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Old 11-12-2010, 14:23   #151
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Originally Posted by Tom and Maje View Post
That is a fact. We planned to sell our house to buy the boat. That is not going to happen. After over 18 months on the market the house did not sell. I've read that the housing market is not going to recover for another five years. That's too long for us. So we are cutting to the bone saving for the boat.

Maje
This would not apply from our side of the Pacific but I am sure this is the BIG reason many are staying at home from the other side and as I have already mentioned the exchange rate.
Life has taught me that people rarely admit the real reason for their decisions and always like to blame it on others eg. $320 entry fee.
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Old 11-12-2010, 15:21   #152
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Amazing that in tough economic times, people would give up a home which costs so little to try save a home that costs so much, making them so much more dependent on the fickle economy.
Defies logic.
I have owned my own home, debt free, since my early 20's. Wouldn't have been possible, had my home been on land.
When I first came to the BC coast, wages were around $2 an hour and a Haida 26 cost $9K. Now wages are $30 an hour and a Haida 26 can be bought for $3500. Then people in their 20's were dreaming of living on boats, now the homeless youth live under bridges and in dumpsters.
Where's the logic?
With the abilty of people to hang on to land dwellings becoming ever more fragile, you would think they would be keeping their boats as insurance against homelessness, not closing their safest possible escape route.
Where's the logic?
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Old 12-12-2010, 04:47   #153
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It's something that always seems to be true. To those that left crusing yesterday I doubt they feel or care if cruising is on the decrease or not. There never was that many boats cruising and there probably won't be. Being up or down is all relative to where you are and of course if you are out there sailing. Dave gets a few things right enough.


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We're all proud Australians and Tom did say as much, but that doesn't mean we can't be critical of local beaurocratic idiocy.

Well you can do so some place else. With an international flavor to the membership it appears as most people are dissatisfied with their local politics. I can't say I'm excited about the USA right now either. But we all need to remember:

Cruising Boats, Cruising People, Cruising Answers

It's at the top of every page on this website. No cruising politics on the masthead. It's not an accident. I'll live with mine and you can do the same. We would all rather be boating or at least talking about it. It's OK that we can't solve politics everyplace let alone any place. so we don't try. It's OK to be involved if you do it some place else.
I'm a little surprised you chose to quote me out of context to illustrate your point, which restates the broad principles and is fair enough, but probably inappropriate in the context of this thread.

1) The OP was citing the decline in cruising in Australia. Hard to have an international flavour when the question is referring to the situation in one country.
2) A possible reason for the decline is heavy handed government beaurocracy. As it is affecting cruising here, it is totally within the context of the OP's question, and "Cruising Boats, Cruising People, Cruising Answers". I don't see it as inappropriate to make that statement. Nobody was pushing a particular political party barrow.
3) An inference by a poster that being critical of that heavy handed beaurocracy was bagging Australia and being disloyal, prompted the response you quoted, that 'we', the Aussies involved, are all proud Australians in spite of the fact we would like to see cruisers made to feel more welcome here.

Suggesting I, or we, make the comments someplace else defeats the purpose of answering the OP's question.

I feel you may have misread the context of this thread, in this instance.

Just sayin...
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Old 12-12-2010, 06:42   #154
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I also being an Australian if this was only about Aus. don't agree that the $300+ is exorbitant for the reasons I stated.
Secondly one posters personal view from visual observation that cruising in Australia is on the decline and this all based on our having a charge on entry is also without any real statistics to back it up.
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Old 12-12-2010, 07:00   #155
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And.. to be honest.. those making a fuss are probably never go that way in their lives...
Whereas we all know if a boatman's got an urge to go somewhere fee's wont put him off... its hows the world works
Fee's for everything... beads just don't cut it anymore
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Old 12-12-2010, 07:26   #156
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When it comes down to it; if cruising is on the decline it would seem to be a plus to those out there still!
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Old 12-12-2010, 07:42   #157
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Can't say I have any ambition to sail to Australia, $300 charge or not - spent a few months there years back, nice enough but nothing special or not available elsewhere. Maybe because for me not foreign enough?

