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Old 12-03-2009, 06:47   #46
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Seems the big concern here is not soo much cost of insurance, but the ability of Insurance company to pay. They way I see it is that a company as large as AIG will be around for quite awhile, they are simply too large to fail. If they go bankrupt and all assets are sold, then I guess all us policy holders can go pound dirt, but if they go bankrupt and someone else swallows them up then the new owners will have to honor all policy contracts. Now though I subscribe to the too large to let fail theroy, there was a large bank in New York that failed (lehman and something I think). Not quite sure what happened there, did they get bought up by some other company (if so, they took on Lehmann's debit's), what happened to all those mortgages people were paying on, they sure did not get a free ride, I am sure they are paying someone. In the end it all comes down to ones individual comfort level towards insuring yourself against possible future disasters, and although I am sure you are a very diligent and competent sailor, insurance is not alwys about guarding the risks of the owner, but just as much as insuring against the other guy and his wild manouvers.
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Old 12-03-2009, 08:44   #47
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Ram, I don't know what happened with your truck accident but even when insurers are doing business normally--sometimes people get screwed. I had a major theft loss some time ago, and my top-rated carrier's agent made a somewhat extortionate offer to pay me 1/4 of what I thought the car was worth "or else you'll get nothing". Well, it took three months and some calls ot my state insurance commission but they eventually paid 4x the initial offer and the agent's manager sent her out for retraining.
They're my insurer--not my friend or good buddy. The point is, there are regulators, there are protections against failures. Few systems work well all the time.

"you are still betting that something negitive is going to happen to you-" Not really. Just acknowledging the phrase that most sailors have heard at least once at sea: "**** happens". Who was it, Aristotle? That was killed when a passing eagle dropped a tortoise on his shiny skull, mistaking it for a rock? (Birds do that, yes.) Betcha he sure wasn't expecting to go out THAT way. (G)
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Old 12-03-2009, 11:13   #48
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One of many dirty little omissions I learned of, from Al Golden at IMIS. www.imis.pro

They'll be the first ones to tell you, they're not always the cheapest, but they try to be competitive, and they are true professionals in the best meaning of the word. I don't know if they can write Canadian policies.

Hello Sailor,

I said that I would get back to you with the quote from IMIS. Well, I received it this morning. For equal coverage with the exception of $500,000 liability (instead of $1,000,000) and underinsured boaters coverage of $100,000 (instead of $1,000,000), the quote was $2067.00 (CAD). You said that they were not the cheapest but from the questions that they asked, I would have to agree that they know their stuff. That is a long way from the $417.00 that I just paid for better coverage. Hmmm....now I am in a quandary. Is this a situation of "if it seems too good to be true, it probably is" or are Canadian sailors just better and don't have as many claims. Just kidding, folks, on the last part. Don't cut my lines! Boy, I was just getting used to sleeping at night...lol.
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Old 12-03-2009, 11:22   #49
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thats about $1600 USD
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Old 12-03-2009, 11:49   #50
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Exocet,

I'm not sure that AIG's size has anything to do with going bankrupt or not (the bigger they are, the harder they fall?). I do know that the Government has been giving them massive bailout funds and kind of figure the 'in for a penny, in for a pound' theory may be alive and well in this case. I think that it is in the governments interest to keep them afloat and don't think they will let them go down. I understand that AIG is also in the process of restructuring and think a bankruptcy risk is minimal, at best.
As far as the banking system, who knows. Citibank just announced a couple of days ago in a public release that it had made profits of $19 billion for January and February of this year (after receiving $45 billion in bailout funds from the government). Any positive announcements at this point (there have been numerous ones over the past few days in both Canada and USA) are welcome. The Toronto market jumped 3% in one day and even Agora Financial Investments had a couple of positive things to say (they have been the scariest, dire prediction group since Sept 2008. "The sky is falling, buy gold, buy gold"....)
BTW, Exocet, if you want to talk to me, I am in the office......lol.
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Old 12-03-2009, 11:53   #51
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Wow, a fourfold difference in price! I would ask them outright, did someone make a mistake or are there differences you're not seeing? They're grown-ups, they give it their best shot and they know that sometimes, someone else will be able to undersell them.

I've seen major differences (2x, 3x) from auto carriers as well, and yet they all still seem to stay in business over the years. Sometimes a carrier has an affinity group or a special rate or some other hook that gets you a major break, i.e., GMAC has a real sweetheart deal on auto insurance--for GM cars--with AICPA members. No member? No GM car? No sweetheart deal. And that association only gets that one deal from one insurer.

You never know till you ask. They'll still thank you for asking them.
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:04   #52
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If it sounds to good to be true it usually is- be careful-
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:07   #53
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thats about $1600 USD
Ram,

Good math, Ram, it was exactly $1600 US. The coverage area is only for west coast Canada and Washington State and no more than fifty miles offshore, so I can understand now the rates you must be paying. I may be living in a fool's paradise thinking that my policy (at $417.00) will cover me, but we are very careful sailors at all times and like I said before, have never had any previous claims on our first boat when we were definitely rookies. God loves fools and small children!!
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:22   #54
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Wow, a fourfold difference in price! I would ask them outright, did someone make a mistake or are there differences you're not seeing? They're grown-ups, they give it their best shot and they know that sometimes, someone else will be able to undersell them.

I've seen major differences (2x, 3x) from auto carriers as well, and yet they all still seem to stay in business over the years. Sometimes a carrier has an affinity group or a special rate or some other hook that gets you a major break, i.e., GMAC has a real sweetheart deal on auto insurance--for GM cars--with AICPA members. No member? No GM car? No sweetheart deal. And that association only gets that one deal from one insurer.

You never know till you ask. They'll still thank you for asking them.
I asked my broker numerous times if there had been an error and was I being covered for all of the things that I asked for. They checked and said that everything was correct and that the rate that I was quoted was consistant with what other people were paying. Go figure!! Either there are a lot of people out there who are now underinsured or else we are all getting a great deal. Don't know. Will let you know if I ever submit a claim. I'll call you from the bank where I'll be adding to my mortgage if everything goes sour....lol.
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Old 12-03-2009, 15:47   #55
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Hello Sailor,

I said that I would get back to you with the quote from IMIS. Well, I received it this morning. For equal coverage...
When you say equal coverage. Is the limits of navigation the same on the two policies? The IMIS policies I've seen on the West cover AK to the Mex. Most other policies cover a more localized region.

Paul L
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Old 12-03-2009, 20:27   #56
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When you say equal coverage. Is the limits of navigation the same on the two policies? The IMIS policies I've seen on the West cover AK to the Mex. Most other policies cover a more localized region.

Paul L
Paul L

Everything is basically the same except the cheaper insurance gives me $1,000,000 liability and $1,000,000 underinsured boats whereas the more expensive insurance gives me $500,000 liability and $100,000 underinsured boats. Naviagation limits are basically the same being the west coast of Canada.
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