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Old 01-10-2016, 06:54   #1
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Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

Hi,

I grew up sailing small boats - lasers, hobies etc., but whenever I got into a bigger boat I found myself pretty bored. Now that I'm a bit older, I'd like to get back into sailing but something a bit bigger would be more appealing to the wife. If I want to try getting into something bigger, what should I be looking at if I what I really enjoy about sailing is getting a boat over on its side and having a real go. Am I dreaming that I'll find one of those that's reasonable to sleep (but not really live) on and that won't break the bank? I live in London, UK now and long terms will be on the west coast of British Columbia Canada.

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Old 01-10-2016, 07:04   #2
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Knowsam.
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Old 01-10-2016, 07:18   #3
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

I would say any 24' to 27' boat would work. These boats turn on a dime and can be heeled over to make it more fun. I have been on 3 such boats and to me they were all pretty much the same.

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Old 01-10-2016, 07:47   #4
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

You will love bigger boats.

Pick up something that fits your aspirations. We have a friend who is cruising in a converted J-24! He got his off a racing club, made her somewhat stronger, modified some things ...

For less than 1k (plus his mods) he got himself a fine small cruiser! One happy man.

Welcome!

Cheers,
b.
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Old 01-10-2016, 10:27   #5
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

If your wife is anything like my wife getting the boat over on her side and having a go is not going to work unless she also likes racing. Hope you involve her in the decision making unless your plan is to single hand.
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Old 01-10-2016, 10:57   #6
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

Generalizing crassly - to get the kernel of truth - women like floating travel trailers, "caravans" to those from Blighty. Hot racing boats not so much. A certain atavistic tendency sets in beyond 5 of heel.

Passages are, in themselves, boring. Particularly in well-found cruising boats. The pleasures are to be found at the end of the passage.

Generalizing crassly - to get the kernel of truth - women do NOT like being wet and cold. In the "cruising season" there is little likelihood of that happening in the Straits of Georgia, or of your getting the rail under, since in the middle of the straits the wind is often zero.

For a bit of excitement stick to the 'inlets", "fjords", call them what you will, since the "inflow winds" (e.g. the "squamish") like to blow at 15, sometimes 20, in the early afternoon.

For "camper cruising" our coast is not ideal since for the most part the water is deep right in, and the stretches where you can safely beach a Wayfarer or similar are few and far between.

However, this coast has delights that no Londoner can even conceive of until he has experienced them. If you are not a hidebound dinghy sailor, then know from a Former Danish Person, a Former Brummie, and now a contended Vancouverite that good cruising boats can be bought for a song in these waters. Know also that a year's moorage for even a modest cruising boat will come to more than the acquisition cost of the boat! And "mooring out" is NOT a realistic proposition.

TrentePieds
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Old 01-10-2016, 12:20   #7
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

Buy a boat that can hull your dinghies while cruising or or in the slip!
This took me a long to realize, but it is truly one of the best reasons to have a big boat imho. This way you get the best of both worlds - big boat comforts and the thrill (or a relaxing light air sunset sail with cocktail) of a sailing dinghy at anchor or from the dock.
Current boat (for sale) was partly purchased due to her flush deck (she can hold a 11' dinghy plus a 12' sailing dinghy and kayak or paddle board).
I believe dinghies make the sailor. Get your wife on that dink and she will be able to enjoy sailing the big boat more than ever.
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Old 01-10-2016, 21:28   #8
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

Some interesting advice here so far.

My crowd of laser racers are now in their fifties and it's hard to kill the dinghy mentality, we've found out. One of them just bought a Hobie FX-1 so a couple of weeks ago we had a guys sailing weekend at the cottage for the 6 of us. We grew up racing together starting around elementary school at sailing camps, and the weekend was a blast. The cottage owner's wife doesn't really want to sail much so the cottage and the Hobie work for him. One of the other guys bought a J-109 and races it hard without the wife, and when they go for a sail he shrinks the canvas and doesn't push it. I bought the Jeanneau Javex bottle thing and raced and cruised it gently with my shorter half, and when I wanted to sail on the edge raced on other folks J-boats.

There's a variety of ways to do it, you just need to pick what will work for your circumstance.

