228-1806.


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