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Old 14-09-2015, 17:42   #31
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

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Originally Posted by barnakiel View Post
Indeed. Vide International Sailing Canoe.

http://www.intcanoe.org.uk/images/stories/dscf0313.jpg

BTW sweet boat in your avatar, what is she?

b.
That's a pic of our Scout the last time we hauled.

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Old 14-09-2015, 17:49   #32
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

Find one of these. Better than a canoe...not much, but at least a sailboat.

Snark Sailboat
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Old 14-09-2015, 20:45   #33
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

IMHO... one needn't choose a single path to sailing or messing about in boats. The clubs are a good source of cheap sailing. Crewing on a PHRF/beercan racing boat is good practice and education. I owned a windsurf board. I also shared a daysailer/camper 22ft Catalina with two other partners.

I also built the 15ft six hour canoe (with my then teenage daughter) and later cut it down to be an 8ft with a transom bow and stern. I built a ~7ft D4 Dinghy. I purchased a $20 used windsurf board sail from our local board shop Gorge Performance for the D4. The cut of the windsurf sail foot minimized ducking while tacking.

As a boy/teen, my friend and I built a few (mostly unsafe) water craft. remnants of those boats may survive in the bottom of Idaho Lakes and Rivers.

So I say do whatever floats your boat.
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Old 15-09-2015, 00:02   #34
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

I don't know where you live, but middle TN is either Nashville or Knoxville area. Here are some boats for sale as an example in your backyard:
Here is a Sunfish with the asking price of $1000 https://knoxville.craigslist.org/boa/5190770548.html
And here is a Bartlett at $350 https://knoxville.craigslist.org/boa/5219156448.html
and here is a $200 Sunfish https://greenville.craigslist.org/boa/5221435668.html
http://images.craigslist.org/01515_9...Mw_600x450.jpg
and there are more.

Unless I missed something in your post, you were looking to learn to sail, and find something affordable. To make a boat you will end up spending more money and not something that is as light nor as fun. A small dingy sailing boat teaches all the fundamentals of sailing with the benefit of immediate feedback. Many sailors who have sailed all their lives, remember fondly sailing as a young (or adult) laser or sunfish etc and with some great stories.
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Old 15-09-2015, 03:40   #35
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

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I'm in a similar situation in the same area. I found the "Percy Priest Yacht Club" that has sailing lessons. The membership is $160 a year. With the membership and a basic course under your belt , you can "sign out" one of the clubs boats to use.
This is one of the cheaper ways I have seen and I may do it myself in 2016.
Here is the link. Home - Percy Priest Yacht Club
I sent them few emails awhile back but never heard back from them at the time. Will probably try to get more information from them for next season. Having the other knee replacement done tomorrow so this year is out.


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Old 15-09-2015, 04:58   #36
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

What you learn sailing a canoe will be very limited, far better to go with at least a small sailing dinghy. Plus if you are keen on diying a rig you get more chance of building something that works.

In both cases a life jacket will be essential!

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Old 15-09-2015, 05:09   #37
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

What about a PT11? You can row it or sail it, it doesn't weigh much and be a nesting boat or a full hull. You can use it as your dink later on?


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Old 15-09-2015, 06:23   #38
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

canoes don't sink like stones for ..... sake. I used th Red Cross Canoe book for the lateen sailing and used it for years. it was possible to have 2 160 lb. guys sitting on the gunnels and when it blows on Glenmore Dam in Calgary it can REALLY blow. NOT ONCE did we flip the canoe--and we steered using a paddlr to boot. For a more flexible rig that includes oars abd a sail mounted on a tripod that you tie in place Google Sam Manninings article "Sticks and String" He uses his leeboard as a rudder and it works great. Thats how I learned how to sail and my current boat is a 36 mono. Whatever gets you stared but peoples suggestion for other boats all have merit based on comfort, athletic ability--- a canoe does fit on the roof.
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Old 15-09-2015, 08:45   #39
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swammy View Post
I don't know where you live, but middle TN is either Nashville or Knoxville area. Here are some boats for sale as an example in your backyard:
Here is a Sunfish with the asking price of $1000 https://knoxville.craigslist.org/boa/5190770548.html
And here is a Bartlett at $350 https://knoxville.craigslist.org/boa/5219156448.html
and here is a $200 Sunfish https://greenville.craigslist.org/boa/5221435668.html
http://images.craigslist.org/01515_9...Mw_600x450.jpg
and there are more.

Unless I missed something in your post, you were looking to learn to sail, and find something affordable. To make a boat you will end up spending more money and not something that is as light nor as fun. A small dingy sailing boat teaches all the fundamentals of sailing with the benefit of immediate feedback. Many sailors who have sailed all their lives, remember fondly sailing as a young (or adult) laser or sunfish etc and with some great stories.
I live in Columbia Tennessee now southwest of Nashville. The main lake I will be using is a small 63 acre lake till I know my way around a sail. I was not going to build a boat, just build the sailing rig for the canoe as well as the outriggers. Most of the cost in building it myself is in the cost of the expanding closed cell foam flotation. Was going to use 5 cubic feet in each outrigger mold and the other two cubic feet that was left over to add more flotation the the canoe itself not counting the spontoons. The canoe is rated for 800 lbs, with a total of 12 cubic feet of flotation at 62.4 lbs of flotation per cubic foot would give me almost 750 lbs of flotation plus the flotation built into the canoe and the spontoons. Yes I can buy a premade deluxe sail kit from sailboats to go for $1099.00 plus tax and shipping but I could buy metal electrical tubing in ten feet lengths with the highest costing a little over $16 for a 2" tube. I'll think more on what everyone is saying while recovering from surgery tomorrow. Thanks all of you.


