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Old 11-08-2012, 11:40   #16
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Re: Farallones Accident/Fatalities - Final Report

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Hemingway was a drunk and an a-hole.
And yet he never killed any of his boat passengers.
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Old 03-09-2012, 07:30   #17
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Report on Farallones Tragedy

After reading the article in Latitudes, I decided to read the full report that reviewed the loss of life in the Farallones tragedy that was done by US Sailing the report is available at http://media.ussailing.org/AssetFactory.aspx?vid=18654

The full report has something that I believe everyone can learn from. The biggest is that inflatable PFDs will not support someone who is severely injured or unconscious without a crotch strap!!

The full report with attachments and enlightening interviews with the survivors runs over 80 pages. The narrative is only about 20 pages, but it will replace armchair conjecture and hearsay with some interesting firsthand facts.


Bill
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Old 03-09-2012, 10:36   #18
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Re: Report on Farallones Tragedy

Bill

There was already a very long sting on this subject, including the US Sailing Report of the incident under USCG Suspends Race
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Old 03-09-2012, 11:04   #19
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Farallones Accident/Fatalities - Final Report
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Old 03-09-2012, 12:20   #20
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Re: Report on Farallones Tragedy

" The biggest is that inflatable PFDs will not support someone who is severely injured or unconscious without a crotch strap!!"

Bill, I'd say you misread that. The old news is that NO PFD will do a proper job without a crotch strap. Yes, the Type1's are most likely to float you face up, but without a crotch strap? They can float up over your head and get lost anyway.
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Old 03-09-2012, 15:53   #21
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Actually, a Lotus kayaking PFD (firm is now out of business) will support an injured person. I have had the misfortune of tearing a rotator cuff while kayak surfing. The helmet protected me when the kayak caught the next wave and the PFD allowed me to swim with limited use of my right arm. Another time I got caught in nasty weather about a mile off in The Gulf. Long story short, I got nailed by a rogue, could not execute a roll, and could not renter. Both times when I needed the PFD to save me, I rolled on my back, cinched the side straps so they caught me under my lowest rib, and the PFD worked fine. I still carry that one on Cynosure. Good luck charm?

But I will agree that both the two inflatables I purchased as well as the standard PFDs I would ride up. Needless to say I will be buying crotch straps for all....... Okay guys you can now let the jokes fly!!

Missed the other thread..., I will be reading that also to further my education.

Thanks

Bill


Edit... Found the thread. It occurred 2 months before the US Sailing report. My analytical side likes to read third party reports.
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Old 03-09-2012, 16:00   #22
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Re: Report on Farallones Tragedy

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Originally Posted by Snore View Post
Actually, a Lotus kayaking PFD (firm is now out of business) will support an injured person. I have had the misfortune of tearing a rotator cuff while kayak surfing. The helmet protected me when the kayak caught the next wave and the PFD allowed me to swim with limited use of my right arm. Another time I got caught in nasty weather about a mile off in The Gulf. Long story short, I got nailed by a rogue, could not execute a roll, and could not renter. Both times when I needed the PFD to save me, I rolled on my back, cinched the side straps so they caught me under my lowest rib, and the PFD worked fine. I still carry that one on Cynosure. Good luck charm?

But I will agree that both the two inflatables I purchased as well as the standard PFDs I would ride up. Needless to say I will be buying crotch straps for all....... Okay guys you can now let the jokes fly!!

Missed the other thread..., I will be reading that also to further my education.

Thanks

Bill


Edit... Found the thread. It occurred 2 months before the US Sailing report. My analytical side likes to read third party reports.

You can buy them? I want them on every PFD on my boat!
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Old 03-09-2012, 16:03   #23
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Chuteman my bad ? Just saw this one.

Raku yes WM sells generics. I bought one. I believe that Mustang sells them as an option.
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Old 03-09-2012, 16:28   #24
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Re: Report on Farallones Tragedy

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Chuteman my bad ? Just saw this one.

Raku yes WM sells generics. I bought one. I believe that Mustang sells them as an option.

Thanks.
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Old 03-09-2012, 17:08   #25
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Re: Report on Farallones Tragedy

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Chuteman my bad ? Just saw this one.
NO worries - just added in case anyone had missed earlier comments
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Old 03-09-2012, 17:18   #26
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Re: Report on Farallones Tragedy

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I believe that Mustang sells them as an option.
Yes they do.

Leg Strap Accessory MA3032

Mine was on back order for some time, but it arrived just after I got home from the Lahaina - Vancouver adventure.

The Vic Maui race required them.

The one for the Spinlock works well.

BTW - The report on the sinking of the OUZO has a good discussion of the needs for crotch straps. http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources...ile=/Ouzo_.pdf

When one of the crew members in the 2010 Southern Straits race came out of his harness during a MOB rescue, it engendered a major discussion on SA. Prior to that Mustang had emailed that a strap was not necessary, after that race they were back on the market.
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Old 03-09-2012, 17:24   #27
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Re: Farallones Accident/Fatalities - Final Report

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You may live for an hour in water that cold but you'll be unable to do anything to save yourself within 15 minutes. From personal experience, you lose all feeling in your extremities in less than 10 minutes. The extremities shut down to save core temperature. At that point, you'll have to be saved, not save yourself. The boat was tossed up on the rocks in pretty good condition. If the crew had been able to stay or get back on board, they all would have survived.
Check out Cold Water Boot Camp for some excellent research on hypothermia. PFDs make a huge difference.
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Old 03-09-2012, 18:35   #28
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Re: Farallones Accident/Fatalities - Final Report

Azul, thanks for the link.
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Old 03-09-2012, 19:26   #29
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Re: Farallones Accident/Fatalities - Final Report

"Hemingway wrote the only true sports are mountain climbing, car racing and bullfighting... all others are just hobbies."

I'll have to look this up. Seems like a dumb thing to say.
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Old 03-09-2012, 19:45   #30
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Re: Farallones Accident/Fatalities - Final Report

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My goal is to stay aboard so that is where I place my focus.
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If the crew had been able to stay or get back on board, they all would have survived.
I agree with both of these. If they had tethered up when they encountered the first unusually steep wave, AND the tether system kept them on deck, they would (probably) have all survived.

The question of a tether system that will actually keep people on deck is an interesting design problem. Most jackline systems with 2m tethers will in fact not do it. They will allow people to go over the side even when tethered. I personally prefer clipping to hard points (payeyes or spectra strops) using a quite short tether, rather than the more typical system.

This is a cruising forum, so it's not so relevant here, but the other very interesting/challenging problem was the risk trade-off between trying to shorten the distance about the mark (the island) vs trying to stay out in a prudent depth of water for the conditions. It was very obvious looking at historical tracks that some people were comfortable with taking much more risk than others. That poses an interesting race course management problem.
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