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Old 20-04-2011, 18:53   #136
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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Originally Posted by John A View Post
Back to the original question. I think a sub-forum for singlehandling would be great, if you could find a way to keep the self-righteous from giving their negitive opinions on the subject on a sub-forum dedicted to the positive aspects of the subject'.
So singlehanders should have their own private part of the forum where differing opinions are not allowed? So anyone that disagrees with your opinion is automatically self righteous and judgmental?


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People who take sailing classes, buy a boat, and take an extended vacation on that boat does not qualify them to pass judgement on something they don't understand.
Fair enough. So tell me what qualifications do you accept for someone to, as you say "pass judgment"? I would be willing to bet that some of the "other" posters on this thread could put their sea miles and experience up against the singlehanders on this thread.
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Old 20-04-2011, 19:25   #137
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

Skipmac,
It was my understanding that the question was raised by one of our mods to create a sub-forum about singlehandling. I gave my opinion, your opinion appears to be different..
I really don't want to waste my energy or piss a mod off to rebut your opinion. This debate has as much hope of resolution as a gun thread.
There is a good chance that by giving my opinion about people passing judgement, I've passd judgement also. That's normally called a different opinion.
:et's discuss something else. OK?
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Old 20-04-2011, 19:34   #138
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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Skipmac,
It was my understanding that the question was raised by one of our mods to create a sub-forum about singlehandling. I gave my opinion, your opinion appears to be different..
I really don't want to waste my energy or piss a mod off to rebut your opinion. This debate has as much hope of resolution as a gun thread.
There is a good chance that by giving my opinion about people passing judgement, I've passd judgement also. That's normally called a different opinion.
:et's discuss something else. OK?
I agree! Where just gonna have to agree to disagree on this subject.
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Old 20-04-2011, 19:41   #139
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

When Tania Aebi left New York on her singlehanded around the world adventure, she became sleepy after the first day and decided to turn on a strobe light to warn everyone she was below sleeping. The freighter that changed course to "rescue" her did not appreciate her novel approach but then again...no one hit her.
Being a singlehander, I would appreciate a sub-forum (as long as Tania is not a member). I could use some insight from other singlehanders.
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Old 20-04-2011, 20:05   #140
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

to much fun reading please don't close
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Old 20-04-2011, 20:11   #141
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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When I was told by a previous poster that: "the odds of a collision at sea with another small boat were a million to one", I told my anchor disaster story as an example of something that also seems like a million to one against... Yet it happened! YOU DON"T REALLY KNOW THE ODDS! Repeatedly making fun of my comment, as if I thought it had any "direct bearing" on single handing at sea, falls into the same category as those who made light of the worst financial loss of my life, (taking many years to recover from)... That category is: petty, irrelevant to the conversation, and mean spirited.
You have to understand I have been to the keys as well up and down the coast of Florida Mark. I know what anchorages are like with power boaters. And i feel your pain about losing everything though I have never been there personally.But I wouldn't say all power boaters are a danger to others based on what I have seen out there and I have seen some pretty messed up stuff.
My boat is on the hook right now in a tourist trap from hell, in a no wake zone, bouncing up and down like a coaster ride at six flags as I'm writing this. But I won't lob all power boaters into one huge group as dangerous boaters. I know to many power boaters that are courteous and leave and enter this channel without making a wake.
As well I know sailors that are dangerous and I won't go to sea with them. Make your boat as safe as possible before you leave port. Wether that's across a ocean or down the coast. And I would never hove to on a coastal run there are usually anchorages around some place to drop anchor in.
But even then you are taking a chance. Life is full of chances. Do you let them deter you or do you grab life by the horns and live it?
Please don't lump me in with a lot of other sailors that are a threat and menace to others because your opinion differs from people that have done it over and over, again and again safely and responsibly.
We can all learn from each other here. I don't know anyone that knows everything. Especially when it comes to sailing. So why don't we let the people that have done it give us a few examples of how to do it the right way?
Boat man, John A, Ruby Jean??? Give us an example how to get some sleep while doing a crossing.
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Old 20-04-2011, 21:00   #142
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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Originally Posted by John A View Post
Skipmac,
It was my understanding that the question was raised by one of our mods to create a sub-forum about singlehandling. I gave my opinion, your opinion appears to be different..
I really don't want to waste my energy or piss a mod off to rebut your opinion. This debate has as much hope of resolution as a gun thread.
There is a good chance that by giving my opinion about people passing judgement, I've passd judgement also. That's normally called a different opinion.
:et's discuss something else. OK?
John I hope you don't consider my expressing an opinion as passing judgment. I see these as two very different things. I enjoy and learn from discussions and different opinions, when carried on politely and somewhat like a formal debate; opinions are expressed, evidence and data may be presented, discussed, refuted, etc. Does not mean that the different parties will ever agree regardless of what proofs or evidence one side or the other may offer but it can be a polite discussion without resorting to name calling or ill feelings.

Passing judgment on the other hand is based on dogma and emotion, allowing for no discussion or differing opinion.

I have singlehanded myself, boats up to 65' but only on legs short enough that I could stay awake and keep watch. I have honestly admitted that I am somewhat resentful that some singlehanders abrogate their obligation to stand watch and in fact would hold me responsible as master of a crewed vessel to avoid them.

In my years sailing I have had two close encounters at sea with other sailboats. One just 5 miles off the coast of Delaware where we were the only two vessels in sight. I was keeping watch, the other wasn't. If I had not altered course we would have collided (I was the stand on vessel by the way). The other about 100 miles SW of the Windward Passage. Middle of the night, no moon and certainly off the beaten track, so should fall into that one in a million category. A sailboat appeared out of the darkness on a reciprocal course. No lights, no one on watch and about a boat length away. Didn't see the boat until it was almost abeam so would have had only seconds to react. Would not have been a collision but only by a matter of feet.

