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Old 24-01-2016, 22:40   #46
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by adlib2 View Post
These guys have a death wish and don't care if they take others with them.
No charge for sea rescue in the UK, perhaps there should be like in the US.

I'm prefer to believe they have a life wish.
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Old 24-01-2016, 23:08   #47
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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In Australia it was Royal Australian Navy that was complaining about the cost and time for air sea rescue services usually to underfunded and under-equipped cruising foreigners.
That's not how I remember all the rhetoric at all. The Navy did not complain when they rescued Tony Bullimore in the deep Southern Ocean. They bragged about it instead (as well they should have, for it was a great effort). The folks who always complain about "free rescues" are civilians who have no knowledge about SAR, funding and training.

And FWIW, the Aussie navy is not often involved in SAR, and several of their major efforts in recent years were not for underfunded foreigners, but for very well funded international racers... lots of good publicity for the navy!

Jim
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Old 24-01-2016, 23:19   #48
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

More power to these guys! I always said, "if i ever get a terminal disease, I'm taking up every extreme sport i can". It beats the SH$T out of a nursing home.
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Old 25-01-2016, 06:21   #49
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pirate Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by adlib2 View Post
Seven answered calls for assistance from the same boat is too much to expect from any volunteer crew.
We had a Brit requesting assistance from the Grands Banks, he was towed and his vessel inspected and his experience reviewed by Canadian authorities and found wanting. He was stopped attempting to return to sea and a lock placed on his vessel.
We don't charge in Canada either, usually rescues are effected by the RCN at sea and Coast Guard on the Great Lakes; although, there is a small representation from SeaTow.
In Australia it was Royal Australian Navy that was complaining about the cost and time for air sea rescue services usually to underfunded and under-equipped cruising foreigners.
I would never malign the RNLI and what it stands for, but you must agree it was formed long before pleasure boating became popular and spawned a raft of incompetent sailors. I'm saying these un-worthies should pay for their assistance, at least after the first rescue.
I'm not turned on by the Jolly Boyo's syndrome one bit. They are a bloody menace and should be treated as such.
Listen to their tale and Read between the lines...
They have Not called for assistance 7 times from what I understand.. they have been in contact 7 times with various folk.. not exclusively the Rescue Services.. and... they were towed in by a fishing boat due to one assumes an engine or steering problem..
Although I am perceived Anti-American because I get highly amused winding you guys up these two deserve as much effort as any Brit, Paddy or Jock..
Once you cast off your just another seaman..
All to easy to be a Sanctimonious Twat (generalisation)... till your arse's are in the fire... and a Forum membership decides it knows best..
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Old 25-01-2016, 14:12   #50
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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All to easy to be a Sanctimonious Twat (generalisation)... till your arse's are in the fire... and a Forum membership decides it knows best..[/SIZE][/FONT]


this subject is on more than one forum, people don't like it if you don't go along with the trash talk though
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Old 25-01-2016, 14:15   #51
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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I haven't listened to the interview.

If they're so blase about dying, why have they called for help 6 times?
Ann
Wondered that too. I doubt if the people who have to keep rescuing them feel that same way.
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Old 25-01-2016, 14:27   #52
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by adlib2 View Post
Seven answered calls for assistance from the same boat is too much to expect from any volunteer crew. Didn't happen, listen to the interview.

We had a Brit requesting assistance from the Grands Banks, he was towed and his vessel inspected and his experience reviewed by Canadian authorities and found wanting. He was stopped attempting to return to sea and a lock placed on his vessel.
We don't charge in Canada either, usually rescues are effected by the RCN at sea and Coast Guard on the Great Lakes; although, there is a small representation from SeaTow.

In Australia it was Royal Australian Navy that was complaining about the cost and time for air sea rescue services usually to underfunded and under-equipped cruising foreigners.

I would never malign the RNLI and what it stands for, but you must agree it was formed long before pleasure boating became popular and spawned a raft of incompetent sailors. I'm saying these un-worthies should pay for their assistance, at least after the first rescue.
I'm not turned on by the Jolly Boyo's syndrome one bit. They are a bloody menace and should be treated as such.
The RAN would never had made such a 'complaint'.. It would be considered improper for the RAN to make such a call. If you want to persist with this claim can you show a quote from somewhere for it?

