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Old 16-08-2013, 15:01   #16
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Re: Keel too Long?

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Originally Posted by s/v 'Faith' View Post
Good ICW draft;

55' above the water, 5.5' below the water.....

60' above, 6' below ok....

Less is more.
The "above" will clear all the bridges?
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Old 16-08-2013, 15:25   #17
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Re: Keel too Long?

Boats are generally designed with specifically engineered physics built in, i.e. a keel of a certain draught based on rest of boat design, sail load, etc. Shortening a keel in my opinion is highly NOT recommended. Unless you plan on reconstructing remainder of vessel to reflect changes made in keel.

Or you could just buy a boat with a shallower keel.
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Old 18-08-2013, 08:06   #18
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Re: Keel too Long?

There have been a number of boats in the Great Lakes area that have had the keel shortened anywhere up to 24" and attached a lead bulb to compensate for the weight loss. Most of the skippers I have talked to have said that they did not notice a dramatic change in the handling of their boat. Just saying....
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Old 18-08-2013, 08:12   #19
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Re: Keel too Long?

I am sure it can be done, but I would consult a naval architect before embarking on any radical change of boat design such as keel shortening.
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Old 18-08-2013, 08:19   #20
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Re: Keel too Long?

The OP seems to lack the basic vocabulary necessary to articulate his question.

Many larger boats come in two versions: deep draft and shoal draft. The OP will save himself a lot of grief by searching for shoal draft vessels. They're out there despite the fact that most of us would avoid them like the plague.

As to the question about "reducing" the keel, the answer is a resounding "NO!" That stuff you'd be "reducing" from the keel is called "ballast." It's there for a reason. The ballast has to match the rig. Start messing with that, and you're not just messing with performance, you're messing with safety.
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Old 18-08-2013, 09:28   #21
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Re: Keel too Long?

Every boat is a combination of compromises. Much depends upon the area of operation you are expecting, and the level of performance you are content with when sailing close to the wind. Also boat length is a factor, as a 50' boat would suffer a greater performance loss with a five foot keel than a 30' boat that would be quite happy with that depth keel. When choosing your next boat, consider also the depth of the rudder, as many shoal keel boats have a rudder that is the same length as the keel, which can lead to rudder damage when you do run into the earth, and you will at some time. A keel that is a foot deeper than your rudder will reduce the chance of rudder damage. FWIW, I my boat is 7' draft, and I operate from Maine to the Exumas with only occasional problems in the shoaling areas of the ICW, and can usually clear them with timing of the tides.
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Old 18-08-2013, 15:10   #22
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Re: Keel too Long?

Thank you, Horizon Watcher , for your feedback. The boats I am looking at are C&C's in the 37-40' range. They were built with a deep draft, wing keel and centre board. In this area, the wing keel and centre board are few and far between. The company that would do any keel reduction if it comes to that, is a world renown company with engineers to calculate proper weight and measurements of both the keel, replacement bulb, and rudders size. I have talked to number of owners who have reduced their boats's keels, with good success. I am just keeping my options open.
Its great to know that you are sailing the East coast with a 7' draft and using your knowledge of the tides to avoid the earth!!
That was the information I was kinda looking for.
Thanks
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Old 18-08-2013, 15:21   #23
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Re: Keel too Long?

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Originally Posted by ChamJam View Post
There have been a number of boats in the Great Lakes area that have had the keel shortened anywhere up to 24" and attached a lead bulb to compensate for the weight loss. Most of the skippers I have talked to have said that they did not notice a dramatic change in the handling of their boat. Just saying....
Yeah, it's not as much a golden rule backed by science as some people think. Boat design is as much an art as a science. There are tender boats and stiff boats and in between....they are all compromises. If i wanted a particular deep draft boat real bad and could shorten the keel reasonably.... I wouldnt hesistate to go for a bulb etc. Heck, the square riggers used stones in the bilge!
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Old 18-08-2013, 15:37   #24
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Re: Keel too Long?

Bash, I apologize for the lack the basic vocabulary necessary to articulate my question. Those who have responded to my inquires, certainly knew what I was asking and responded in kind.

I will continue to search for my boat in either a deep keel or shoal draft. And speaking for myself and the thousands of "shoal draft" boat owners out here in central and the east coast, the "plague" is doing just fine, thank you!
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Old 18-08-2013, 18:43   #25
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Re: Keel too Long?

Ok I understand your query.. the answer is still the same...........Nooooo!.......................
However buy the boat that has the characteristics you want and you are good to go.
Just don't think you can outthink a naval architect because you can run a chainsaw.
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Old 19-08-2013, 04:20   #26
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Re: Keel too Long?

There is a mix in compliance with design and adjusting the depth of the keel. I recall hearing that the CSY 44 was for some time produced with a deep cement keel and then cut off by the desire of the buyer, not unlike tailoring a pair of pants. I assume a heavy long-keeled cruiser could stand a greater change in draft compared to a light weight fin keel design. Also, the righting arm of the keel can remain exactly the same if it were shortened with more weight added, but there would definitely be a difference in the pointing behavior of the boat and the character of performance. I'm with all those others above who claim that it would be unwise to make any alterations without consulting the experts.
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Old 19-08-2013, 05:14   #27
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pirate Re: Keel too Long?

Would it not be cheaper and quicker to find your C&C Shoal/Centreboard elsewhere and get it delivered/sail yourself than to hack a hole in a perfectly good boat unsuited for your needs..
Your logic totally flies over my head... whoops... there it goes..
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Old 19-08-2013, 06:08   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimea Cruiser View Post
Boats are generally designed with specifically engineered physics built in, i.e. a keel of a certain draught based on rest of boat design, sail load, etc. Shortening a keel in my opinion is highly NOT recommended. Unless you plan on reconstructing remainder of vessel to reflect changes made in keel.

Or you could just buy a boat with a shallower keel.
Ive known of a few boats where owner decided just to lop off some of the keel...in most cases it significantly effected sailing characteristics...and not for the better. A boat is, or should be, engineered as an integrated whole, change one component and you effect all.
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Old 19-08-2013, 09:14   #29
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Re: Keel too Long?

Shortening the draft of the keel can be done, easier to do on a boat where the keel is all outside lead ballast. And it is best to replace the amount of ballast cut off with an equal or slightly more amount of lead in the form of a bulb. I get asked this question fairly regularly in my practice, and you can read about one very successful keel modification on my website: Link: Magic Keel

As you'll see at the end of the article, the owner said the performance of the boat actually improved after the modification.

So, in a nutshell, keel shortening can be done if you know what you are doing and have a professional guiding the process.

Eric
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Old 19-08-2013, 09:20   #30
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Re: Keel too Long?

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Would it not be cheaper and quicker to find your C&C Shoal/Centreboard elsewhere and get it delivered/sail yourself than to hack a hole in a perfectly good boat unsuited for your needs..
Your logic totally flies over my head... whoops... there it goes..
So,... How is one to know whether or not the C&C/Cent... Hmmm. Centerboard. Up, down - right? Guess it would not have been previously cut off.

Oh, forget it.
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