How much say do women really have

[44'cruisingcat]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Owning 2 engines in a boat are no different than in an aircraft. When you maintain 2 engines the costs are double that of looking after one. The fuel burn is twice as much and to replace them is double as well...this is pretty simple math.

Massively wrong. In a twin engine aircraft you ALWAYS USE BOTH ENGINES. In a cat' you DO NOT.

FFS, how does running one engine out of two use twice as much fuel as running one engine out of one?

Again the "Expertise" of completely uninformed people on this forum is just incredible!

[weavis]

Originally Posted by tinkrman69

By the way women have as much say as they want. the thread should have said "how much say do women give up?"

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by 44'cruisingcat

Massively wrong. In a twin engine aircraft you ALWAYS USE BOTH ENGINES. In a cat' you DO NOT.

FFS, how does running one engine out of two use twice as much fuel as running one engine out of one?

Again the "Expertise" of completely uninformed people on this forum is just incredible!

Since you are so desperate for a win I'll agree with you that no matter how many engines you may have on your boat including the outboard and genset they only burn fuel when you actually run them, obviously this fact went right over my head.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Since you are so desperate for a win I'll agree with you that no matter how many engines you may have on your boat including the outboard and genset they only burn fuel when you actually run them, obviously this fact went right over my head.

Would you both please ask the women in your lives if this discussion is permitted.

[BandB]

Back to the actual topic, we share equally. In most cases our views are the same on boats although one might like one slightly better and the other like another slightly better. However, generally when we look closer we agree even then. We're power boaters but have some familiarity with sail boats and really space and it's utilization would be a big factor to both of us equally. We could compromise a little on performance, would hold pretty firm on comfort of ride and would be somewhat inflexible on interior space. While we love the upper decks on many Cat's, there are many that the narrow staterooms would make us both claustrophobic or feeling like we were in a prison cell or something.

I also think saying "Mono" vs. "Cat" tends to ignore the wide variation of boats under each label. It's more the individual boat that would influence us. We've been on at least one of each that we wouldn't want to actually sleep on regularly and we've been on each that we thought was quite comfortable. Now, creature comforts are very important to both of us.

[Bulawayo]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

I think these terms are used by older folks that come from traditional marroages

Not on our boat ....my wife is a certified skipper whilst I hold both CASA and RYA Ocean Master - therefore, I am certainly in charge. Notwithstanding, we have a solid marriage - whether that be traditional or not is debatable. Being on watch does not turn that person into the captain of the vessel, they might make decisions if a snap judgement is required but that does not make them the captain. On our boat, if a significant decision is required suddenly then I have no objection to being woken - however, this has happened only rarely. Besides, I trust my wife's judgement implicitly.

[BandB]

Originally Posted by Bulawayo

Not on our boat ....my wife is a certified skipper whilst I hold both CASA and RYA Ocean Master - therefore, I am certainly in charge. Notwithstanding, we have a solid marriage - whether that be traditional or not is debatable. Being on watch does not turn that person into the captain of the vessel, they might make decisions if a snap judgement is required but that does not make them the captain. On our boat, if a significant decision is required suddenly then I have no objection to being woken - however, this has happened only rarely. Besides, I trust my wife's judgement implicitly.

Wifey B: On ours we're both 200 Ton Masters (USCG) so equality reigns.

[dannc]

Now that I know BandB are reading this thread, I can finally make my smart a....ed remark...

How much say do women really have

As long as the boat is Sheworthy, all will be well...



Sorry, could not resist.

Later,
Dan

[BandB]

Originally Posted by dannc

Now that I know BandB are reading this thread, I can finally make my smart a....ed remark...

How much say do women really have

As long as the boat is Sheworthy, all will be well...



Sorry, could not resist.

Later,
Dan

Wifey B: I was nice talking to the KK lady, but might not be as nice telling you what I think of that entire campaign.

Actually, I did get a response from my email to KK. It was polite and well stated. I still disagree with the approach but understand it from a marketing view and curious to see if it works.

Oh, and for the record it probably bothers the other B more than me.

Of course the big thing always for car shows and boat shows, especially high performance and sporty was to hire hot girls to stand around and entice the men. It was sort of a fun job but I really don't think it did anything for sales.

