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Old 07-06-2013, 21:04   #46
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Irrelevant. Common law marriage laws in Australia don't automatically assign the rights of ownership of property, they have to be awarded by a court.
Quite true!
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The above case is clearer though. The boat is nationally registered and has been owned by the same person for a very long time. She'll get it back, but the money's gone and as far as I can see is unrecoverable. The buyer may be well out of pocket here.
Not necessarily true but could be depending on circumstance.

First of all, Michel and/or the boat may never be found even if either (or both) are still in Australia.

Second, from what we know from the facts presented so far, it is quite possible that the boat has been sold legally and thus the new owner would have clear title. This could happen without the owners knowledge if she has nominated another party (ie Michel) as the ships registered agent. She may have done this years back and never changed it. From my limited knowledge of the shipping act, the agent has similar powers as the owner. We have been told that she entrusted Michel to sell the boat.

What remains intriguing (at least to me), is the discrepancy from what has been offered here as fact to that which is freely available on the shipping register. Of course, a full search of the title at AMSA can be made but that does incur a fee - and my intrigue is not enough to part with cash
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Old 07-06-2013, 21:10   #47
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

We are in Yeppoon and cruising north over the next couple of months. We will check the marina here and keep an eye out on our travels. I wish the owner all the best in resolving this, what a shame.
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Old 07-06-2013, 21:51   #48
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

Hey Geoff, it doesnt need to be registered with AMSA unless going offshore. So the 1985 boat is a different boat..
No AMSA = No government guarantee of ownership.

no hindrance ot a private sale.

New buyer will be in the poop.

Lastly, new buyer will not be hiding it if he thought it was a legitimate deal.

If so it should be easy to find.

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Old 07-06-2013, 22:42   #49
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

Ah, but it IS registered with AMSA. See first post in the thread.

Whether it can be recovered depends totally on the nature of the rights given to the missing seller, as Wotname says above. If he was given this in writing, the PO is out of luck and it becomes a civil matter.

This is somewhat complicated by the fact that the yacht is not actually on the register yet, looks like it was applied for but not completed.

http://www.amsa.gov.au/Shipping_Regi...ps/Page_70.asp

I'm pretty sure the 1985 boat will be the same one, the name, length and age match fairly well. And they don't allow more than one on the register with the same name afaik.
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Old 07-06-2013, 22:55   #50
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Ah, but it IS registered with AMSA. See first post in the thread.................
This is somewhat complicated by the fact that the yacht is not actually on the register yet, looks like it was applied for but not completed.

Reporting Ship Sourced Marine Pollution Incidents
Yes, this is complicating the issue.... and is it the same boat? The info from the OP seems to suggest it is.

In the meanwhile, all we at CF can do is keep our eyes open when near or on the water. The boat could be anywhere.....
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Old 07-06-2013, 23:06   #51
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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....... And they don't allow more than one on the register with the same name afaik.
Yes, that is my understanding. I also note from the photo posted back on page one that she is not marked in accordance with the requirements of the register and that suggests she has not had the marking note signed off and lends weight that she is not yet officially on the register, rather that registration has been applied for but not ever completed.

If that is the case, a new owner will not have a legal title and will just be a receiver of stolen goods. Boat (if found) reverts back to legal previous owner and new owner is out of pocket unless they can find the thief and take civil action to recover their loss.

As already mentioned several times - this is a messy one....
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Old 08-06-2013, 01:31   #52
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Something is not right here. As of the 4th June, shipping register lists a "Tuska" with a official number of 85170 with a home port of Hobart but not yet registered. Year of completion is 1985.

This doesn't quite match details already posted by the OP
See Reporting Ship Sourced Marine Pollution Incidents
Tuska may be currently State registered, not Australian registered?
Australian registration looks like it was in the process of being completed.

Edited to add: A boat can be sold simply with State registration paperwork - a form simply needs to be filled in and the owner's signature included. If someone was "entrusted" to sell the boat, this form may well have been signed and handed over by the owner beforehand.

