Father and his kids missing at sea

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by ka4wja

I specifically decided to NOT post to this thread as I didn't wish to be involved in the inevitable rehash of "what might have happened", etc...
BUT...

But, I see so many posting small snippets of info about EPIRB's, PLB's, etc. (and even VHF-DSC radio), and some have provided good info (Dockhead and Noelex77)....although, some of the other info is inaccurate!

So, I thought I would point all of you to the COSPAS-SARSAT details?? As well as info on the excellent VHF coverage of the USCG in this area...
Or, at least, have a look at this recent thread right here, where you will see all of the COSPAS-SARSAT links, as well as plenty of details/explanation of all of this, intended for use by layperson-sailors!!

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ds-146617.html


For those unaware, the USCG has excellent VHF coverage / VHF-DSC coverage over the entire US Coastline....
This is designed (and works) for a useable range of 20nm offshore, for a 1 watt handheld transmitter, with its antenna at 2 meters above the sea...being able to detect and DF a signal of only one second in duration!

In practice, this works very well....and for those with 25-watt radios and/or masthead-mounted antennas, the range can reliably be 40 - 60nm, everyday 24/7/365...
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/?pageName=mtNds

Here are those coverage areas for Florida....remember this is for a 1-watt handheld, with antenna at 2 meters above the water...
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/images/ma.../SecStPete.jpg



Rustic, I mean NO offense at all!!
REALLY, I don't!!
It's just that your post stood out in my mind, 'cause it shows a common misunderstanding....and please note that many of the various governments' websites, etc. actually propagate this misunderstanding!

A modern EPIRB and/or PLB ("406mhz EPIRB" or "406mhz PLB") transmits short bursts of data on 406mhz to both LEOSAR and GEOSAR satellites....not a continuous encoded radio signal....(hence the reason for the 121.5mhz "homing signal")
{And, remember the "GPS coordinates" that everyone is assuming can be picked up so easily, actually cannot be picked-up that easily!!
These are ONLY received by the GEOSAR satellites and you must have your EPIRB in the clear / unobstructed at all times, for these signals to get thru....(and PLB's make this even harder!)
The primary position fix from EPIRB or PLB deployment is from the LEOSAR satellites, where this is just a Doppler-fix....and is only a general/approximate location, which could be many dozens, or hundreds, of miles away!!}
It also transmits a very low-power (25mw to 50mw) 121.5mhz homing signal, continuously....

EPIRB's will send these signals until the battery runs out....minimum time spec is 48hrs, in damn cold water, at "end-of-certified life" for the battery...
PLB's have other specs, but most will do the same as EPIRB's up to 24 hours...
Please see the referenced thread....
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ds-146617.html

And, Dockhead's post here...
I do hope the above referenced thread ( http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ds-146617.html ) helps some here sort out what EPIRB's, what the COSPAS-SARSAT system is, etc., and most importantly how best to use/deploy an EPIRB!!


Fair winds..

John

P.S. I hope you all don't mind, but I will be unsubscribing from this thread....I will check back from time-to-time, but I haven't the time to read all of the posts, etc...(I'm only up to post #324, out-of 430!)
But, if you have questions for me about EPIRB's, PLB's, VHF-DSC Radio (or MF/HF-DSC radio), etc., please post those in the other threads, and I'll do what I can to help...
Fair winds...
John

No offence taken at all as I indicated, I wasn't sure about the PLB's. But others corrected it.

[FSMike]

Originally Posted by svHyLyte

----- Weather events in South Florida at this time of year are too topical to make any judgements unless you speak of the weather within you line of sight.
-----

Unfortunately all too true.
We had two people standing on the beach here last week (Daytona Beach) in water up to their ankles. The weather was gorgeous, no storm/rain/etc.
They were struck by lightning. One of them died.

The only way to know what the conditions were in the area of that poor family's boat is to have been aboard it at the time.

[TurninTurtle]

We just had a good example right in my back yard of localized severe weather...

General area mild rain.

Suddenly I looked out and the wind was making circles around my house lifting things up....

