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Old 12-12-2011, 22:23   #211
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex-Calif View Post
One vote for hail and tack...

Here's my considerations

- There appears to be navigable depth for both boat all around so it appears niether boat "has" to use the channel. (I reserve the right to reverse when RH posts the chartlet or tells us the location and we find it's 3 feet deep)
- I agree there is a normal passing situation developing
- My rule of thumb. If the speed of the passing boat is such that I cannot turn and cross his bow "safely" using normal maneuvering and current speed of both boats, then the "passing situation" has begun.
- The ferry is making a wake and it's hard to judge distance But with the look of the water (low wind) and sailboat wake I'd say the sailboat is barely moving.
- RH said the ferry passed about 75 feet laterally. About 2 lengths of the sailboat I would guess based on the beam of the sailboat
- If I tacked now I am not sure I would safely cross his bow so I judge the passing situation exists and passing rules are in effect.

My vote

- I wait 30 seconds to a minute and tack then. I am in no jeopardy if I wait. If I was in jeopardy I would tack through about 120 degrees and make it clear to the ferry that I would pass his stern.
- Yes I am judging him to have rights because I judge the passing situation has started

Reasoning

- If I tacked now I am not sure I could cross him and I must assume a risk of collision would exist after the tack - I would have sailing rights but the power boat would also presume a collision hazard exists and should alter to starboard or reduce speed.

If we collided he would argue a passing situation exised and I sailboat altered course and speed. Sailboat would argue a crossing situation existed and the sailboat had rights

(A note about the 120 degree tack. If I tacked 90, stabilized and then judged I could not cross - I can no longer alter to port because I am now in a crossing situation! And because I am close hauled already I can't alter to starboard to avoid the potential collision!)

Now - I look forward to the discussion that tacking is a good idea at this moment.
My guess would be that at the picture's first distance and knowing the general route of the harbor tour boats you can ascertain that in about one-to-two minutes he's going to be overtaking you.

If that puts the sailboat in a bad place, tack now. It's well in advance, the skipper can deal with it, and you made your correction early and obvious. If you think there's a problem but you just sit there and hold tight hoping the problems will alleviate themselves is where the real issues can sprout up.

The sailboat is the standon vessel but shouldn't be doing anything to increase the chances of a collision (including colliding with the channel edge by losing steerage). Make the tack as early as possible, and if that can't be done it's probably the fault of the sailing vessel's lookout for not keeping abreast of the vessels around her. That harbor tour boat didn't materialize out of thin air.
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Old 12-12-2011, 22:59   #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rebel heart

My guess would be that at the picture's first distance and knowing the general route of the harbor tour boats you can ascertain that in about one-to-two minutes he's going to be overtaking you.

If that puts the sailboat in a bad place, tack now. It's well in advance, the skipper can deal with it, and you made your correction early and obvious. If you think there's a problem but you just sit there and hold tight hoping the problems will alleviate themselves is where the real issues can sprout up.

The sailboat is the standon vessel but shouldn't be doing anything to increase the chances of a collision (including colliding with the channel edge by losing steerage). Make the tack as early as possible, and if that can't be done it's probably the fault of the sailing vessel's lookout for not keeping abreast of the vessels around her. That harbor tour boat didn't materialize out of thin air.
Not that you need my validation but I agree 100% with your last two posts.

Regs are like contracts. Shouldn't need to cite them until you go to court. And by then everyone loses.
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Old 12-12-2011, 23:05   #213
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

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Originally Posted by rebel heart View Post
Well here's him when he overtook us, I'd say 50-75' of distance.


Looks closer to 50 yards distant to me.
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Old 19-12-2011, 11:01   #214
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=HappySeagull;836872]Sometimes,I have to drive along behind a semi-trailer tractor on a narrow winding road...that's life.I usualy wait for the safest opportunity to pass.I don't usually pick curves or tunnels for this!
QUOTE]

And yet if I'm in my overloaded Honda going up this same road, and can't maintain the speed limit, and see a line of cars in my rear view mirror, I pull over and let them by. There is no law that says I HAVE to do this, but it makes everyones drive safer.
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Old 19-12-2011, 15:33   #215
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=capn_billl;841532]
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappySeagull View Post
Sometimes,I have to drive along behind a semi-trailer tractor on a narrow winding road...that's life.I usualy wait for the safest opportunity to pass.I don't usually pick curves or tunnels for this!
QUOTE]

And yet if I'm in my overloaded Honda going up this same road, and can't maintain the speed limit, and see a line of cars in my rear view mirror, I pull over and let them by. There is no law that says I HAVE to do this, but it makes everyones drive safer.
The voice of reason???? Never work....
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Old 19-12-2011, 15:50   #216
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=capn_billl;841532]
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappySeagull View Post
Sometimes,I have to drive along behind a semi-trailer tractor on a narrow winding road...that's life.I usualy wait for the safest opportunity to pass.I don't usually pick curves or tunnels for this!
QUOTE]

And yet if I'm in my overloaded Honda going up this same road, and can't maintain the speed limit, and see a line of cars in my rear view mirror, I pull over and let them by. There is no law that says I HAVE to do this, but it makes everyones drive safer.
Spot on.

