Justice for SV/Quest Crew Announced

[Aussiesuede]

Originally Posted by boatman61

was there not a US couple with a boat full of bibles taken as well... or is this the same boat..?

It's the same boat. Strange that some don't like the manner they've been permanently removed from society. I always thought THAT was the idea, remove those deemed incapable of living amongst us from living amongst us. Had they given them the gas chamber, some would complain the death wasn't painful enough and they should have been slowly dismembered with a garden hoe.

[Andrew B.]

Might want to consider taking a refresher course in UK vs USA history of killing "unarmed civilians". Let's just forget the column regarding countries taken by force. We can claim only "1". You will run out of fingers, and toes counting up the UK's. If your going to bad mouth the USA be civil enough to base your hate on a few more historical facts. Contrast without comparison of "facts" is for the talking head bubblehead bleach blonde propaganda readers. Turn that **** off, and visit a frigging library.

Point of fact is those four people were killed for going sailing. Nothing more, nothing less.

We got three out of nineteen, and your unhappy about what exactly ?

Appearances may be deceiving though. I strongly suspect that at least a few of the others have became fish food. I feel bad for the fish.

If you want to let your resentments of some real, or imagined transgression the USA may have committed to justify those ******** killing those four people. Well I suppose that's your prerogative. Forgive me for wanting to consider a few more 'facts' in my evaluation of those four peoples deaths.
I know enough to know I don't know enough comprehensive facts, and probably never will, but never the less I will continue to believe Piracy is wrong, illegal, and a pretty chickenshit thing to do. IMHO YMMV


I like the times I have visited the UK, and most all the folks I have met. Haven't figured out the driving on the wrong side of the road, eating with the wrong hand, and the weird ass accent, but hey variety can be good.

Originally Posted by atoll

no you are quite right the usa only killed 10,000 unarmed civilians when they went to somalia on a humanitarian mission:.........

[Sam Plan B]

Point of fact is those four people were killed for going sailing. Nothing more, nothing less.

Not completely accurate. In addition, the four cruisers were murdered for (a) being white. Somali pirates are racial bigots. And they were killed for (b) not being Moslems. Somali pirates are religious bigots. Anyone who would empathize with Somali pirates would empathize with the Ku Klux Klan, both being cut from the same cloth.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Sam Plan B

Not completely accurate. In addition, the four cruisers were murdered for (a) being white. Somali pirates are racial bigots. And they were killed for (b) not being Moslems. Somali pirates are religious bigots. Anyone who would empathize with Somali pirates would empathize with the Ku Klux Klan, both being cut from the same cloth.

They got life in prison , death sentences have no place in a modern democracy. I think that satisfies most people. The justice system is about punishing people for breaking the law , not about exacting retribution. That's the point of " public prosecution " process , its the state punishing you for breaking its laws.

In relation. To Quest , there was some mitigating circumstances , there was an aggressive military intervention and Quest sailed knowingly into a very dangerous area.

I'm not sure how the claim " racial bigots " can be substantiated , Somali piracy has always purely been financially driven and very few captives , while poorly treated have ever been murdered.

One would question the tactics of the US military. Previous military confrontations , with yachts and armed intervention by French naval forces also resulted in crew casualties. EUNAVFOR subsequently modified its rules of engagement to not challenge the process if the pirates had already gained access to the yacht ( the low and slow problem ) its surprising that US forces didnt heed that experiences. Its clear that the active intervention was a major contributing factor.

Life imprisonment is a fitting end to the sad and tragic affair

Dave

[boatman61]

Whoa.... chill guys...
I have sympathy for the people who died... but I also feel that the Somali's got the right sentence... death would be to quick and merciful... an eye for an eye is the Christian way I know... but it aint no punishment... merely a martyrdom.
How stooped can you get.
This way they'll get the **** kicked out of them every day until they're moved to isolation for their own safety... its a wonderful life.... don't think James Stewart would agree....
Now as to the question of who's bullets actually killed them... that's another matter... you guys are not exactly famous for avoiding 'Collateral Damage'...
I think Somali's historically would be happier taking a Machette to the victims rather than firing off a load of rounds inside a boats cabin... so pardon a touch of scepticism from your 'allies'
1st Gulf War... UK casualties by Iraqis 3... UK dead by Americans 23... kinda makes us wonder who was the enemy...