I think the fact that it has been owned for years yet is not on the AMSA register means it probably had State not Aussie registration (Aussie registration is a one off thing and does not ever need to be renewed).
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Old 08-06-2013, 03:04   #53
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Originally Posted by Wotname View Post
Something is not right here. As of the 4th June, shipping register lists a "Tuska" with a official number of 85170 with a home port of Hobart but not yet registered. Year of completion is 1985.

This doesn't quite match details already posted by the OP

See Reporting Ship Sourced Marine Pollution Incidents
Okay now you have got me going "Wotname" The official name of the vessel is "Tuska of Sydney" and Jan informed me the vessel has been offshore before, does this not mean according to Australian law she has to have completed the registration process? And yes she does also have NSW boat code registration, with which the boat may have been sold. Further Jan has filed a Police report and received documentation in regards to this. Last I heard Jan was contacting AMSA. One further question what other markings than the Australian numbers engraved in the main beam are there?
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Old 08-06-2013, 04:51   #54
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

Thats all for the marking. Definately contact AMSA and check if there is a change of registration application. They should have all the 'new owners' contact details.
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Old 08-06-2013, 08:06   #55
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Okay now you have got me going "Wotname" The official name of the vessel is "Tuska of Sydney" and Jan informed me the vessel has been offshore before, does this not mean according to Australian law she has to have completed the registration process? And yes she does also have NSW boat code registration, with which the boat may have been sold. Further Jan has filed a Police report and received documentation in regards to this. Last I heard Jan was contacting AMSA. One further question what other markings than the Australian numbers engraved in the main beam are there?
Cheers Tom
Well as you can see from AMSA's website, the ON 85170 lists the name simply as Tuska with a home port of Hobart and as of June 4, not yet registered!

Marking also requires the vessels name on the hull near the bow in letters 100mm high with a sans serif font. At least it used to, maybe it has changed and I'm not current
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Old 08-06-2013, 08:13   #56
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

yep, correct with the name on the hull as well
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Old 08-06-2013, 14:32   #57
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

If the vessel were named "Tuska of Sydney" that is how the Aus. national reg. should read, not plain "Tuska." To me, "Tuska of Sydney" suggests NSW registry, or that the owner or agent failed to complete the national rego. I'm wondering why the "of Sydney" wasn't painted on the boat in the pic we saw? What does that tell us?

Yes, a big mess.

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Old 08-06-2013, 17:39   #58
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

Further to this debate, if one acquired a boat in a dodgy manner, would one keep the name?

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Old 08-06-2013, 22:51   #59
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Well as you can see from AMSA's website, the ON 85170 lists the name simply as Tuska with a home port of Hobart and as of June 4, not yet registered!

Marking also requires the vessels name on the hull near the bow in letters 100mm high with a sans serif font. At least it used to, maybe it has changed and I'm not current
Thanks for all the comments, it certainly does seem a rather confusing matter. I managed to receive some clarification from Jan today. I feel comfortable with her explanation and am abiding by her request not to make this information public, as of yet. This will eventually make a great story, and who better to write it than the lady herself.

In regards to the MARKING it may have been my inability to post the second photo, which clearly shows "TUSKA OF SYDNEY " engraved on the back of the Boom Gallows I would perceive the letters to be about 100 mm high.

My request acting on behalf of Jan Murray has not changed can anyone traveling or cruising NSW OR Queensland please keep an eye out for this vessel. Cheers Tom
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Old 08-06-2013, 23:14   #60
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Re: Missing Lyle Hess Cutter

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Thanks for all the comments, it certainly does seem a rather confusing matter. I managed to receive some clarification from Jan today. I feel comfortable with her explanation and am abiding by her request not to make this information public, as of yet. This will eventually make a great story, and who better to write it than the lady herself.

In regards to the MARKING it may have been my inability to post the second photo, which clearly shows "TUSKA OF SYDNEY " engraved on the back of the Boom Gallows I would perceive the letters to be about 100 mm high.

My request acting on behalf of Jan Murray has not changed can anyone traveling or cruising NSW OR Queensland please keep an eye out for this vessel. Cheers Tom
Having another try at this picture
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