Do sailors sail like they drive.
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Old 19-12-2011, 16:55   #217
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

I like it when you are parked in the middle of a bay miles from anywhere and some random jetski comes over the horizon and feels it necessary to pass within 20 feet of you and keep going. Maybe he's hoping for salvage rights.
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Old 19-12-2011, 17:20   #218
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

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Originally Posted by rebel heart View Post
A passenger snapped this picture on Friday, it's much like the diagram that I posted. I'm on a port tack getting closer to the channel edge, and that harbor tour boat back there overtook me without about 75' of room to spare. It happens a lot and for the folks who work constantly on the water you just get used to hustling around all the time. I'm in the beanie / gray jacket.

I dont get it.... are you saying 75 ft is too close?
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Old 19-12-2011, 17:44   #219
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=capn_billl;841532]
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappySeagull View Post
Sometimes,I have to drive along behind a semi-trailer tractor on a narrow winding road...that's life.I usualy wait for the safest opportunity to pass.I don't usually pick curves or tunnels for this!
QUOTE]

And yet if I'm in my overloaded Honda going up this same road, and can't maintain the speed limit, and see a line of cars in my rear view mirror, I pull over and let them by. There is no law that says I HAVE to do this, but it makes everyones drive safer.
if you add "Periodically,if there's a safe place to do it."I'd agree.But I wouldn't expect that"overloaded Honda" to be skidding into the potholes of a layby on a mountain road every time he sees somebody in the rear view mirror either.

and there aren't any "laybys" in Surge Narrows.
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Old 20-12-2011, 07:21   #220
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=HappySeagull;841799]
Quote:
Originally Posted by capn_billl View Post

if you add "Periodically,if there's a safe place to do it."I'd agree.But I wouldn't expect that"overloaded Honda" to be skidding into the potholes of a layby on a mountain road every time he sees somebody in the rear view mirror either.

and there aren't any "laybys" in Surge Narrows.
Yes, and this is one of the things we face in a discussion like this. There was a time, you may remember, when Alberta roads had signs asking slower vehicles to drive in the shoulder and let faster vehicles get by. This same behavior is illegal, as well as frighteningly dangerous in BC. 'Twas even worse 35 years ago when we traversed this province using goat paths. However Albertans would arrive in BC believing the correct behavior was to pull there 40 foot 5th wheeler over and drive the edge of the precipice politely allowing the Leadfoot Louie to pass on Deadman's Curve.

There's no shortage of tidal goat paths, strewn with jagged rocks, between the islands of coastal BC. On the other hand undoubtedly there are passages elsewhere more like the broad shouldered highways of Alberta.
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Old 20-12-2011, 07:57   #221
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=hummingway;842110]
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappySeagull View Post

Yes, and this is one of the things we face in a discussion like this. There was a time, you may remember, when Alberta roads had signs asking slower vehicles to drive in the shoulder and let faster vehicles get by. This same behavior is illegal, as well as frighteningly dangerous in BC. 'Twas even worse 35 years ago when we traversed this province using goat paths. However Albertans would arrive in BC believing the correct behavior was to pull there 40 foot 5th wheeler over and drive the edge of the precipice politely allowing the Leadfoot Louie to pass on Deadman's Curve.

There's no shortage of tidal goat paths, strewn with jagged rocks, between the islands of coastal BC. On the other hand undoubtedly there are passages elsewhere more like the broad shouldered highways of Alberta.
You are taking the absurd extreme here not the simple curtesy suggested.
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Old 20-12-2011, 08:04   #222
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=downunder;842138]
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You are taking the absurd extreme here not the simple curtesy suggested.
Explain yourself. As I said in coastal BC it is quite common. When I leave the bay where I keep my boat and head into the Georgia Straight I have to go through a short narrow pass where the current can run up to 9 knots, though in the average day it's more likely to run to 5 knots. On one side of the passage tides run to 17 feet and on the other 14 feet. This is far from uncommon here.

If it doesn't do that where you are then it will seem like an "absurd extreme" but that is my point. Someone suggesting a person pull over and allow some through where you are may make a lot more sense then on some of the waters here where it simply isn't safe.
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Old 20-12-2011, 08:36   #223
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

[QUOTE=HappySeagull;841799]
Quote:
Originally Posted by capn_billl View Post

if you add "Periodically,if there's a safe place to do it."I'd agree.But I wouldn't expect that"overloaded Honda" to be skidding into the potholes of a layby on a mountain road every time he sees somebody in the rear view mirror either.

and there aren't any "laybys" in Surge Narrows.
Indeed I certainly was not suggesting one ever to put your own vessel in jepardy and I have no doubt there's no shortage of tidal goat paths, strewn with jagged rocks, between the islands of coastal BC and on the other hand undoubtedly there are passages elsewhere more like the broad shouldered highways of Alberta.

Simple courtesy when it can be safely applied and definitely not to be skidding into the potholes of a layby on a mountain road every time he sees somebody in the rear view mirror either.

cheers
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Old 20-12-2011, 13:59   #224
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

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I dont get it.... are you saying 75 ft is too close?
That tour boat was overtaking my port side while I was on a port tack, bearing into the channel edge. Eventually I need to tack and come about to a starboard tack, dramatically reducing that 75' (the boat itself is ~40).

For a kayak you can pass within 5' of each other, for twin screw cabin cruisers it's maybe 20', for > 1500 ton ships it's 1/4 mile, etc. The distance depends entirely on the maneuverability of the vessels involved.
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Old 20-12-2011, 16:08   #225
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Re: How Do You Like Being Overtaken by a Power Boat ?

I have always taken the Gentleman's approach when face with inconsiderate over takers or too friendly jet ski boats. I smile and wave.... occasionally I use all of my fingers.
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