[Sand crab]

1. Somalis will capture any boat. They are not bigots that way. They captured an Iranian boat. The US saved the crew of that one BTW.
2. Sailing around that region with a boatload of bibles wouldn't be my first choice.
3. And to an earlier poster. US prisoners do not get internet! They aren't allowed computers, cameras, phones or any electronic device. Where do you get your facts?

[Mr B]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

1. Somalis will capture any boat. They are not bigots that way. They captured an Iranian boat. The US saved the crew of that one BTW.
2. Sailing around that region with a boatload of bibles wouldn't be my first choice.
3. And to an earlier poster. US prisoners do not get internet! They aren't allowed computers, cameras, phones or any electronic device. Where do you get your facts?

Australian Prisoners do get all that stuff, We believe in Rehabilitating Prisoners,

What ever happened to Instant Death on the Yardarm for Piracy,

[Piglet]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

1. Somalis will capture any boat. They are not bigots that way. They captured an Iranian boat. The US saved the crew of that one BTW.
2. Sailing around that region with a boatload of bibles wouldn't be my first choice.
3. And to an earlier poster. US prisoners do not get internet! They aren't allowed computers, cameras, phones or any electronic device. Where do you get your facts?

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_in_prisons

[Capt Phil]

Having spent considerable time in back in the 70's, 80's and early 90's in Somalia along with the Sudan, Ethiopia, Egypt, Libya, Morrocco and assorted other garden spots in North Africa including Angola and Nigeria, I have never been in a country so cruel and despotic as Somalia. Any non-muslim white man who ventures near there either on boat, plane or land is an idiot. They have zero value of life, including their own. It is virtually lawless and void of any government other than tribal allegiance.
I don't have much feeling of remorse for those who venture there because they should know better... it isn't rocket science. Those Somalians under a life sentence consider that they have won the lottery being inside a US prison. They will live better, healthier and longer than any of their friends or family in Somalia.
American are the most introspective, uninformed of any people on earth... they just don't understand that the rest of the world is playing by different rules and won't until a series of 9/11's occur and they lose all freedoms they formerly enjoyed. Sorry, but those are the facts! I happen to be an American citizen by choice and do wonder what possessed me to immigrate! however, it is better than Somalia... Phil

[Sand crab]

Originally Posted by Piglet

Internet in prisons - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They can correspond by email only on a monitored computer on a limited basis. It's not like you have a lap top in your cell. It's just like the monitored phone calls.

[Piglet]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

They can correspond by email only on a monitored computer on a limited basis. It's not like you have a lap top in your cell. It's just like the monitored phone calls.

Oh, the horror.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Mr B

Australian Prisoners do get all that stuff, We believe in Rehabilitating Prisoners,

What ever happened to Instant Death on the Yardarm for Piracy,

It went the way of child labour , prison for adult sodomy , debtors prison , low ages of consent , racial discrimination/ segregation.

Not to mention searching for a yardarm on a modern ship !

[Andrew B.]

Well I have learned all I need to know.

As I a white American, and will be in a slow ass sailboat with at least one Bible on board. When I get my boat.

And no one at home with much money to pay the ransom if they snag me.

If the Somali Pirates don't hack me to death with machetes because they can't get enough cash for me, the frigging military will probably kill me.

Even my grandchildren should know,(but they don't because thus far they haven't drank the appeasement kool aid), that the military, most especially the American military are nothing but a bunch of inept killers looking for any reason at all to kill as many people(especially allies), cats, dogs, and butterfly's too. Back in my day we got extra cash, and special awards for fragging a friendly. Hey they should have known better, right.

I got my red pencil ready, just tell me where the areas are I should keep my little slow ass sailboat away from.

Why should anyone be bothered in the least, most especially us killer Americans, about conceding several thousand square miles of Sea to a few low life scum sucking POS pirates.

I don't know why I should be surprised by the bias against Americans expressed by some on this site, but I truly am.

I do thank you for the warnings. I knew my country wasn't liked, or respected by some. I just didn't know how much our allies hated us too.
My bad...

Hell I got pot holes to worry about, screw all that foreign aid.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Andrew B.

Well I have learned all I need to know.

As I a white American, and will be in a slow ass sailboat with at least one Bible on board. When I get my boat.

And no one at home with much money to pay the ransom if they snag me.