And if Australia ever goes down the path of having to pay for rescue's, YOU will pay for it as well, no doubt in significantly heightened insurance. You may not even be permitted to go off shore without that expensive insurance.
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Old 25-01-2016, 14:30   #53
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
Listen to their tale and Read between the lines...
They have Not called for assistance 7 times from what I understand.. they have been in contact 7 times with various folk.. not exclusively the Rescue Services.. and... they were towed in by a fishing boat due to one assumes an engine or steering problem..
Although I am perceived Anti-American because I get highly amused winding you guys up these two deserve as much effort as any Brit, Paddy or Jock..
Once you cast off your just another seaman..
All to easy to be a Sanctimonious Twat (generalisation)... till your arse's are in the fire... and a Forum membership decides it knows best
..
Rather well said for you Boatman
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Old 25-01-2016, 14:42   #54
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
The RAN would never had made such a 'complaint'.. It would be considered improper for the RAN to make such a call. If you want to persist with this claim can you show a quote from somewhere for it?

And if Australia ever goes down the path of having to pay for rescue's, YOU will pay for it as well, no doubt in significantly heightened insurance. You may not even be permitted to go off shore without that expensive insurance.
This is true. It was the media complaining about the cost of rescuing some "rich yachtsman" from the southern ocean.

For the navy, it was an opportunity to put their SAR training into practise.
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Old 25-01-2016, 16:25   #55
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

There actually are several models for paying for rescue. In many counties and townships in the US, one pays a subscription for fire rescue services. Don't pay the subscription, and you get charged if the fire service comes out to your house. Of note, often these are also volunteer forces who use the subscription to support themselves.
My town does not have a subscription model. However, they use a different one. The first two responses to a home security alert are free, after that, if it turns out to be a false alarm or a machine malfunction, you get charged in escalating amounts. Provides a lot of incentive to fix your system (or your boat).
Most of these models exist to eliminate moral hazard, not to prevent the rescue of those who can't afford it. So yes, there are models for cost-sharing of rescue services that do, in general, seem to work.
Not saying these guys are one way or the other, but without further information, it does seem like they are externalizing a lot of the costs.


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Old 25-01-2016, 16:42   #56
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
That's not how I remember all the rhetoric at all. The Navy did not complain when they rescued Tony Bullimore in the deep Southern Ocean. They bragged about it instead (as well they should have, for it was a great effort). The folks who always complain about "free rescues" are civilians who have no knowledge about SAR, funding and training.

And FWIW, the Aussie navy is not often involved in SAR, and several of their major efforts in recent years were not for underfunded foreigners, but for very well funded international racers... lots of good publicity for the navy!

Jim

I believe Jim and RC have the correct end of the horse on that subject 🐎
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Old 26-01-2016, 16:19   #57
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

I'm not one for making comments, as I have too much still to learn, however being a resident in St Ives I think I may be able to offer a few salient points.
The below are two links from the BBC local news.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-35413080
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-35357137


I know one of the crew of the RLNI on that shout, and I also know the fisherman who was interviewed.
Having been told not to tie up in St Ives harbour as the tide would drop out and they would tip over, they have gone to Hayle, less than a mile away, and done precisely that. Perhaps in sixty years of sailing, he's never come across tides.
To need assistance once is unfortunate, twice is careless. To expect people who are volunteers to risk their lives for you on a regular basis is ignorant to the point of stupidity.




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Old 26-01-2016, 20:37   #58
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

I call BS on him, if he really flew he never took off without knowing his helicopter was airworthy and yet he goes out in a boat he has no idea if it is seaworthy or not, let alone jumping out of an airplane not knowing a thing about the backpack he just entrusted his life to.
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Old 26-01-2016, 21:08   #59
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
That's not how I remember all the rhetoric at all. The Navy did not complain when they rescued Tony Bullimore in the deep Southern Ocean. They bragged about it instead (as well they should have, for it was a great effort). The folks who always complain about "free rescues" are civilians who have no knowledge about SAR, funding and training.

And FWIW, the Aussie navy is not often involved in SAR, and several of their major efforts in recent years were not for underfunded foreigners, but for very well funded international racers... lots of good publicity for the navy!

Jim
I lived in Adelaide and Queensland during 1997 and 1998 and involved myself in sailing. I do remember the Navy being involved in some expensive SAR rescues for visiting cruisers; although, I cannot remember for sure if the Navy complained or the Media. There was a lot of brouhaha at the time in the marinas and clubs.
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Old 26-01-2016, 21:13   #60
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Re: How Not to Plan an Ocean Passage

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Originally Posted by adlib2 View Post
I lived in Adelaide and Queensland during 1997 and 1998 and involved myself in sailing. I do remember the Navy being involved in some expensive SAR rescues for visiting cruisers; although, I cannot remember for sure if the Navy complained or the Media. There was a lot of brouhaha at the time in the marinas and clubs.
Well, we were in Oz during those years and I don't remember any cruisers being rescued by the Navy. If you can dredge up any references, I'd like to refresh my memories.

Thanks,

Jim
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