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Old 15-09-2015, 09:52   #40
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

You will be down a bit with your knee. Relax. The dingy will be there after you recover. Good luck and get the block
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Old 15-09-2015, 12:53   #41
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

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You will be down a bit with your knee. Relax. The dingy will be there after you recover. Good luck and get the block
Thanks

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Old 15-09-2015, 13:26   #42
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

Broken,

One of the issue with adding amas to a canoe is that they are very likely to be ripped out of the boat due to the forces involved. Trimaran cross beams take enormous loads even on small light boats, and as far as I know there is no good way to reinforce a canoe hull to be strong enough to handle these loads.

Just some rough numbers... 5 cubic feet of foam for instance weighs about 300lbs, which isn't too much. but put them on 5' amas and the torque involved is 1500ft-lbs. More than enough to rip apart make shift fittings. Secondly the floats need to be very stiff and light to perform blocks of foam won't cut it, you need an external shell with engineered attachment fittings both to carry the load, and to provide the stiffness.

At best what you are envisioning is going to work poorly, cause a lot of grief, and break regularly. Worst case it will rip apart in the middle of the lake and leave you stranded. A lot of us have been where you are and tried things like this. But they really don't work very well. Start will a small light sailboat like a laser, or sunfish, or any of the hundreds of other small boats available for almost nothing, and work from there.

Or as mentioned join one of the sailing clubs nearby. Not only do many of them have boats available cheap, they are also a source of good information on cheap boats for sale, and people who can help the learning curve.
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Old 15-09-2015, 19:56   #43
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

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Broken,

One of the issue with adding amas to a canoe is that they are very likely to be ripped out of the boat due to the forces involved. Trimaran cross beams take enormous loads even on small light boats, and as far as I know there is no good way to reinforce a canoe hull to be strong enough to handle these loads.

Just some rough numbers... 5 cubic feet of foam for instance weighs about 300lbs, which isn't too much. but put them on 5' amas and the torque involved is 1500ft-lbs. More than enough to rip apart make shift fittings. Secondly the floats need to be very stiff and light to perform blocks of foam won't cut it, you need an external shell with engineered attachment fittings both to carry the load, and to provide the stiffness.

At best what you are envisioning is going to work poorly, cause a lot of grief, and break regularly. Worst case it will rip apart in the middle of the lake and leave you stranded. A lot of us have been where you are and tried things like this. But they really don't work very well. Start will a small light sailboat like a laser, or sunfish, or any of the hundreds of other small boats available for almost nothing, and work from there.

Or as mentioned join one of the sailing clubs nearby. Not only do many of them have boats available cheap, they are also a source of good information on cheap boats for sale, and people who can help the learning curve.
According to the company's website if I was not reading the description right the expanding foam I was going to use weighs 2# per cubic foot. It also comes in 4# & 8# per cubic foot but the 8# is not for flotation.

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Old 15-09-2015, 20:15   #44
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stumble View Post
Broken,

One of the issue with adding amas to a canoe is that they are very likely to be ripped out of the boat due to the forces involved. Trimaran cross beams take enormous loads even on small light boats, and as far as I know there is no good way to reinforce a canoe hull to be strong enough to handle these loads.

Just some rough numbers... 5 cubic feet of foam for instance weighs about 300lbs, which isn't too much. but put them on 5' amas and the torque involved is 1500ft-lbs. More than enough to rip apart make shift fittings. Secondly the floats need to be very stiff and light to perform blocks of foam won't cut it, you need an external shell with engineered attachment fittings both to carry the load, and to provide the stiffness.

At best what you are envisioning is going to work poorly, cause a lot of grief, and break regularly. Worst case it will rip apart in the middle of the lake and leave you stranded. A lot of us have been where you are and tried things like this. But they really don't work very well. Start will a small light sailboat like a laser, or sunfish, or any of the hundreds of other small boats available for almost nothing, and work from there.

Or as mentioned join one of the sailing clubs nearby. Not only do many of them have boats available cheap, they are also a source of good information on cheap boats for sale, and people who can help the learning curve.
Foam doesn't "weigh" 60 lbs per cubic foot (more like 2.5-3#) but it provides about 60+ lb of "floatation."
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Old 15-09-2015, 21:03   #45
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Re: Getting started sailing cheaply.

G'Day Broken,

I'm in the "buy some sort of 12-16 foot daysailing dinghy " fold, but ya gotta do what looks best to you.

The big thing is good luck with the knee. You know by now that recovery is not so easy, but in time and with a lot of PT you will be sailable again. just today, my wife (Ann T Cate), complete with two TKRs plus two revisions managed the hike to the top of Cap Ndua on the southern lagoon of New Caledonia. A couple of Ks each way, bad footing, and over 700 feet up from sea level. She's hurting a bit now, but she made it to the top and we had stupendous views out over the lagoon, clear to Ile des Pins, 35 miles away!
And of course we sailed here from Australia... yep, there is sailing after knee replacement!

I hope that your surgery and recovery go well, mate.

Jim
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