Having said that, if I was sailing in that part of the world I probably would visit - but mainly because it's there. and so was I already. The odd chippy colonial would not put me off.

But that would be a few years hence, and by then the economic wheels will have likely fallen off there wagon - given that the Australian economic model (Borrow & Bubble) is not fundamentaly different from elsewhere in the west my take is that only a matter of time. Unless economic gravity goes anti-clockwise down under Sometimes important to understand the difference between smart and dumb luck...........
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:30   #158
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Originally Posted by catty View Post
As with previous sailing crazes like the surf cats, the trailer sailors and the windsurfers before, is the cruising fad over?
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Yes it is my impression because it is now far too expensive to own a boat. In fact cruising folks self destructed by making what was affordable or even free in the past unaffordable. Also the local economy is fragile people fear another GFC this is reflected by low pre-Christmas sales. To think that few hundreds foreign cruiser on such a low budget
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(It is interesting to note that in Oz the minimum wage is $569 per week, and that for budget cruisers it represents around a months expense)
. Would make an economic impact is na´ve. Normal tourism is far more lucrative.

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Even if they are rich, I think that those cruisers can make their decisions and take their money and spend it where they are made to feel welcomed, not where they are made to feel that they are a cash cow.
I know no place in this world where a penniless tourist will be welcomed. Tolerated may be but to a point. The more money the greater the welcome this is just business.
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:48   #159
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Some of us dream of having an adventure during our lives. Full speed ahead, don't look back, just for the fun of it.

Was it cost-effective? Nope.

But the whole experience was an absolute hoot!

I feel privledged to have had the oppertunity.

To you dreamers out there, I say go-for-it!
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:49   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chala View Post
Yes it is my impression because it is now far too expensive to own a boat. In fact cruising folks self destructed by making what was affordable or even free in the past unaffordable. Also the local economy is fragile people fear another GFC this is reflected by low pre-Christmas sales. To think that few hundreds foreign cruiser on such a low budget.

True.. every penny counts.. how one use's them matters.. as does the choice.. give up the land or give up the sea.. most choose to give up the sea.

. Would make an economic impact is na´ve. Normal tourism is far more lucrative.

True.. but these are not normal times.. every penny matters..

I know no place in this world where a penniless tourist will be welcomed. Tolerated may be but to a point. The more money the greater the welcome this is just business.
Fortunately I seem to have been going to the right place's, with or without money the kindness's I've recieved have been many... far beyond that I could return.
Also as for toleration.. That goes for Rich or Poor.. its just more $'s buy more tolleration... truth be told $'s alone do not an As#*&le make

Its nice to be liked for what you have'nt got... or should that be 'in spite of...'
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Old 12-12-2010, 13:42   #161
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. Would make an economic impact is na´ve. Normal tourism is far more lucrative.


I know no place in this world where a penniless tourist will be welcomed. Tolerated may be but to a point. The more money the greater the welcome this is just business.
G'Day Chala,

Try telling the above to all the folks who make a living out of the hordes of backpackers who flock to Australia.

I'll readily agree that "normal" tourists spend money at a higher rate than cruising yotties, but the yotties stay way longer, and in fact often spend quite a lot of money while in Australia. This is kinda the end of the Yellow Brick Road, and a natural place to refurbish ones yacht before carrying on into the void of SE Asia or Africa... money seems to flow into the hands of the chandleries and shipwrights !

For those who think that the AQIS fees and termite issues shouldn't impact a yotties decision about where to go... I was reporting on conversations with cruisers in New Caledonia and in Vanuatu who had chosen to go to New Zealand rather than Oz for that very reason. I make no value judgement on the correctness of that decision, but they were in fact going south rather than west, and I think that Australia is the looser in this case.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Towlers Bay, NSW, Oz
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Old 12-12-2010, 14:28   #162
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Can't say I have any ambition to sail to Australia, $300 charge or not - spent a few months there years back, nice enough but nothing special or not available elsewhere. Maybe because for me not foreign enough?

Having said that, if I was sailing in that part of the world I probably would visit - but mainly because it's there. and so was I already. The odd chippy colonial would not put me off.

