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Old 07-10-2016, 01:38   #61
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

No problem HopCar, take whatever shots you like. We could use a little levity.

We do agree on much. However, I was mainly pointing out that the majority of people are poor and don't have the options of the few. Some people, because of circumstances, must wait to make hard choices; choices that for you or I might be easy by comparison. I'm a believer in preparedness. You would laugh out loud if you saw what I carry in my van.

Listen, I was also pointing out that fuel and a few other things could be better distributed and if there are extra costs involved, they are probably offset by the benefits of having them ready. Despite the passage of time, I remember the clusterflack that was Ike. It was clear that the populace was expected to prepare, but the service, utility and retail providers, not so much. There is room for improvement everywhere.

Despite the protestations of some, I never called for more bureaucracy or social programs. Just some good old conservative capitalistic incentives to benefit all those concerned. That said, I think this horse is dead. Thanks for listening. Sorry for the frustration. Some things I have difficulty dealing with. I'll try harder.

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Care Not, (sorry that was just to easy) I gather that was sarcasm.
In fact we as a nation are probably better prepared for and quicker to respond to a disaster than anywhere else in the world. Yes we can get better but a little individual effort would go a long way to making things easier.

Instead of waiting until 12 hours before the storm hits, buy the damn can of gas 48 hours before it hits or better still buy it in June at the start of hurricane season.

House built under old building codes? Harden it. My house was built more than sixty years ago. All my windows either have shutters or have been replaced with impact resistant windows. When I replaced my roof, I specified annular ring nails. Didn't cost anymore but the roof is a lot stronger. The code now requires it.

Like you, I believe the government and private business can get better. I think that is happening.

As an example FEMA doesn't have to wait for the state to ask for help before they react to a disaster. After Andrew hit Miami our Democrat governor didn't want to ask a Republican president for help. Three days later our local disaster director went on TV and famously asked "Where is the cavalry?".
Twenty four hours later I was watching big twin rotor Navy helicopters carrying sling loads of supplies over my house. Today FEMA doesn't need to wait to be asked. The Goodyear Blimp flew over that night using its lighted sign to tell people where to go to go to get help.

Our local government encouraged grocery stores and filling stations to install generators so they could reopen quickly after a storm. If I recall they offered low cost loans to help pay for these up grades.
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Old 07-10-2016, 05:45   #62
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

I evacuated from Palm Coast Florida to Crystal River Florida. Basically from the east coast of Florida to the west coast of Florida.

I had the vehicle topped off a week earlier. But the evacuation route that we took was Rt. 1 south to Rt 11 to backed up Rt 40. Bumped to bumper stop and go traffic so we used 1/2 a tank of fuel instead of 1/4 tank...so every one was using more fuel than anticipated. The trip usually takes 1.5 hours took 5 hours.

Fuel was difficult to find in the Crystal River / Homosassa area also but the larger has stations (Race Track) had fuel.

On the west coast of Florida I was told the stores packed up water, tarps, plywood, etc and sent them via truck to their stores on the east coast.

I found my evacuation thought process interesting. I only considered areas I already knew. Columbus Ohio - too far, King George Va...too near the east coast, Crystal River Fl., humm, close and looked like it was just far enough west. So now in rainy Crystal River Fl. with a steady straight down rain as of 7:45 am Friday.

Bottom line - I am a creature of habit.







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Old 07-10-2016, 06:21   #63
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

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I am sure they did as was Homeland Security and several others. One thing I can absolutely assure you about government and that is with a certainty that it considers more government agencies a good thing.


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That's the irony about the "conservative" presidential candidate being enforced by homeland security.

From what I can see of their training center in St Augustine they rd already wasting 100 of millions and can't wait to get more.

Better get my TWIC card
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:28   #64
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

Something that surprises me is the extent of the power outages. I would have thought that the power grid would have been hardened by now.
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:33   #65
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

I live on Anastasia island and evacuated. My underatanding is they cut the power this AM to prevent electrocution to anyone that might not have left.