If the Somali Pirates don't hack me to death with machetes because they can't get enough cash for me, the frigging military will probably kill me.

Even my grandchildren should know,(but they don't because thus far they haven't drank the appeasement kool aid), that the military, most especially the American military are nothing but a bunch of inept killers looking for any reason at all to kill as many people(especially allies), cats, dogs, and butterfly's too. Back in my day we got extra cash, and special awards for fragging a friendly. Hey they should have known better, right.

I got my red pencil ready, just tell me where the areas are I should keep my little slow ass sailboat away from.

Why should anyone be bothered in the least, most especially us killer Americans, about conceding several thousand square miles of Sea to a few low life scum sucking POS pirates.

I don't know why I should be surprised by the bias against Americans expressed by some on this site, but I truly am.

I do thank you for the warnings. I knew my country wasn't liked, or respected by some. I just didn't know how much our allies hated us too.
My bad...

Hell I got pot holes to worry about, screw all that foreign aid.

Should I send back a few case's of Yeungling... sounds like you need them...
Us Brits aint perfect... we slaughtered over 2000 unarmed men, women and children in a walled garden in India 1n the 1940's...
Bad **** happens in war and when folk are under fire... don't take it so personally... unless you were one off the pilots that fracked an SAS LRDG patrol...
What's done is done... you live with it and move on and hopefully it don't happen again...
Every country has its glass house..

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Andrew B.

Well I have learned all I need to know.

As I a white American, and will be in a slow ass sailboat with at least one Bible on board. When I get my boat.

And no one at home with much money to pay the ransom if they snag me.

If the Somali Pirates don't hack me to death with machetes because they can't get enough cash for me, the frigging military will probably kill me.

Even my grandchildren should know,(but they don't because thus far they haven't drank the appeasement kool aid), that the military, most especially the American military are nothing but a bunch of inept killers looking for any reason at all to kill as many people(especially allies), cats, dogs, and butterfly's too. Back in my day we got extra cash, and special awards for fragging a friendly. Hey they should have known better, right.

I got my red pencil ready, just tell me where the areas are I should keep my little slow ass sailboat away from.

Why should anyone be bothered in the least, most especially us killer Americans, about conceding several thousand square miles of Sea to a few low life scum sucking POS pirates.

I don't know why I should be surprised by the bias against Americans expressed by some on this site, but I truly am.

I do thank you for the warnings. I knew my country wasn't liked, or respected by some. I just didn't know how much our allies hated us too.
My bad...

Hell I got pot holes to worry about, screw all that foreign aid.

While this is quite a funny post , it does illustrate some rather bizarre views.

(A) white Americans are a particular target , as opposed to those in Spain or London ( remember those )

(B) Somali pirates are all Hollywood style blood sucking pirates , would you actually have any stats on the numbers killed


(c) the US military are just the same as all military ( only bigger) they are both competent , and open to abuse


(D) I really don't think Ameicans realise the effect the so called " war on terror " is having on the stability of a fragile planet. The fact is , if you have a big big stick and you chooses to wield it a lot , these that get hit by it , even indirectly , don't like it.

No one likes a bully , even if its an effective bully. Sorry bout that. Large parts of the world , And even your " allies" don't agree with large parts of US foreign policy. Sorry bout that , but we have brains too.


As to " you " conceding sea area to pirates. WTF , do you think that Quest , which clearly ignored its own government warnings , didnt contribute to its own downfall. Woud you knowingly walk into certain downtown low life areas in the US and then regard yourself as totally blameless if you got mugged !!

What gets people , is that its not enough for you guys to jail the offenders , but that you want some sort of " Wild West" justice system to apply , merely because 4 white American got murdered. , ie Americans are somehow more valuable then a foreigner !!!

They are in jail, justice was done. End of story. Stop acting like a barbarian. Do not become your enemy

There is no anti US bias on CF. , just we inform ourselves , whereas Americans watch Fox News and just think every one out to get them and all problems can be solved at the end of a gun. Perhaps nations with several 1000s years of history and conflict might view that as naive !!


And yes fill those potholes . Lets leave the world alone for a bit , you know a bit of an experiment, lets leave the Israelis to sort out themselves , the South Americans , Cuba , etc etc , maybe the US might be pleasentky surprised

Filling potholes would at least give all those unemployed squaddies something to do !
Dave