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Old 13-12-2018, 18:47   #1
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Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

While headlined as a discussion about what to do about derelict boats, reading the details shows that this is a general attack on any boat used for anything other than basic daylight entertainment. One city official offered that it was against the law to even spend one night sleeping on ones boat in the city of Melbourne. This includes at anchor or in any marina. Here is a link to local information:

https://www.mynews13.com/fl/orlando/...bandoned-boats
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Old 13-12-2018, 19:36   #2
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

I thought it read Melbourne Formula 1 declares war on boaters.... two things I like, why cant they get along sob sob.

But anyway as you were in Florida
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Old 13-12-2018, 20:00   #3
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

When will people realize that the run off from the neighborhood streets and those huge houses against the water with the greenest grass you will ever see that has a healthy dose of fertilizer and pesticide are creating more of a problem with water quality than the several boats. The fertilizer that is ending up in the lagoon is crazy. What needs to happen is the stop of sale on fertilizer.
I can tell you walking in any up scale neighborhood seeing fertilizer on sidewalks and in the gutters. All in the name of green grass ugggh!!!!
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Old 13-12-2018, 20:49   #4
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

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Originally Posted by PLANET EXPRESS View Post
When will people realize that the run off from the neighborhood streets and those huge houses against the water with the greenest grass you will ever see that has a healthy dose of fertilizer and pesticide are creating more of a problem with water quality than the several boats. The fertilizer that is ending up in the lagoon is crazy. What needs to happen is the stop of sale on fertilizer.
I can tell you walking in any up scale neighborhood seeing fertilizer on sidewalks and in the gutters. All in the name of green grass ugggh!!!!
It is a bigger and more complicated problem than that. Even you suffer from the bias. The neighborhood fertilizers are nothing compared to the run off from commercial/industrial farming.

The point is that waste dumping in harbors is not good but it certainly isn't the >worst<.

Most of the problems that boaters are going to face in FL come from the bad eggs (derelict boaters). One bad apple spoils the bunch.

If cruisers want to fight for their rights, we need to get real and help craft legislation that is sensible.
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Old 13-12-2018, 21:21   #5
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

The funny part of this is Melbourne advertises itself as "The Harbor City" and historically was primarily based on the Harbor in the Eau Gallie river which is where the primary issue is being raised. The Harbor existed as a working harbor and anchorage long before the houses were built along the shore. The river was known for its clear water while it was used as harbor in the days before holding tanks and treatment systems. The houses along the shore are what destroyed this river and the adjacent Indian River lagoon, not a few boaters.

Why is there a problem now, because the city recently forced the Marina here to throw out all of the liveaboards based on a city zoning law, so they all moved out into the harbor on the hook. Now they're trying to force them out of the harbor. When they were in the Marina they used the shore restrooms for the most part. One old geezer was seen taking a leak off the side of his boat and threw someone into a tizzy. They managed to get him and all the other liveaboards thrown out thus creating their current problem. Oddly Enough there is an SSCA Gam held in Melbourne every year which rents the civic center and brings alot of business to the area. I know the president and I'm going to talk to her about pulling it out to a city that appreciates the business.
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Old 13-12-2018, 22:41   #6
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

It's clear the Melbourne again wants to severely limit the ability of folks to anchor it "their" waters, but they are still running up against the same state laws.

From the City memorandum:

This memorandum is intended to address the numerous complaints and comments of citizens owning land adjacent to the Eau Gallie Harbor regarding live-aboard, derelict, and abandoned vessels in the harbor. As further explained herein, the 2017 amendments to Chapter 327 of the Florida Statutes clarified what the legislature intends by the phrase “live-aboard vessel.”

City of Melbourne cannot place a time limit for anchoring any boat, except for live-board vessels and commercial vessels.

While the City previously had an ordinance that limited anchoring of ALL vessels to 72 hours, that ordinance had to be repealed because the Florida Legislature made it illegal for counties and municipalities to regulate the anchoring of ALL vessels in 2006.

However, the 2006 Legislature expressly provided that counties and municipalities could regulate the anchoring of live-aboard vessels and floating structures. Because the City’s old ordinance regulated the anchoring of ALL vessels, it was repealed.

Possible legislative fixes proposed in this City meeting:

(i) If the definition of “live-aboard vessels” in §327.02(22), Fla. Stat., is modified as set forth above to capture occupied vessels capable of navigating but anchored or moored without navigating for 10 consecutive days, then the City’s current prohibition of live-aboard vessels in Sec. 14-35 would effectively place a 9-day time limit for anchoring occupied vessels in the waters of the City. On the 10th day of anchoring, the vessel becomes a prohibited “live-aboard vessel” in violation of the Code and subject to enforcement as an ordinance violation.

(ii) Modify §327.4108 to add and include the Eau Gallie River Basin or any other particular waterbody in the City that could qualify as an anchoring limitation area. This may require evidence demonstrating that the subject area(s) is/are in densely populated urban areas which have narrow state waterways, residential docking facilities and significant recreational boating traffic.

(iii) Adopt a new state law that establishes a set-back, within which anchoring is limited, from private property along the shoreline of waters of the State. Currently, there is no such restriction on State waters, and boaters are allowed to anchor in State waters where it is convenient and inexpensive, with no restrictions whatsoever on the length of time to anchor.