And as to your comment.....hehe....:t rash:

[Bulawayo]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Take the time to read this bit of knowledge I attached regarding flying light twin aircraft as you will learn something. Flying twin engine aircraft comes with its own set of issues when you lose an engine and much of it is a surprise for most people.
Now as you say twin engine redundancy really means bugger all in a sailboat when it comes to safety. If you are a lousy sailor and motor all the time then it might mean something but I doubt that's the case. We lost our engine crossing the Atlantic and it was nothing more than a small inconvenience which is why having 2 engines to me are nothing more than twice the cost and twice the maintenance.

Single vs twin - AOPA

It sounds as though your experience has been fortunate. Try loosing an engine going through the Knysna Heads or through a coral passage. The redundancy is very comforting. I read the twin Vs single engine aircraft reference and can see that it was written tongue in cheek; the author mentions that the twin engine aircraft, after an engine failure shall have a little time to find a crash site whilst the single engine aircraft shall simply land! Having twin engines is rather nice also when manoeuvring in confined area's.

[Bulawayo]

Originally Posted by BandB

Wifey B: On ours we're both 200 Ton Masters (USCG) so equality reigns.

Brilliant - no issues with what works for you. However, how do you respond in less less enlightened countries when they ask to speak to THE captain? They shall not accept two captains on a vessel.

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by Bulawayo

It sounds as though your experience has been fortunate. Try loosing an engine going through the Knysna Heads or through a coral passage. The redundancy is very comforting. I read the twin Vs single engine aircraft reference and can see that it was written tongue in cheek; the author mentions that the twin engine aircraft, after an engine failure shall have a little time to find a crash site whilst the single engine aircraft shall simply land! Having twin engines is rather nice also when manoeuvring in confined area's.

I agree there are good and bad places to lose engines. We lost ours going through a narrow coral passage in the South Pacific and made it by the skin of our teeth with a quick set on our staysail and after that experience in tight spaces I'm always ready with sails. We were lucky as we had trade winds blowing as without those winds all we had was the anchor.
Yes I agree with you that Cats with twins can really maneuver in tight spaces, much better than mono's.
While you might have thought that the author of the flying article was a bit tongue in cheek keep in mind it was written and sanctioned by the FAA (Federal Aviation Agency) these are the Government guys that approve everything and write the rule books. Some simple facts of losing an engine on a twin is that if you have lots of altitude and airspeed then you have many more options than a single engine however a single engine on average glides much further and can land slower so if you have good flying skills you should avoid fatalities.
On take off at low altitude losing an engine on a light twin is often a very bad situation as the pilot must identify which engine failed, get on the rudder, pull the power off that engine,feather the prop and get the aircraft cleaned up. This always takes time and while this is going on the aircraft is losing airspeed. Once the aircraft slows to below single engine speed you run out of rudder and the good engine slowly rolls you over and into the ground. The pilot/instructor loses during training were high enough that you no longer train for this at low altitude as it was deemed too dangerous. Just in the last month or so an Asian Airliner (twin engine) pilot made a mistake and pulled the wrong throttle back after losing an engine on takeoff and you can see exactly what happens. (utube) By the way while it seems stupid to make a mistake like this it is not uncommon.
There is in fact very little difference between the fatality rates between singles and light twins fortunately its not something that happens a lot.

[BandB]

Originally Posted by Bulawayo

Brilliant - no issues with what works for you. However, how do you respond in less less enlightened countries when they ask to speak to THE captain? They shall not accept two captains on a vessel.

Wifey B: Depends on who is listed as Master on the trip. For most less enlightened countries we would generally have a captain on board as Master and that is generally also a female. Now, we go back and forth to the Bahamas and one time it might be him and the next me. The customs people there know us well by now anyway. But you're right that someone does have to be listed as the Master on each trip.

I think in some ports on our trip from the PNW to Florida, areas of Mexico, Nicaragua, Panama, Costa Rica and even Caymans and Jamaica, some of them were surprised a female was THE captain. But it wasn't an issue anywhere. I only recall one time a dockmaster ever wanted to "test" a female captain. That was actually in SC. Stephanie said no to where they wanted to put us and told them where we wanted to dock. They claimed depth wasn't a problem. She said, "I'm looking at it right now on Sonar and I can see clearly it is a problem. Maybe we should just go somewhere else." She started to turn us around and boy did his attitude change.