I agree the odds of a collision are very small but in my own, personal experience it is not impossible. Further I don't think anyone can disagree that a close watch on both vessels is better than one vessel having to look out for both. Yes?

I have to go with Mark's opinion on this, if a single hander has the equipment, electronics or watch keeping procedures that allows them to always keep proper watch then go for it. I 100% support anyone's right to do anything they want, until it infringes in any way my rights to do the same.

May be extreme nitpicking but that infringement to me could include someone's personal choice that results in even a slight increase in my risks or responsibilities at sea.
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Old 20-04-2011, 23:03   #143
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

When I made the decision to go cruising I knew that I needed crew on passages that had the risk of other traffic, so I invited the brother of a friend to sail with me from SF to SD. He had sailed with me before and I thought he'd make a good watchkeeper. My instructions to him included the order that if any thing appeared out of the ordinary he was to wake me at once. All went well until eary one morning just before sunrise as I relieved him of his watch I noticed the silhouette of a US aircraft carrier off my port beam at less than 500 feet distance with escort vessels all over the place. My friend didn't understand why I yelled at him.
For my sail from SD to La Paz I enlisted a pick-up crew in SD All went well until one night as I relieved her of the watch I looked over her shoulder at a cruise ship lit-up like a whore house less than a quarter of a mile dead asternI approaching at 15 knots.
On the sail from La Paz I again used pick-up crew, and sure enough I awoke to find him sound asleep in the cockpit with a blanket over him as we sailed down a two mile wide channel between the mainland and an island in the dark on autopilot.
Reaching Mazetlan I decided that I could do no worse singlehandling, and I've detailed some of the tricks I used in a earlier post within this therad.
I singlehanded down the coast of Mexico, El Salvador, Costa Rico, and Panama and spent the next nine years sailing back and forth in the Caribbean.
I've been run down twice, The first was outside of St Maarten, when I checked around me and noticed a 130 foot motor yacht crossing my stearn 300 yard away as I went forward to put a reef in. The next thing I knew was that he was along side me crossing my bow. He did extensive damage to my boat and came back and took full responsiblity for the collision and said he would pay all expenses if I would never revel his name. I have and he did. He told me later that he was the only one on the bridge and was fiddling with his navigation equiptment. The owner was not onboard. The second one you can read about here in this forum. Search for Bahama Ramming.
As a singlehandler I've gone out of my way to insure that I remain alive and for someone (most who hve never sailed off shore or at night) to suggest that I'm stupid enough to put my own life in danger as well as other boats, really upsets me.
Especiality when I witness the increatable assnine things that crewed boats have done.
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Old 21-04-2011, 00:27   #144
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

I agree with the guy that disagreed about that thing the other guy agreed with.

The truth becomes crystal clear when you squint your eyes.
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Old 21-04-2011, 00:46   #145
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

I agree. We must do something, what say ye ?

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Old 21-04-2011, 02:07   #146
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

Lots of "experts" in this thread. I think it boils down to personal choice and what you feel safe doing. No point in trying to change another's mind, just accept your brother/sister and hug!
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Old 21-04-2011, 06:55   #147
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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Regarding the request that CF start a sub forum on singlehanding...

I think that to do so is akin to having a subforum on automobile street racing!

Single handing along the coast or island hopping short distances is fine. I was singlehanded in this respect for many years, on both of my first two boats. To do so "over night, for days", leaving no one at the helm for hours on end, is both illegal and irresponsible!

It is required that ALL vessels keep watch at all times. I don't want the entire responsibility of avoiding collision at sea on my shoulders, because the other vessel has no one on watch.

If CF will not take a stand on this irresponsible practice, PLEASE don't encourage it by setting up an entire sub forum on the dangerous & illegal practice...

If you would pass this on to the others that are considering this I would appreciate it, so would the other sailors that take their responsibility seriously. Singlehanding "with no one on watch", is illegal for good reason!

Thanks, M.
perhaps you should tell this to Bernard Moitessier
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Old 21-04-2011, 06:59   #148
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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... When does the If stop ...
The if stops when.
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Originally Posted by ty.gregory View Post
I agree with the guy that disagreed about that thing the other guy agreed with ...
Well, two out of three of you are wrong, in my opinion.
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Old 21-04-2011, 07:24   #149
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

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perhaps you should tell this to Bernard Moitessier
Ignoring for now whether one agrees or diagrees with singlehanding or not, to justify the legality or morality of any act because someone else did it is not valid.

Bonnie and Clyde succesfully robbed a lot of banks (for a while), were quite famous and popular (except amoung bankers) but I don't think that makes it OK to go rob banks.

Yes I know the example is somewhat silly but it does illustrate my point.
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Old 21-04-2011, 07:54   #150
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Re: Long Distance Solo Sailing

Injecting my singlehander's two-penny-worth ...

1. I would welcome a dedicated "singlehanders" thread ... so that singlehanders ( & would-be singlehanders ) could exchange tips & techniques ...

2. Most of ( if not all ) the nay-sayers appear NOT to be singlehanders ... I believe that the technical ability to operate & navigate ( say 20miles ) a boat to safety should be taught & tested by the RYA / ASA etc ... a skipper may start a voyage with one or two crew but in the blink of an eye he/she might be the only person ( extreme seasickness, injury or even death ) aboard able to carry on ...
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