Cruisers Forum
 


Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on Cruisers Forums. Advertise Here
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 02-05-2011, 06:52   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Western Australia
Boat: Boro
Posts: 89
Ketch - Sail Trim to Windward

Hi all, we have been sailing our ketch for 2 years now - and enough is enough! Time to ask for help. We have a lot of trouble balancing boat speed, sail configuration and steerage. This especially becomes a problem when we try to tack, we generally either stall; or go round too far before we get the steerage to counteract the Jib.

Any tips for getting the sail plan right on a ketch when beating to windward.
billwa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2011, 07:05   #2
Moderator Emeritus
 
FrankZ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Chesapeake Bay
Boat: Bristol 35 Bellesa
Posts: 13,564
Images: 1
Re: Ketch - sail trim to windward

I don't know if it helps in a ketch specific occurrence but when we tack we usually let the headsail back wind to push the bow.

Also if the headsail is pulling you off after the tack ease it a bit, get the main (and mizzen?) drawing again and then trim.
__________________
Sing to a sailor's courage, Sing while the elbows bend,
A ruby port your harbor, Raise three sheets to the wind.
......................-=Krynnish drinking song=-
FrankZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2011, 17:39   #3
Registered User
 
SkiprJohn's Avatar

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Nicholasville, Kentucky
Boat: 15 foot Canoe
Posts: 14,191
Re: Ketch: Sail Trim to Windward

I used to have the same problem when I first got my old ketch many years ago. It turned out that I kept sheeting in too tight and pinching too high before starting my tack. That's ok most times on a fin keel sloop but not on a full keel ketch. I learned to ease the jib out a bit and fall off a hair to get some speed up before tacking. Its worth a try. Yes, you can keep the jib backwinded just a bit to pull the bow around but that really kills your speed.
Happy experimenting!
kind regards,
__________________
John
SkiprJohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2011, 17:57   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Adirondacks
Boat: 1967 Alberg 35
Posts: 589
Images: 3
Re: Ketch: Sail Trim to Windward

No matter what your sail configuration, it's timing and momentum that carries a good tack. If I wind up in irons it's usually because I don't have enough speed, the wind is light or variable, and I screwed up the timing. Holding the jib/genny too long is like putting the brakes on. It should be released and pulled over the same time as the main starts to swing. Some folks actually roll up the genny a bit to get it past the shrouds quickly. Maybe you're paying too much attention to the mizzen. It'll follow the rest.
smurphny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2011, 18:10   #5
Registered User
 
Bloodhound's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Prince Edward Island, Canada
Boat: Westsail 32
Posts: 317
Re: Ketch: Sail Trim to Windward

Sailing a cutter, not a ketch, but principles are the same. With a full keel heavy boat I fall off the wind enough to get speed up, then swing through the tack but keep the yankee sheeted until we've gone through the eye, then unsheet the yankee and let the wind blow her through quickly between the stays'l stay and the forestay. It's all a matter of timing and speed. I'm only guessing here, but I imagine the mizzen should be pretty much self tacking so it's probably a matter of getting the headsails across, no? Also important to round up early rather than late so as not to be too far off the wind when the tack is completed.
Bloodhound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2011, 19:03   #6
Registered User
 
GalvestonBay's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Houston TX area
Boat: Alberg 37 "Joan III"
Posts: 48
It is all about sequence and feeling.
1. One needs speed so don't pinch and then tack
2. With "ready, helm to lee" (meaning the moment we never say much more than let's go...) let go a bit of the jib sheet so that the main force is out of the sail. Not completely loose because it will mess up.
3. Depending on the speed of turning you can decide to pull in the sheet when you are in the wind to backwind the jib a bit and give the bow a push as it were (my school was dutch sailing barges that needed significant backwinding to even be able to turn, with a keel yacht it is much easier but this is a neat trick also when you fear you are stalling)
4. When you see that you are through the "dead point" of the tack move the jib over if you do this well timed you won't even need the winch.
GalvestonBay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2011, 08:06   #7
Registered User
 
AnsleyS's Avatar

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Maine
Boat: Kadey Krogen 42
Posts: 263
Images: 2
Re: Ketch: Sail Trim to Windward

Bill,

I have been sailing a ketch for twenty years and I will tell you the the mizzen does not add much at all when beating. Take it down and sail her as a sloop. You will see boat speed as good as with it up and less weather helm. I can sail our Camper Nicolson 39 close hauled without the mizzen and the helm lashed.

Try it, you'll like it.
AnsleyS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2011, 08:24   #8
Registered User
 
Blue Stocking's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Georges, Bda
Boat: Rhodes Reliant 41ft
Posts: 4,131
Re: Ketch: Sail Trim to Windward

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnsleyS View Post
Bill,

I have been sailing a ketch for twenty years and I will tell you the the mizzen does not add much at all when beating. Take it down and sail her as a sloop. You will see boat speed as good as with it up and less weather helm. I can sail our Camper Nicolson 39 close hauled without the mizzen and the helm lashed.

Try it, you'll like it.
+1 Same thing with my yawl.
__________________
so many projects--so little time !!
Blue Stocking is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
ketch, sail

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Critique of Sail Trim sailorboy1 Seamanship & Boat Handling 8 02-08-2010 20:40
Sail Trim Question JusDreaming Multihull Sailboats 20 23-06-2010 20:33
Steering with Sail Trim DBboat Seamanship & Boat Handling 11 12-01-2010 15:44
Sail Trim Tutorials GordMay Seamanship & Boat Handling 0 02-05-2007 02:17
Sail Trim Help GordMay The Library 0 22-02-2005 03:22

Advertise Here


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:34.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.