So much is attitude. If you choose to be a female captain you might have issues. If you choose to be a captain first, who happens to be female, you won't.

When cruising and contacting bridges and lockmasters if it's just hubby and me, I'm the one more inclined to make the contact as I like talking more than him. By now, he and I just interact automatically, we know each other so well. That's where the whole say thing falls apart for us. We go through the whole process together, as one really. We know each other so well, much of it never has to be said.

Ok, funny story. I dreamed all my life of owning a Porsche. We go to the dealer. I'm doing all the talking, hubby just along for the ride pretty much. But the sales dude would answer all my questions to him. He called the dude out on that but the dude continued and asked my hubby what he'd have to do to get us in one today. My hubby said, "Well, since I have no interest in a Porsche and there's nothing you can do to sell me one and you refuse to deal with the one who is going to buy one, we'll just be going to another dealer." We left, drove to Tampa, bought my car. Now, we didn't totally leave over that but he doesn't know that. They were dancing around questions and didn't have the exact car I wanted. Otherwise I would have just gone and asked for another sales person.

Really a lot of the burden is on females and how they conduct themselves. The CEO and the CFO of our company are female. But first and foremost they are great business persons and leaders.

My poor poor hubby....he spends his life surrounded by females....mostly hot ones who adore him. Last Sat and Sun are typical. There were 16 of us and 14 were female.

We were equal from the day we met as we both considered the other one better. We learned so much from each other. Nearly 15 years later, we really are like one. I know our relationship isn't right for others and we never say it is. Every couple has to find what is right for them. We're lucky that our interests are the same so neither of us has to sacrifice in that regard. I know it's unlikely anyone here has ever seen the musical "Promises, Promises." In it there's one song. The dude is so excited when he finds out the girl likes basketball. Well, I love basketball.

She likes basketball, how about that?
We've got something in common to talk about
Basketball

She likes basketball, how about that?
I have some place to take her when we go out
Basketball

Whoever would've dreamed, ever would've thought?
That my favorite girl likes my favorite sport
Like any other kid, I would make-believe
With a ball in my hand

I'd dribble right past
All the others real fast
And I'd be six-foot eight
And my jump shot was really great

She likes basketball, isn't that wild?
It's an omen that good things are on their way
Things to share

We share basketball, couldn't you die?
From a simple beginning like this
We may get somewhere
It's nice to dream
Someday it might be, basketball and me

Whoever would've dreamed, ever would've thought?
That my favorite girl likes my favorite sport
Like any other kid, I would make-believe
With a ball in my hand

I'd dribble right past
All the others real fast
And I'd be six-foot eight
And my jump shot was really great

She likes basketball, isn't that wild?
It's an omen that good things are on their way
Things to share

We share basketball, couldn't you die?
From a simple beginning like this
We may get somewhere
It's nice to dream
Someday it might be, basketball and me

[Bulawayo]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

I agree there are good and bad places to lose engines. We lost ours going through a narrow coral passage in the South Pacific and made it by the skin of our teeth with a quick set on our staysail and after that experience in tight spaces I'm always ready with sails. We were lucky as we had trade winds blowing as without those winds all we had was the anchor.
Yes I agree with you that Cats with twins can really maneuver in tight spaces, much better than mono's.
While you might have thought that the author of the flying article was a bit tongue in cheek keep in mind it was written and sanctioned by the FAA (Federal Aviation Agency) these are the Government guys that approve everything and write the rule books. Some simple facts of losing an engine on a twin is that if you have lots of altitude and airspeed then you have many more options than a single engine however a single engine on average glides much further and can land slower so if you have good flying skills you should avoid fatalities.
On take off at low altitude losing an engine on a light twin is often a very bad situation as the pilot must identify which engine failed, get on the rudder, pull the power off that engine,feather the prop and get the aircraft cleaned up. This always takes time and while this is going on the aircraft is losing airspeed. Once the aircraft slows to below single engine speed you run out of rudder and the good engine slowly rolls you over and into the ground. The pilot/instructor loses during training were high enough that you no longer train for this at low altitude as it was deemed too dangerous. Just in the last month or so an Asian Airliner (twin engine) pilot made a mistake and pulled the wrong throttle back after losing an engine on takeoff and you can see exactly what happens. (utube) By the way while it seems stupid to make a mistake like this it is not uncommon.
There is in fact very little difference between the fatality rates between singles and light twins fortunately its not something that happens a lot.