FL laws on the matter (as of 2016): http://www.boatus.com/Assets/www.boa...info-sheet.pdf
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Old 13-12-2018, 22:48   #7
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

It sounds like the usual rich home owner against the less rich boater. And the boaters may not be putting sewage into the water. We know there are other ways to handle sewage.
Farmers may have some runoff, but there's no money in it. With new technology farmers can predict what each crop needs to make the yield they have and what parts of their fields need more or less fertilizer. Any extra fertilizer is wasted money. In the past 30 years there's been much work done to keep cattle waste out of streams and grass boundaries that absorb runoff fertilizer and manure. Although hobby farmers are often caught using too much fertilizer or poisons and herbicides at illegal rates. Commercial farming isn't perfect, but less of a problem than cities and goat farmers.
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Old 13-12-2018, 23:00   #8
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

The nice thing about boating/cruising and liveaboard, is that if you don’t like one spot.... you’re free to move to a more desirable location.

California was too overpriced with nothing interesting to see.... so we moved. Life’s too short to be fighting all the time with knuckleheads.
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Old 14-12-2018, 03:41   #9
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

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Originally Posted by Lepke View Post
It sounds like the usual rich home owner against the less rich boater. And the boaters may not be putting sewage into the water. We know there are other ways to handle sewage.
Farmers may have some runoff, but there's no money in it. With new technology farmers can predict what each crop needs to make the yield they have and what parts of their fields need more or less fertilizer. Any extra fertilizer is wasted money. In the past 30 years there's been much work done to keep cattle waste out of streams and grass boundaries that absorb runoff fertilizer and manure. Although hobby farmers are often caught using too much fertilizer or poisons and herbicides at illegal rates. Commercial farming isn't perfect, but less of a problem than cities and goat farmers.
Actually the worst run off is not from the "fertiliser", though it is a problem. The worst is the animal waste which seeps into the ground water and runs off the farm into the waterways.
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Old 14-12-2018, 04:06   #10
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

We do not have many farms around here and there is not much cattle most of the cattle fields have been sold and developed. What we do have are a lot of roads with runoff going to the river. Farms are in the middle of the state not on the coast.
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Old 14-12-2018, 04:08   #11
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

Money talks and boats walk

It’s not exactly a war though
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Old 14-12-2018, 04:23   #12
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

like kenomac said, nothing boaters can do but go away. rich landowners have more legal resources than the average boater and there is no compromise. they just want the unwashed masses out of their backyard.
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Old 14-12-2018, 04:24   #13
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

I can guess why. I broke down in Melbourne last winter.

I anchored by the Eau Gallie library for a few days getting parts and getting some errands done.

There were 2 sunken boats with masts protruding and one sunken boat with no mast. I'm sure the losers that left the boats there ruined it for the rest of us.

That's really what it all comes down to. It's homeless jerks using boats to squat in places who have no responsibility or respect for the waters they are ruining or the towns they are forcing to clean up their mess.

Melbourne may be declaring war on boaters, but the first shot was fired by boaters.

I'm pretty sure this isn't about a few gallons of sewage. This is about people destroying their waters with old sunken boats.

As much as I'm anti regulation, they should set up a system at the state or federal level where we all have to pay $100 extra on our documentation or registration. Then holdthese proceeds for use cleaning up losers' boats that are abandoned.

At the same time, they should pass a federal law explicitly stating no state, city, town or other body can pass any law restricting the use of United States waters for anchoring a boat.

Meanwhile, if a town doesn't want boaters, they can just remove shore access.

Melbourne has a beautiful dinghy dock/pier they put in for visiting boaters. It's a nice place. (Eau Gallie). I'm sure they didn't do that because they hate boaters. They just hate irresponsible boat bums who fired the first shot at a welcoming place.
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Old 14-12-2018, 05:09   #14
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

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Originally Posted by Chotu View Post
Melbourne may be declaring war on boaters, but the first shot was fired by boaters.

I'm pretty sure this isn't about a few gallons of sewage. This is about people destroying their waters with old sunken boats.

As much as I'm anti regulation, they should set up a system at the state or federal level where we all have to pay $100 extra on our documentation or registration. Then holdthese proceeds for use cleaning up losers' boats that are abandoned.
Actually about 50% of the registration fees for boats in Florida is specifically set aside and returned to the counties each year for just that purpose. The county is supposed to send a report to the FWC each year detailing how it spent the money because It is only allowed to be used for a few specific things one of which is derelict boat removal. I tried a couple of years ago to get a copies of those reports. I was basically told to get a lawyer and sue us if you want to see them. As far as I can tell Brevard county (Melbourne is in Brevard county) should get several hundred thousand dollars a year for this purpose, but as far as I can find out the money comes in and disappears into the general revenues never to be seen again. There is no need for additional fees, they just need to spend the money they have received for its legal purposes.

Look up fl statute 328.72 for details, section 1 for how much of the fee goes to the county and section 15 for its legal use.
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Old 14-12-2018, 05:30   #15
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Re: Melbourne Fl declares war on boaters

Lapsed registration for a certain length of time = forfeit ownership rights. This would get them before they sink. Might also get the bums too as most do not register boat.
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