But that would be a few years hence, and by then the economic wheels will have likely fallen off there wagon - given that the Australian economic model (Borrow & Bubble) is not fundamentaly different from elsewhere in the west my take is that only a matter of time. Unless economic gravity goes anti-clockwise down under Sometimes important to understand the difference between smart and dumb luck...........
given that the Australian economic model (Borrow & Bubble) is not fundamentaly different from elsewhere in the west
I suggest you did not spend enough time studying our economy while you were here but it made fun reading for a typical English morning, drizzle and cloud. But at least here it is only temporary and its still hot enough to go to the beach down the road and have a surf.
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Old 12-12-2010, 14:33   #163
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G'Day Chala,

Try telling the above to all the folks who make a living out of the hordes of backpackers who flock to Australia.

I'll readily agree that "normal" tourists spend money at a higher rate than cruising yotties, but the yotties stay way longer, and in fact often spend quite a lot of money while in Australia. This is kinda the end of the Yellow Brick Road, and a natural place to refurbish ones yacht before carrying on into the void of SE Asia or Africa... money seems to flow into the hands of the chandleries and shipwrights !

For those who think that the AQIS fees and termite issues shouldn't impact a yotties decision about where to go... I was reporting on conversations with cruisers in New Caledonia and in Vanuatu who had chosen to go to New Zealand rather than Oz for that very reason. I make no value judgement on the correctness of that decision, but they were in fact going south rather than west, and I think that Australia is the looser in this case.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Towlers Bay, NSW, Oz
Jim,
If you're going to muddy the water with actual experience and facts, well, that's hardly playing fair...
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Old 12-12-2010, 14:49   #164
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Can't say I have any ambition to sail to Australia, $300 charge or not - spent a few months there years back, nice enough but nothing special or not available elsewhere. Maybe because for me not foreign enough? Hey, white fella, you come catchee goanna wid me. Not foreign if you stay with all the other pommy backpackers.

Having said that, if I was sailing in that part of the world I probably would visit - but mainly because it's there. and so was I already. The odd chippy colonial would not put me off.

But that would be a few years hence, and by then the economic wheels will have likely fallen off there wagon We still spell it 'their' over 'heir' just loik wot you tort us - given that the Australian economic model (Borrow & Bubble) is not fundamentaly different from elsewhere in the west my take is that only a matter of time. Unless economic gravity goes anti-clockwise down under Sometimes important to understand the difference between smart and dumb luck...........
Aaaah... the catch cry of those lacking dumb luck! It's only important if you don't have it, like oxygen
Not our fault if you threw us in prison, and then lucked out because we found it was built on Monte Christo...
Now, if we could just remember how to play cricket.....
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Old 12-12-2010, 14:52   #165
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G'Day Chala,

Try telling the above to all the folks who make a living out of the hordes of backpackers who flock to Australia.

I'll readily agree that "normal" tourists spend money at a higher rate than cruising yotties, but the yotties stay way longer, and in fact often spend quite a lot of money while in Australia. This is kinda the end of the Yellow Brick Road, and a natural place to refurbish ones yacht before carrying on into the void of SE Asia or Africa... money seems to flow into the hands of the chandlers and shipwrights !

For those who think that the AQIS fees and termite issues shouldn't impact a yotties decision about where to go... I was reporting on conversations with cruisers in New Caledonia and in Vanuatu who had chosen to go to New Zealand rather than Oz for that very reason. I make no value judgment on the correctness of that decision, but they were in fact going south rather than west, and I think that Australia is the looser in this case.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Towlers Bay, NSW, Oz
You keep avoiding the exchange rate which for most travelers (back packers) is a major consideration. Now considering the fact that for a great deal of your Aus visits over the twenty years your US dollar would have bought a great deal more AUS $ the change to getting no bonus is making more of a difference to your future plans than you want to admit. As of this morning this is the exchange rate 1US$ = 1.33774 NZ$ and 1Aus$ = 1.31755NZ$. So if I was sailing around the Pacific and needed work carried out and knowing that both countries had the same standard of boat repairs/building etc which they do where do you think I might go.
Additionally many of the people (US) that I spoke to crossing in 2008 were also heading for NZ first so nothing new there.
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