However, we do have mostly very vulnerable above ground lines
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:36   #66
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

The Weather Channel showed a downed power line burning as it lay in the water. It was filmed by either a journalist or an emergency responder.
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:01   #67
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

National Data Buoy Center for ocean buoy data. I've noticed this in other storms as well. Even buoys directly in the path of the storm do not show hurricane force winds at any time during their passing. Anyone know why this might be?
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:08   #68
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

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I realize that this may come as a surprise to many of you, but there was a lot of uncertainty about the track of this storm.
Sorry to disagree. This storm was very well tracked with little to no uncertainty a week out.
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:15   #69
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

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Something that surprises me is the extent of the power outages. I would have thaught that the power grid would have been hardened by now.
You raise a very good point. The reality is the Florida counties have done little to nothing in hardening the power grid. They are more interested in spending their money on union based government positions that they are assured of getting votes from.

Scratch under the surface of Florida's municipal finances and you find a scandalous reality of un funded pensions and miss directed political based spending that makes things look good on the surface but in reality its a financial mess. This goes to explain in part why the power grid in Florida hasn't been hardened. Shame not many people out there ask such basic questions.
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:45   #70
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

ok so navy sent ship to bahamas, spozed to be one for fla.
jax had looters breaking in doors last evening.
gov of fla declared state of emergency before storm hit..gooood boy, so help can be effected more rapidly.
power still unreliable in jax as they have yet to be finished with storm
yes it is spozed to circle around and hit miami again- spozedly as a td
it aint over til it is over.
hang tough kids.



oh yes to feed the trolls---h ah ah aha h a all furycames are conspiratorial mayhem, unleashed by the govt to control population. they are stored in the basement of the white house, and were thee ONLY things hitlery did not steal when she moved out last time. ha ha ha ha h a. she is now afraid trump will unleash em liberally on dnc h ah ah ah ah ah a
h aha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha h h i have read so many sillinesses i figured i could add to it without anyone taking it literally .
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:54   #71
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

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You raise a very good point. The reality is the Florida counties have done little to nothing in hardening the power grid. They are more interested in spending their money on union based government positions that they are assured of getting votes from.

Scratch under the surface of Florida's municipal finances and you find a scandalous reality of un funded pensions and miss directed political based spending that makes things look good on the surface but in reality its a financial mess. This goes to explain in part why the power grid in Florida hasn't been hardened. Shame not many people out there ask such basic questions.
There are few if any union jobs in most Florida counties. Teachers are unionized but not allowed to strike under state law. Pretty much the fire fighters which get a pass as "heroes" from the right to work freaks are the only large powerful union.
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Old 07-10-2016, 09:54   #72
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

Actually the power grid has been hardened greatly since Andrew hit South Florida. Florida Power and Light has been systematically replacing wooden poles with concrete poles. During a hurricane lots of wooden poles break and have to be replaced before the wires can be restrung. The concrete poles usually survive making it much easier to replace the wire and get power back quickly.

They are also much better at tracking where power is out. A few years ago they switched to remote read meters. They can check the meters to see if they are receiving power.
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Old 07-10-2016, 10:07   #73
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

Care Knot, I think you and I are much alike.
I'll try to sum up our conversation.

Your point was that the supply system could do a better job of getting supplies where they are needed prior to a hurricane.

As part of that supply system, I was saying we already do a pretty good job and it would be better for everyone if people would prepare ahead of time.

Is that a fair summation?
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Old 07-10-2016, 10:18   #74
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

Earlier this week a Home Depot sold several acres of plywood. The storm passed us by. Now where the heck does all that plywood go? Next time a storm comes, they'll sell another several acres of plywood?
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Old 07-10-2016, 10:34   #75
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Re: Good Grief, Cat. 5 Hurricane

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Actually the power grid has been hardened greatly since Andrew hit South Florida. Florida Power and Light has been systematically replacing wooden poles with concrete poles. During a hurricane lots of wooden poles break and have to be replaced before the wires can be restrung. The concrete poles usually survive making it much easier to replace the wire and get power back quickly.

They are also much better at tracking where power is out. A few years ago they switched to remote read meters. They can check the meters to see if they are receiving power.
Florida Power and Light (FPL) has invested $2 Billion in upgrades to their system since 2006 (saw on news this morning).

It's always a fine line on upgrading utilities, roads, bridges, etc -vs- raising taxes , fuel prices, utility rates etc to pay for upgrades. No matter what you do you are not going to please everyone so you try to at least make the majority happy.

So far only one reported Matthew related death in Fl, which is one too many but all in all the infrastructure and training put in place worked.
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