The six of us chose very differently:

Me: cruiser racer keelboat
Friend 1- Hobie FX-1 at his cottage
2- J-109
3- small power boat for the family and a Laser for himself
4- still racing lasers, wife not a sailor
5- races a star, he and his wife sail a large dinghy gently for fun
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Old 01-10-2016, 23:54   #9
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

Look at J-boats, & anything with a sprit. AKA sport boat inspired designs. Most of them have some degree of that racing feel, especially when the breeze is up, but can also be sailed in a "civilized" manner that more women find appealing.
But then few people dislike planing downwind, as is quite possible on such boats.

You want a minimum SADR - Sail Area (to) Displacement Ratio of 25 or better (upwind sail area that is). And ULDB's Ultra Light Displacement boats tend to be much more fun, as well as sail at more civilized angles of heel.

The other option is multihulls, & no, not your average production cruising cat. Which are bloated condos with masts. Things akin to Outremers, & other lighter weight boats, or custom/semi-custom multi's tend to sail well. And retain the spirit of their progenitors. PASS on things like Lagoons.

You want a boat which when loaded has a Bruce Number of grater than 1.3. Take the square root of the sail area over the cube root of the boat's displacement (in pounds).

And get something like a PT11 or PT Spear with a sailing rig as your tender, or one of your tenders. They handle quite well, & should give you a bit of a "fix". http://ptwatercraft.com/ptwatercraft/PT11Home.html


PS: Many of the small & micro-multihulls are fun, in that they can be sailed stupid fast. But they also have decent accomidations, & can carry the family comfortably. For instance, many of Richard Woods's designs. www.sailingcatamarans.com & the demo video of his boats on youtube is quite good. Including of his designs in the 30-40' range, as well as the smaller ones
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Old 02-10-2016, 00:08   #10
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

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Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
L
But then few people dislike planing downwind, as is quite possible on such boats.
There a LOADS of people who don't like planing downwind. In fact I would say most Sunday afternoon sailors and weekend cruisers on keelboats don't. I think you're suggestions are performance heavy and might backfire on him if his partner doesn't particularly like such a choice. Choose wisely if the relationship is most important.
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Old 02-10-2016, 00:20   #11
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

My suggestions are based on him wanting a fun boat, & that it's more than possible to sail a fast boat at a sedate pace, but that the opposite is much harder (& scarier for neophytes).

The latter point being fact, not opinion. Just try surfing an older keelboat. You'll need substantial waves, & lots of wind, plus excellent helming & crew work. AKA good depth of knowledge & experience.
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Old 02-10-2016, 00:46   #12
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

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Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
My suggestions are based on him wanting a fun boat, & that it's more than possible to sail a fast boat at a sedate pace, but that the opposite is much harder (& scarier for neophytes).

The latter point being fact, not opinion. Just try surfing an older keelboat. You'll need substantial waves, & lots of wind, plus excellent helming & crew work. AKA good depth of knowledge & experience.
I'm not arguing your correct design points but simply making the point that many casual sailors do not want to plane, contrary to your suggestion, and that there is more than one way to skin a cat in terms of he and his partner enjoying sailing. Your post seems to suggest that a planing hull is what he needs, and I believe that while it and your other suggestions might in the end be the right choice(s) they also have the potential to be a relationship ending wrong one (the latter point being fact).
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Old 02-10-2016, 03:48   #13
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

If you want to sail together with your wife, let her decide what the interior of your boat shall be like. Let her make make it her own. You can then decide what the sailing related stuff should be like. Some conflicts remain. You need to find a compromise on the heeling angle of the boat, and the overall stability (heavy steady cruiser vs. light and bumpy racer). It would be good if you can learn to love steady cruising, and if your wife to enjoy some racing.
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Old 02-10-2016, 04:06   #14
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

If your good lady is of stout heart and true, then, figure out a way to make it fun for her to enjoy the aspects of sailing hard that you enjoy. That is absolutely key. At the moment it stops being fun for her, you're going where you do not want to be. Hopefully she can learn to like what you like because of its intellectual and physical challenge. If that's not where she's at, you'll lose her when you take her out and she is wet, cold, and fearful. You have been warned.

Ann

On edit, Jim used to say to me that what he told his friends was to treat their wives as if they were his best friend's wives. Turn loose of expectations and try to make it fun, keep her comfortable as possible.
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Old 02-10-2016, 05:27   #15
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Re: Hi former dinghy sailor thinking about getting back into it in a bigger boat

My take is get a nice stable boat that suits the budget, but keep a windsurfer on board. This is my way of balancing the whole comfort vs fun (speed) thing.
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