How much boat can I afford?

[NedX]

Originally Posted by ZULU40

This advice is entirely sound and is pretty well where I began, but I think I was unusually lucky with Zaya which is an ideal bluewater/cruising boat.

I guess what Im trying to say is mostly people have no idea what their needs are, I was just lucky and landed on my feet almost despite myself.

Thank you. Yeah, I think was I was hoping here was to see what other people's economic models were for purchasing cost-to-maintenance cost ratios. I realize luck has a lot to do with it, but any good plan starts with a realistic sense of expectations, and that starts with a cost model.
You go on a new Internet forum, you expect to find a lot of hazing from the crowd of insiders. (Try acoustic guitar forums.) 60-70 percent of the answers here have been very useful and I find that to be excellent.
Some guys see the subject line and assume I'm an idiot who's about to drop 100k on something he don't know how to use. Only the idiot part is correct.

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by NedX

That is an absolutely incredible story, and thank you for sharing it. I'm a lot closer to that guy than I am to some of the stuff I've read on this site, but a long way to go to be him.

Sean posts here with some frequency. I believe he’s working his way down the east coast USA right now. His handle here is boatalexandra or something similar.

[NedX]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

Very true about the upgrades. We made a list and got what we thought was critical out of the way figuring we would do the rest as time and budget allowed. Probably 80% of the list never got done because once we got out we found we really didn't need it.

FYI - If you are dumping $15k into maintenance per year on a 32'er, you are either working that poor boat very hard or you got a lemon. We had a 34' catamaran for 10yrs and averaged closer to $3-5k/yr for maintenance.

A big question for the $100k figure is this intended to be your full living budget or just the money to get the boat and bring it up to a condition you are happy with (or something in between)?
- $100k to get a 32'er and get her in decent shape to head you...probably overkill.
- $100k to buy a boat, get her in decent shape and a few years of cruising expenses...it can be done but a lot of DIY and living as cheap as possible.

Thank you. Excellent follow up question. I am asking about experienced owners' sense of a purchase cost to maintenance cost ratio. So if 100k is the budget to buy and maintain for 5-10 years, then what is your sense of the ideal purchase price?
That's probably the way I should've put it, to make it easier to see where I was coming from, maybe get a "poor" rating instead of "terrible."
I also realize that a powerboat could ram you the first day out, or you could drop dead on the second one.
The idea is experienced owners' sense of an economic model.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by NedX

Thank you. Excellent follow up question. I am asking about experienced owners' sense of a purchase cost to maintenance cost ratio. So if 100k is the budget to buy and maintain for 5-10 years, then what is your sense of the ideal purchase price?
That's probably the way I should've put it, to make it easier to see where I was coming from, maybe get a "poor" rating instead of "terrible."
I also realize that a powerboat could ram you the first day out, or you could drop dead on the second one.
The idea is experienced owners' sense of an economic model.

Bought a 2001 Beneteau 331 from a well known Charter company in the BVI, Tortola for $60K in December 2006.. sailed to SXM where I had a custom SS tube solar arch/davit set up built for $3K.. a slat floor inflatable and Tohatsu 5hp for $1K, an Aerogen wind generator and a 250W solar panel for another $1K.. also spare oil and fuel filters.
I then mooched around St Barts, Anguilla and SXM for a few months before heading solo direct to the Azores.. from there to Portugal..
The next year I did a circuit from the Algarve to Madeira, then Faial, Pico, Sao Jorge, Terceira before heading back to Lisbon..
Late September '08 I sailed her up to Brixham where, due to the wonder of the American economic system, I was forced to put her on the market as things began to crash..
Sailed away again late November in a Hurley 22 worth GBP2.5K and 500quid in my pocket.
In the time I owned her all she cost me bar fuel and harbour/marina fees is listed above.. but in reality I lost around $67K overall.
Only buy what you can afford to LOSE..

[robert sailor]

Also keep in mind that there are many different levels of maintenance by different thinking people. We know sailors that consider their boat well maintained but after a visit to their boat and a few questions you begin to realize that they actually believe their boat is well maintained but not to my level. I'm sure there are people that might want their boat even better looked after than ours so keep this in mind when people are giving you advice on costs. Everything on a boat has a service life and there comes a time when it's smarter in the long run to replace rather than repair and that includes engines, sails, rigging, pumps etc. etc. The other really important consideration is how the boat is being used. If it's used as a coastal sailor in summer months you can expect very low maintenance costs in comparison to a boat that is crossing oceans and being lived on 24/7 for years. So if an ocean cruiser is sharing his expenses with you and your planning to coastal hop and live a board his information might be useless to you.

[robert sailor]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Bought a 2001 Beneteau 331 from a well known Charter company in the BVI, Tortola for $60K in December 2006.. sailed to SXM where I had a custom SS tube solar arch/davit set up built for $3K.. a slat floor inflatable and Tohatsu 5hp for $1K, an Aerogen wind generator and a 250W solar panel for another $1K.. also spare oil and fuel filters.
I then mooched around St Barts, Anguilla and SXM for a few months before heading solo direct to the Azores.. from there to Portugal..
The next year I did a circuit from the Algarve to Madeira, then Faial, Pico, Sao Jorge, Terceira before heading back to Lisbon..
Late September '08 I sailed her up to Brixham where, due to the wonder of the American economic system, I was forced to put her on the market as things began to crash..
Sailed away again late November in a Hurley 22 worth GBP2.5K and 500quid in my pocket.
In the time I owned her all she cost me bar fuel and harbour/marina fees is listed above.. but in reality I lost around $67K overall.
Only buy what you can afford to LOSE..

