Home land security?

[Matt Hager]

This weekend I had my truck searched (torn apart) for drugs after a routine speeding ticket, after the dogs confirmed what I told the officer that there was no drugs in my truck and he wrote my ticket I was left to put my truck back togather. Was it because I have long hair or my out of state tag I don't know. I had 5 long rifles and 100 lbs of amo in my truck and nothing was said about them all he wanted was drugs.

Just looked like a good place to vent!

Matt Hager

[nockerwhite]

"6 rifles & 100lbs of ammo"

Here in the UK it is a criminal act to bear arms, even an air rifle/pistol will bring a massive response. The only people to be found bearing arms are the professional criminals and psyched-up killing machines - police 'armed response units'.
In fact fairly recently one lone farmer who had had several raids on his property by a group of teenagers and any response from the police had come hours too late. On this occasion when the thugs were attempting to gain access, at wit's end, thro' his door, he discharged a shotgun thro' the wooden door and killed one of the youths - he found himself on a murder charge , which was commuted to manslaughter and he received a lengthy prison sentence. He finally was released I think after 4 years. after an appeal.
Property owners with fragile roofs have to display warning notices to would-be trepassers/burglars!
It is heaven for law-beakers! The average 'life' sentence served by a murderer is less than 10 years.
Sorry to be slightly off subject, but many would be surprised at our vulnerability brought about by an ultra liberal legislature (of all political shades). The terrorists here have been motivated by'clerics' openly, even in the open air, preaching hate and advocating suicide attacks. with no intervention, and living on the state - freedom of speech rules - yet the innocent Brazilian was wiped out without even a challenge.

[BC Mike]

Alaska Dog, I am quite aware of the Patriot Act and how it affects us all. You have made some statements about how and what I think and feel with no evidence.
What I asked for in my post was for folks personal thoughts on boardings with out quoting the legal matters.
Something like the following " I can uderstand their need to do searches if there is reasonable cause, but it does feel like a home invasion to me "
The US administration started the war on drugs about 1937. There were propergander films like refer madness.
Maybe I am prodding the US folks, put they are the ones that usually start quoting the same old stuff to do with ammendants and their rights and so on.
How does the rest of the world survive ?
BTW I get plenty of US opinion content from my red neck tractor buddies.
Michael

[delmarrey]

nockerwhite once whispered in the wind:



It is heaven for law-beakers! The average 'life' sentence served by a murderer is less than 10 years.
Sorry to be slightly off subject, but many would be surprised at our vulnerability brought about by an ultra liberal legislature (of all political shades). The terrorists here have been motivated by'clerics' openly, even in the open air, preaching hate and advocating suicide attacks. with no intervention, and living on the state .....

So, you can understand why most Americans are resisting the adinfinitum left, for it will be the end of America as we know it and that our ancestors worked and died for.

One thing we don't want is one hate group fighting another. When people don't listen to reason that's when it becomes dangerous. There have been common laws written for hundreds even thousands of years and now they are trying to push them aside calling it "discrimination". They keep pushing the "Wrong Line" farther and farther back. Soon anything goes even pedophillia.

Rant, rant, rant. I know but at least someone across the pond reconizes the problem we're fighting here and shows what will happen if we go that route.

[alaskadog]

For BC Mike who said:" For the rest of the owrld we wonder what your thoughts are on the issue, not what founding fathers had to say." So you are the self appointed representative for the "rest of the world, eh?" And as for your red neck tractor buddies. Good for them. Are they Canadian or American red necks? Seems like we here in the States punched one of your "hot buttons" when talking about civil rights, the Patriot Act and their relationship to our Constitution. As for my assumption that you either don't know or don't care about how the Patriots Act affects Canadians. I guess that from your last post, it must be the latter. Fine with me. No problemo. Also, fine with me that you care little about our rights. No reason that you should. Perhaps you should have just stayed off this thread.

[BC Mike]

Alaska dog, there is not much sense turning up the rhetoric with each subsequent post. Sorry if I pushed your hot button. I would rather go sailing.

Michael

[GordMay]

I've been (and will remain) away from home; and don't have internet access - so this is my first chance to view the forum in over a fortnight.
I'll admit to a lttle nervousness, when I saw the title of this thread; and was very pleased to note the adult manner in which an emotionally charged, and controversial subject has been addressed.
It's gratifying to know that the administrater isn't missed.
Regards,
Gord

[Talbot]

Yes you were missed Gord!!!!

[Alan Wheeler]

Incorrect Gord. The administrater is missed and that last statment of yours should read,
"It's gratifying to know the administrater has done a job excellent enough, that in the lack of his presence, the board doesn't fall apart".