Tore a roof off a block over (took a lot of tree limbs on the way) and knocked out a few telephone poles.

If that had hit a sailboat it would have been kindling.

[tuffr2]

Very sad that they got blown further out into the GOM and not closer to shore where it would be easier to find them. Weekend boat activity along the coast probably could have found them...but not 30 - 40 miles out.

On land it is difficult not to be found...but in the ocean it is much easier.



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[AD28]

Interesting article on what happened early in the morning of their departure

FTA: "The Sarasota Police Department investigated a complaint from Ace Kimberly hours before he and his three children departed Sunday, June 19. Police met with Kimberly at about 4:52 a.m. at 5 Bayfront Drive regarding a dispute.

According to police, Kimberly said he was upset because his daughter Rebbacca was on a boat with a 21-year-old man. Rebbacca told police she was just hanging out with a friend and that nothing happened, the report said."


Few leads in case of Sarasota family lost at sea | HeraldTribune.com

[a64pilot]

I guess maybe that may have contributed in his decision to leave?

[Cadence]

Originally Posted by AD28

Interesting article on what happened early in the morning of their departure

FTA: "The Sarasota Police Department investigated a complaint from Ace Kimberly hours before he and his three children departed Sunday, June 19. Police met with Kimberly at about 4:52 a.m. at 5 Bayfront Drive regarding a dispute.

According to police, Kimberly said he was upset because his daughter Rebbacca was on a boat with a 21-year-old man. Rebbacca told police she was just hanging out with a friend and that nothing happened, the report said."


Few leads in case of Sarasota family lost at sea | HeraldTribune.com

Thanks for the info.. Doubt we will ever know. Questionable about that far off shore for a short hop along the coast?

[Hardhead]

I responded to this thread earlier, and wanted to post the following link I just came across.

I will admit, reading this extended article really seemed to change my impression of the situation, and how completely, devastatingly, tragic the whole thing is. I sometimes fall into the trap of judging things I really know very little about.


2nd body recovered, search for missing family continues | HeraldTribune.com

[tuffr2]

How deep is the water 37 miles out? Just north of there 37 miles equal 37 feet. Just wondering.

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[ThomasWeiss]

Off of Sarasota it's charted as 20-25 fathoms so 120 to 150 feet 37nm out. Why do you ask?



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[tuffr2]

Wow...that is shallow water. Maybe someday some one will find something.

Just asking because if the boat did sink in a few thosand feet of water I would say zero chance of ever finding anything. Now in just 25' ish of water the chance of someone eventually finding something (I think) is better. Especially with all the recreational 4th of July boating.

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[ThomasWeiss]

It's not feet (as I said in my first post) but rather fathoms which equal out to 6 feet per. I don't mean to sound pessimistic but I don't believe recreational boaters will find a mast; chances are it broke off before, during, or after the boat sunk. Not to mention we don't know where the boat was before she went down and it's very possible it was blown further offshore which would put it her down in deeper water yet.


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[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by tuffr2

Wow...that is shallow water. Maybe someday some one will find something.

Just asking because if the boat did sink in a few thosand feet of water I would say zero chance of ever finding anything. Now in just 25' ish of water the chance of someone eventually finding something (I think) is better. Especially with all the recreational 4th of July boating.

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Finding the boat is pretty much irrelevant now. sad, but it won't bring the family back.

[svHyLyte]

In re: the earlier discussion about requiring EPIRB's, see New EPIRB law in effect in aftermath of teens lost at sea. This, Florida, law does not mandate EPIRB's but does reduce registration fees if one is aboard.

FWIW...

[Rustic Charm]

Originally Posted by svHyLyte

In re: the earlier discussion about requiring EPIRB's, see New EPIRB law in effect in aftermath of teens lost at sea. This, Florida, law does not mandate EPIRB's but does reduce registration fees if one is aboard.

FWIW...

Well, that's one way to encourage people to carry an epirb and not get all suspicious of big brother.. I like this idea. Though I suspect if someone doesn't have an 'epirb' because they can't afford one, then cheaper yearly rego is hardly going to make a difference.