Boatie...Your never supposed to admit that kind of stuff on an open forum like this, it will scare the bejesus out of some folks If we were all as honest as you there would be some interesting stories to be told.

[nmit5903]

Very difficult to answer however I work on the basis that it really doesn’t matter whether one buys new or used, either you spend on depreciation or maintenance and replacements. I’ve had 4 larger, cruising monohulls (42-48’) and the rule has pretty well held true so budget based on what you could afford new.

As others have said, you can be lucky or unlucky. If buying used make sure you have its surveyed however I know a few people that have still had bad surprises and the surveyors insurance companies manage to wriggle out of the claim one way or another.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by NedX

Thank you. Excellent follow up question. I am asking about experienced owners' sense of a purchase cost to maintenance cost ratio. So if 100k is the budget to buy and maintain for 5-10 years, then what is your sense of the ideal purchase price?
That's probably the way I should've put it, to make it easier to see where I was coming from, maybe get a "poor" rating instead of "terrible."
I also realize that a powerboat could ram you the first day out, or you could drop dead on the second one.
The idea is experienced owners' sense of an economic model.

I just had a quick look at what was available in the US with an ask in the order of $50k on boats in the 30/35 range..... lots out there and that is just the asking price. (Sail) Boats For Sale

I most likely wouldn't buy anything older than early 90's... unless it was another Sealord

Find a boat of that vintage that is fit for your planned usage.... ensure good engine, good sails, and good all round.... so how far will your remaining $50k go?

Let's assume you aren't including general running costs, insurance, hauling, antifouling, cost of keeping her somewhere.

In the next 10 years if you are doing a bit of sailing, and even if you aren't...

You can expect the following..

New sails, new rigging, maybe ( big maybe ) a major engine overhaul. You may need to do some of that before you take your new ship to sea for the first time...

Fixing and replacing assorted stuff... windlass, dodger, assorted pumps, string, blocks, ( all this stuff ages and has to be replaced sooner or later.....)

$50k should cover it all...

And don't listen to them as say buy a $7k boat cos boats were built better when Noah was a deckboy.... old is old....

Boat to buy?

Plenty of bennys and jennys cruising the south pacific.... and this season there have been 3 Bavarias in Puerto Williams.....

[nmit5903]

I would ignore US imports unless all the power conversions have been done and done well. If you have $100k to spend over 10 years - assuming a used boat and 10% of the capital cost as maintenance etc - the capital cost incl any upgrades etc should be $50k, followed then by $5ka for 10 years. Unless something untoward happens and so long as the boat is insured, one could budget on that I think.

[crankysailor]

I said it before and I will say it again.. boat prices seem to magically adjust to whatever your budget is. If you are shopping for 32ft boats in the sub 30K category.. you will find many. If you are shopping for 32ft boats in the 100K category.. you will also find many. And no, a direct correlation to seaworthiness, quality or upkeep costs is not necessarily always there.

Truth is.. there are a LOT of really nice 32ft boats to be had for under 30K for sure. I wouldn't spend much more than that... I had one and it cost me about 5K in the first year to keep her running.. add food and personal expenses.. if you just want to "bum" around the world, 100K will go a long way as you can see on a 32ft boat. Some rough calculations in my head tell me I could possibly do about 3 or 4 years on that money and boat and not even trying hard to save. If you are the type who is used to get by with little, probably twice that long. I know folks that are like this and no.. I am not one of them .. but a buddy of mine can make 10K last a year while traveling all over asia. Including plane tickets

If you want the nicest possible most luxurious 32 ft money could buy I am sure you could spend 200K just on buying the boat .. so it all depends on you really. You decide how you want to do it.

Fair winds!

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by nmit5903

I would ignore US imports unless all the power conversions have been done and done well. If you have $100k to spend over 10 years - assuming a used boat and 10% of the capital cost as maintenance etc - the capital cost incl any upgrades etc should be $50k, followed then by $5ka for 10 years. Unless something untoward happens and so long as the boat is insured, one could budget on that I think.

Ummmmm... the OP is on the east coast of the US... or at least I think he is....

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Boatie...Your never supposed to admit that kind of stuff on an open forum like this, it will scare the bejesus out of some folks If we were all as honest as you there would be some interesting stories to be told.

Considering my current Avatar.. should you be surprised..???

[nmit5903]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

Ummmmm... the OP is on the east coast of the US... or at least I think he is....

Good point. I’ll rephrase it - imports into the US. Others may have had better experiences than me and mine was a long time ago with power boats but changing voltage in either direction (up or down) can be a nightmare.

[akprb]

Here's the boat for you!

:-)

We already put the 50K+ into her and enjoyed her up and down the East Coast and Bahamas for the last couple of years. Turn key and go!

1994 Hunter Legend sailboat for sale in Florida

[Larry Florida]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Taken from another thread by Steadyhand..
What is possible if one has the spirit and will.. A quiet achiever, sailing alone around the world
You just have to find where you fit in between the above and what others think is indispensable..

Great stuff! Amazing character