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Old 10-06-2015, 18:29   #1
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Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

Cruisers with experience in Borneo to share?

I am collecting information on losses or "occurrances" experienced by yachts in Kudat, Malaysia, and how any subsequent insurance claim was handled. Pantaenius USA red-lines Kudat port in it's navigation exclusions, which I believe is a real disservice to its customers. I am aware of small-scale thefts from unsecured boats, but nothing that would support excluding access to the only available haul-out facility within several hundreds of miles. With a stop in Kudat you can easily day-hop through the maze of floating logs and reefs along Sabah and up into Palawan, but Pantaenius's exclusion compels it's insureds to cross these waters with at least one nighttime passage. If you hit a log 13 miles out from the Kudat port limit, you have a covered occurrence ... but the exclusion keeps you from navigating to Kudat to haul out and get it fixed.

I don't believe there is any valid business reason for this (and many other) navigation exclusions. Once they are written, I doubt any desk-bound underwriter on the other side of the world revisits an exclusion's rationale unless an unhappy customer raises the issue. Which I would like to do, once more fully informed.

Thank you for all helpful feedback,
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Old 10-06-2015, 19:23   #2
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

Like you, I am not aware of any mishaps to cruising boats around Kudat other than theft on unattended boats in the anchorage in front of town. I can't imagine why Pantaneus excludes Kudat, but if that is the case I would not let it keep you from hauling out there. You will not be covered, but I would guess the majority of the boats in the yard there are uninsured, as we were. On the other hand, they don't waste a lot of money on travelift maintenance.

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Old 10-06-2015, 19:33   #3
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

Thank you, Mike. When were you there, and for long on the hard? I was in Marina Jetty for a week in May 2014, have first-hand reports from two other boats in the marina earlier in 2014, and three friends who have hauled their yachts at Penuwasa subsequently -- all without any bad experiences, problems, or even rumors of problems anywhere near Kudat. Over around Sipadan is another story, of course ...
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Old 11-06-2015, 09:11   #4
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

We were at Penuwasan in February 2013 for 2 weeks. We felt very safe in the area, even though that was during the dust-up with the "Sultan of Sulu". As you know, navigation in the area is straightforward and crime is low. I can't imagine what Pantaneus has against Kudat.
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Old 11-06-2015, 18:33   #5
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

Check my post on Noonsite. Penuwasa is one of the better yards I have been in. Drawback to Kudat is supplies. I left my boat open frequently with no problems.
I would have reservations about recomending the marina jetty unless they get new management.
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Old 12-06-2015, 09:16   #6
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

We were there in 2009 after losing a prop en route to Sandakan from Kota Kinabalu. Were there for about five weeks in total, in the anchorage stern tied and hauled out.

My wife hated the pack of dogs in the yard, the facilities... I could go on and on. She still talks about it.

Wonder if is has something to do with the yard using blocks from the sea wall to support vessels on the hard. They didn't use proper supports when we were there.
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Old 12-06-2015, 14:37   #7
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

I see a few basic issues here. Firstly, insurance companies do not take risks, - they are companies intent on making a profit. Try insuring against cattle theft, for instance, in South Africa.! Next, if you wish to pursue a risky lifestyle, why would you want to transfer some, or all, of the risk onto another party?! Man-up to your lifestyle and take responsibility for yourself.
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Old 12-06-2015, 15:57   #8
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

Quote:
Originally Posted by foojin View Post
We were there in 2009 after losing a prop en route to Sandakan from Kota Kinabalu. Were there for about five weeks in total, in the anchorage stern tied and hauled out.

My wife hated the pack of dogs in the yard, the facilities... I could go on and on. She still talks about it.

Wonder if is has something to do with the yard using blocks from the sea wall to support vessels on the hard. They didn't use proper supports when we were there.
They were still using the blocks in 2013. I didn't mind the dogs, but they were useless at keeping the rats under cover. Too well fed I suppose.

When we were there they had cemented the part of the yard closest to the travelift and added a nice shower block. Made a big difference in the rain. While our stay there was not a highlight, it was pretty painless. Loved the weekly night market.
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Old 12-06-2015, 17:39   #9
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

I had different coverage with Pantaenius USA, UK or AU branches.

USA did not cover Cuba, UK and Au did.
P-UK and Au were expensive for USA cover, while P-USA was a lot cheaper.

Same company ...... they say they are administered differently.
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Old 12-06-2015, 19:01   #10
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

Thank you for the helpful responses (and Joe, "hi" to you and Jo).

Serious problems in E/SE Sabah appear to be increasing. Yet another kidnapping of two people just 3 weeks ago in Sandakan -- news reports say the hostages are being held for a "very large ransom." But the only incidents I have been able to uncover that have targeted victims on yachts or boats have occurred at locations Pantaenius is happy to cover, most notably the kidnapping of two Germans on transit to Sabah from Palawan in April 2014 (released in Nov 2014 after threats of beheadings and payment of a ransom reported at 250 million pesos = US$5.5 million).

I don't have good data on the exact location of the Palawan kidnapping, but it is probably the closest to Kudat of any of these incidents and still at least 100NM from the port. Sandakan is approximately 122NM from Kudat by the most direct coastal route. In case anyone is counting, here are the recent incidents I know of (all involving some element of gunfire or violence) that have occurred in Sandakan and the next 200NM south to Sipadan:

2000 - 21 hostages taken from Sipadan dive resort
Feb-Mar 2013 - 3-week armed conflict with "Royal Army of Sulu" leaves at least 27 dead
Nov 2013 - Taiwanese business woman abducted, husband killed in Semporna
Apr 2014 - Chinese tourist and Filipina worker kidnapped from Singamata beach resort
July 2014 - 8 gunmen fire into Mabul resort restaurant, killing one police guard and kidnapping a second
May 2015 - 4 armed men raid Sandakan restaurant, abduct owner/manager and 1 patron
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Old 17-06-2015, 03:07   #11
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

I have asked Pantaenius USA ("Our Commitment -- Always At Your Side") to reconsider its position. It is crazy that they will honor coverage up to 12NM of Kudat, but if at that point you hit a log or fall and break an arm they won't let you proceed to the fully-protected boat basin to address the damage or injury that is covered by their policy.

Will let folks know how this pans out.
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Old 18-06-2015, 21:43   #12
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Re: Insurance re Kudat, Malaysia - Pantaenius USA

A former marine insurance underwriter has advised me not to continue this public dialog, to avoid retaliation when it comes time to renew my policy. Wow. I guess any questions or comments specific to the company in the OP title should be by PM.
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