Speaking of gone... I had to leave for a week due to a death in the family. Just got back after 33 hours of driving (2am) so I have only skimmed the new replys, however, a quick update. I did contact press, and was informed from a local friend, that an article was printed on the front page of the local paper, from my info. The associated local TV station left me voice mail as well. We are currently playing phone tag. Last real info had the Coasties denying that they were citing the Patriot Act, but acknowleging all else. More to follow after some sleeeep.

OK, here is what I have so far. The article was posted on the front page of the Sept. 7th Monterey Herald.
The Coasties confirmed the boardings.
They deny saying that their authority was represented as being through the Patriot Act and cited the federal regulation that allows them to board any vessel in US waters and inspect at will.
They did make one arrest
The victim of this arrest was released the next day (oops, that was hand rolled cigs, not pot)
The reason for the boardings was to let the general public know that the US Coast Guard is a law enforcement organization, not just search and rescue.
They were not looking for anything, just flexing their muscle.
Scared yet?
They state that this is just the beginning of this campaign. More searches coming to a marina near you!

[capt lar]

i think you blew it when they asked "have you been boarded recently?" the correct response might have been "why yes, last tuesday. they went thru everything. i think its that large power cruiser's turn this week."
my lame humor aside, the sad truth is when someone high up comes up with a plan, someone down low has to do something. sounds like you were the unlucky test case. i commend you for calmly and persistently keeping at it.
the intent of the Act was to improve security and we know we need to. the Act was a broad and poorly defined piece of legislation. it will take time to correct the errors. in the meantime many will have their rights tread on by all sorts of means. in this case, i hope you find out who decided the c.g. needs to show itself to be a policing agency. got to be a local with intent of improving his own career. keep up the pressure. it is harder to make change than to bitch about it. let us know. i think i'm back on the boston public gardens and they are just sending in the tear gas - a common event in 1970. glad you are speaking up. we all should when they have it wrong, and random search is just plain wrong. capt. lar

Thanks Capt. Lar.
I finaly got a copy of the article. Boats from all three harbors in the Monterey Bay were boarded. Management from several other harbors were contacted, and the consenses is that this is a first, and is outrageous. In addition to the Coast Guard, Local law enforcement (real law enforcement), INS, and, believe it or not, NOAA personnel were involved. US Coast Guard "Fast boats" were used from surrounding Coast Guard groups. (Fully equipped with machine guns). Night vision goggles were reportedly used, and even vessels that were not boarded were "checked out" with unidentified equipment. (Bomb sniffers?)
The Coasties state that there was no specific report of a threat of any kind, but have made no secret, their belief that they have the authority to act in such a manor.
In most cases, I hear more info, and understand better the actions. In this case, the more I know, the angrier and more violated I feel. Make no mistake. By the Coast Guard's own admission, this is only the beginning.
I intend to make it my mission in life to make sure it is the end.
As for problems that need solutions, I agree there are many, but armed thugs invading the homes of inocent citizens is not an option.

[Richhh]

The CG is the result of the amalgamation of TWO US services: 1. the Revenue Service (prevention of smuggling, enforcement of customs duties, etc.) AND the CG to board ANY US boat at anytime, anywhere is not abandoned. 2. the Lifeboat service. Such boardings have been within the bounds of the force of law and are especially outside the limits of the fourth ammendment of the US constitution. I dont remember the exact case but such 'boardings/inspections at will' has been the rule of law since since the judgement of the US Supreme Court in the early 1800s. In that decison a boat/ship was ruled 'not a domicile' and therefore not included within the limits of the fourth ammendment. My understanding is that the CG can by current law (Section 89 of Title 14 of the United States Code) and without probable cause board and search at any time ..... and without any probable cause. Incidentally, the same also applies to state and US federal conservation and fish and game enforcement officers --- but additionally do not need a search warrant even to enter and search a private domicile !!!!!!!!!! Such laws have been in existance for almost 200 years.

My impression is that the CG was specifically brought within the bounds of the Homeland Security Department specifically because of the 'special powers' of search and seizure ALREADY vested to them by the US Supreme Court rulings iin the 1800s AND the proscriptions of the current US Code.

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/caseco...ection_89.html

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/caseco...section_2.html

[alaskadog]

Kai Nui, Thanks for the update on the seach and boarding policies by the Coast Guard in the Monterey Bay area. Yes, indeed it does make for a much scarier situation. Makes me wonder if this is a nationwide policy or a local commander with a personal crusade. Thanks for alerting us. I will keep my eyes open for our local situation here on the Gulf Coast. Maybe our branch of the "Pelican Navy" has too much else to do with all the hurricane and storm related problems. Now for the case of the hand rolled tobacco cigarette. Sure doesn't give a sailor any confidence in the general law enforcement abilities of the Coast Guard when they can't tell marijuana from tobacco. Almost any old salt I know and most school kids know the difference!!! LOL. BTW. Do you know if there is an online version of the Monterrey newspaper and would this article be in their archives. I would like to download it and spread it around to other forums and maybe send a copy of it to some congressmen. Thanks again.