Thanks, I sail a cat but it is not big enough to even keep a helicopter on, let alone a twin engine aeroplane. Perhaps next time.

[Bulawayo]

Originally Posted by BandB

Wifey B: Depends on who is listed as Master on the trip. For most less enlightened countries we would generally have a captain on board as Master and that is generally also a female. Now, we go back and forth to the Bahamas and one time it might be him and the next me. The customs people there know us well by now anyway. But you're right that someone does have to be listed as the Master on each trip.

I think in some ports on our trip from the PNW to Florida, areas of Mexico, Nicaragua, Panama, Costa Rica and even Caymans and Jamaica, some of them were surprised a female was THE captain. But it wasn't an issue anywhere. I only recall one time a dockmaster ever wanted to "test" a female captain. That was actually in SC. Stephanie said no to where they wanted to put us and told them where we wanted to dock. They claimed depth wasn't a problem. She said, "I'm looking at it right now on Sonar and I can see clearly it is a problem. Maybe we should just go somewhere else." She started to turn us around and boy did his attitude change.

So much is attitude. If you choose to be a female captain you might have issues. If you choose to be a captain first, who happens to be female, you won't.

When cruising and contacting bridges and lockmasters if it's just hubby and me, I'm the one more inclined to make the contact as I like talking more than him. By now, he and I just interact automatically, we know each other so well. That's where the whole say thing falls apart for us. We go through the whole process together, as one really. We know each other so well, much of it never has to be said.

Ok, funny story. I dreamed all my life of owning a Porsche. We go to the dealer. I'm doing all the talking, hubby just along for the ride pretty much. But the sales dude would answer all my questions to him. He called the dude out on that but the dude continued and asked my hubby what he'd have to do to get us in one today. My hubby said, "Well, since I have no interest in a Porsche and there's nothing you can do to sell me one and you refuse to deal with the one who is going to buy one, we'll just be going to another dealer." We left, drove to Tampa, bought my car. Now, we didn't totally leave over that but he doesn't know that. They were dancing around questions and didn't have the exact car I wanted. Otherwise I would have just gone and asked for another sales person.

Really a lot of the burden is on females and how they conduct themselves. The CEO and the CFO of our company are female. But first and foremost they are great business persons and leaders.

My poor poor hubby....he spends his life surrounded by females....mostly hot ones who adore him. Last Sat and Sun are typical. There were 16 of us and 14 were female.

We were equal from the day we met as we both considered the other one better. We learned so much from each other. Nearly 15 years later, we really are like one. I know our relationship isn't right for others and we never say it is. Every couple has to find what is right for them. We're lucky that our interests are the same so neither of us has to sacrifice in that regard. I know it's unlikely anyone here has ever seen the musical "Promises, Promises." In it there's one song. The dude is so excited when he finds out the girl likes basketball. Well, I love basketball.

She likes basketball, how about that?
We've got something in common to talk about
Basketball

She likes basketball, how about that?
I have some place to take her when we go out
Basketball

Whoever would've dreamed, ever would've thought?
That my favorite girl likes my favorite sport
Like any other kid, I would make-believe
With a ball in my hand

I'd dribble right past
All the others real fast
And I'd be six-foot eight
And my jump shot was really great

She likes basketball, isn't that wild?
It's an omen that good things are on their way
Things to share

We share basketball, couldn't you die?
From a simple beginning like this
We may get somewhere
It's nice to dream
Someday it might be, basketball and me

Whoever would've dreamed, ever would've thought?
That my favorite girl likes my favorite sport
Like any other kid, I would make-believe
With a ball in my hand

I'd dribble right past
All the others real fast
And I'd be six-foot eight
And my jump shot was really great

She likes basketball, isn't that wild?
It's an omen that good things are on their way
Things to share

We share basketball, couldn't you die?
From a simple beginning like this
We may get somewhere
It's nice to dream
Someday it might be, basketball and me

Hi BandB - nice posting.
We have spent quite some time in the Middle East - the views of some of these countries regarding women is somewhat disturbing when it comes to recognising the ability of the female of our species.
At the end of the day, officially, there needs to be a captain - what actually happens on board is not always what we write.